Podein25 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Oh, and your new avatar blows. I couldn't bring myself to tell Jack - the truth hurts and I didn't want to hurt his feelings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 @Podein25 Well I couldn't tell him face to face. I couldn't bear to see Jack cry (and sic his dog on me) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDevil Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I think we're already there. Any notion that someone can compare a player in today's game with a player from 25 years ago is pure fantasy. It's not the same league in any respect. The NHL has changed everything except the size of the nets.Comparing players by era is always difficult. Different amounts of teams, different talent pool, different rules, different coaching, etc. Why do we have to hold up the early 90's as the way hockey should be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 @flyercanuck @Podein25 - my new avatar is awesome. You WISH you had an avatar as kewl as mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 as kewl as If you start speaking in the Third person. I'm gonna report your ass - for realz! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 @JackStraw I was thinking a pirate flag with P.Diddy on it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 If you start speaking in the Third person. I'm gonna report your ass - for realz! If I start speaking in the third person I'll report myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 @JackStraw I was thinking a pirate flag with P.Diddy on it... Go for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I say... Widen the nets 4 inches, and raise the crossbar 4 inches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I say... Widen the nets 4 inches, and raise the crossbar 4 inches. Sure, easy for you to say, except you won't be able to call it the ol' 4-by-6 any more! It'll now be the ol' 4 feet, 4 inches by 6 feet, 4 inches. Think of the play-by-play guys for once will ya! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I would call it "adjusting the difficulty of scoring goals to levels seen in the early 1990's". i don't know if you noticed, but there are currently multiple players on pace for 115+ points right now. so. to my mind, the biggest change in the difficulty in scoring goals has nothing to do with the size of goalie's or their gear. it's that 3/4 of the league in 1990 were terrible hockey players. they smoked during intermissions. they showed up to camp after a summer of doing nothing, and the two weeks were the only thing getting them in game shape. you had a small handful of hugely gifted players who took their game seriously, and they dominated. that doesn't happen anymore, every player in the NHL is elite, and they all take it seriously year round. here, a mario highlight video. don't watch mario, watch all of the other players. look at the complete lack of defensive cohesion. the players just gliding around. the lazy passes. the goalies that can't skate. it's even worse the further back you go, look at a gretzky video and it's just amazing all of those players called themselves NHL players. until the mid-90's the game was all about raw talent. there was little in the way of developed technique, the best natural players were the best players, period. these days, after kids go through a decade and a half of intense structured youth instruction, and then very clipboard-and-video juniors, and finally professionals that are bettering their bodies and their games year round, the game is entirely different. now, raw talent gives you an advantage, but it alone isn't enough. a less talented but harder working player has every likelyhood of out producing the guy who tries to float on his natural abilities. scoring is down because the ability level across the league is miles higher and far better distributed than it was 20+ years ago. if you want to fake it and make the scoreboards look like they did in 1989, then i guess you could make the nets bigger. i seriously question the "fan" that feels like it is a better hockey game just because there are bigger numbers on the board, though. if you want to artificially inflate scoring, that can be done, but why would you want to do that? would you like the game better if maybe all goals counted for two points? we'd double scoring right there. but why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Sure, easy for you to say, except you won't be able to call it the ol' 4-by-6 any more! It'll now be the ol' 4 feet, 4 inches by 6 feet, 4 inches. Think of the play-by-play guys for once will ya! good point then make it a 6'4 x 4'6 net. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 6'4 x 4'6 net Again, easy for you to say. A full 6" wider? Do you want Frosted Tips to score 60 goals?!?!?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Again, easy for you to say. A full 6" wider? Do you want Frosted Tips to score 60 goals?!?!?! We know someone who just celebrated a birthday who'd love that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 Comparing players by era is always difficult. Different amounts of teams, different talent pool, different rules, different coaching, etc. Why do we have to hold up the early 90's as the way hockey should be? I agree, but I think the scoring level in the early 1990's was awesome. It's hard to describe to fans that didn't live through that era, but the best way I can describe it is as follows: Today: You never think anyone is going to score (even on a breakaway) until they actually score. Then you're actually surprised that they managed to score. 1990's: You knew someone had a great chance to score, and that they were probably going to score, before it happened. You were surprised if the goalie could stop it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 Again, easy for you to say. A full 6" wider? Do you want Frosted Tips to score 60 goals?!?!?! Quote, I was thinking about that, lol. what if these changes were made a few years earlier... ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted November 9, 2015 Author Share Posted November 9, 2015 to my mind, the biggest change in the difficulty in scoring goals has nothing to do with the size of goalie's or their gear. it's that 3/4 of the league in 1990 were terrible hockey players. they smoked during intermissions. they showed up to camp after a summer of doing nothing, and the two weeks were the only thing getting them in game shape. you had a small handful of hugely gifted players who took their game seriously, and they dominated. that doesn't happen anymore, every player in the NHL is elite, and they all take it seriously year round. That's an excellent point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDevil Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 I don't think the size of the goal is really the problem anyway. The majority of NHL coaches always talk about structure and being responsible in your own end, etc. Teams are better trained to clog shooting lanes, take away passing lanes, and block shots. Does anybody think making the nets bigger is suddenly going to make coaches go "defense be damned!" and stop preaching structure and good defensive play?The game is always evolving. I don't see why we have to make rules just to get back to an era of hockey that, quite frankly, isn't going to be reproduced anyway. Goalies weren't nearly as technical as they are now, players weren't as trained to play defense, coaches weren't as worried about structure, etc. Unless you somehow turn back the clock on all of those things, making the nets wider just feels like a cheap way to prop up point totals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPuk Posted November 9, 2015 Share Posted November 9, 2015 You guys are aware that the bigger nets have to be used by both sides right?? Not just your opposition?? Right?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 Making the nets larger is going to lead to more goals no matter what. Teams can't block any more shots than they're already blocking. They can't play any better defence than they're already playing. Finally, goalies can't stop any more pucks than they're already stopping. The end result of larger nets is simply more goals on less shots. It would lower the save percentage of goalies back to levels that fans of my generation are accustomed to seeing. Forwards would be able to score 60 and 70 goals in a season again, along with 130+ points. A typical game would be 5-3 instead of 2-1. That's all we're talking about here. It may even bring back goals on the rush, and put the terror back into breakaways again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDevil Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 The problem is you're assuming the hockey your generation is used to is better and that everybody should want the same. It sounds very much like old people complaining about the younger generation, going "back in my day...". The game is always changing, and I'm sure there will be an uptick in goals at some point. Right now we're clearly in a more defensive era. That doesn't mean that the game is always going to stay there.One thing I do think could be changed is the goalie equipment. I'm tired of the whole "goalies need all that padding for protection" argument. What the hell are they doing, diffusing a bomb? Being shot at by actual snipers? We can send humans to space, but we can't come up with smaller equipment that provides just as much protection? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 Again, easy for you to say. A full 6" wider? Do you want Frosted Tips to score 60 goals?!?!?! Who is Frosted Tips by the way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted November 10, 2015 Author Share Posted November 10, 2015 The problem is you're assuming the hockey your generation is used to is better and that everybody should want the same. It sounds very much like old people complaining about the younger generation, going "back in my day...".The game is always changing, and I'm sure there will be an uptick in goals at some point. Right now we're clearly in a more defensive era. That doesn't mean that the game is always going to stay there.One thing I do think could be changed is the goalie equipment. I'm tired of the whole "goalies need all that padding for protection" argument. What the hell are they doing, diffusing a bomb? Being shot at by actual snipers? We can send humans to space, but we can't come up with smaller equipment that provides just as much protection? Also an excellent point. Would you say that the younger generation basically accepts the game the way it is and doesn't crave any additional scoring? From what I've seen, and correct me if I'm wrong, I don't see any way that scoring can ever increase again unless the league does something with the nets. Ever since goalies became great skating goliaths that properly cut down angles, the only way to get more goals is to either throw defensive play out the window by sending everyone in and just swarming the net, or to have goalies wear protective equipment that is no larger than today's skaters in order to create some openings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Who is Frosted Tips by the way? Jeff Carter Crater Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 10, 2015 Share Posted November 10, 2015 Who is Frosted Tips by the way? It's one of the great all-time nicknames that I cannot take credit for. This Board may be able to take credit for it though. Or these guys, who I can only barely tolerate. You might find some of it funny. I do. Some of it at least. My advice don't read the comments: http://www.crossingbroad.com/tag/jeff-carter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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