2021 Training Camp and "new team"

[MaineFlyFan]

Too soon? I'm just really excited to see how this all plays out this year.

 

When does camp even start? I know I have a pre-season game in Boston on the 30th so gotta be soonish.

 

I must say, even though I go into every season with a "glass half full" mind frame (and it usually only takes weeks for said glass to be knocked over by the Flyers), My glass is like 3/4 full this year! Here's why! (for what's its worth...I'm no expert!)

 

1) Carter Hart: Yup, this is the year! BIG upgrade in defense in front of him and a fresh new contract and sheet of ice in front of him. You don't think this kid is ready to roll this season?! He's had a couple years in the big leagues now to both experience some success, but also some adversity. Goalies take longer to mature and really turn pro right? So here it is. This is the year! I hope I'm right! (Now of course, the question is Martin Jones...I have NO IDEA what to expect from this guy).

 

2) The D : Again, major upgrade on D and I fully expect our GAA to go WAY down (Oh wait...we were last in the league last year SO...only one way to go!) Hopefully Risto is that nasty presence we so sorely need. Ellis is a no brainier and Can't wait to see him and provy shutdown some top lines! I think Yandle will fill his role admirably as well! Great depth and some much needed veteran presence on the blue line now. Our D (including Hart) will make or break this season in my humble opinion....

 

3) Farabee Coots and G: Best three forwards on the team right? I mean... I know I know. Giroux. But in my opinion he has PLENTY left in the tank to be an effective player up front either on wing or center. He can still make plays and put the puck in the net. Farabee is on his way up! Period. I really liked what I see in this kid and think he will take another big step this year. He's got a chance to turn into a "jake Guntzel" kind of player....and I know I HATE playing against that dude). And we just got our new leader and franchise player locked up in Coots. EVERY team in the NHL would take this guy (and his contract) in a second! But WE got him. His two way play could really impact close games....which I think there will be a lot of this year. the Metro is stacked as usual!

 

4) Depth: Ok, this may be pushing it, BUT, we have not even talked about TK, JVR, Hayes, etc. All players with potential to notch 40-50 points this year. I really hope TK can morph into a less annoying version of Marchand in Boston. Again, if his game develops we got a serious 2nd line scoring threat! Hayes has showed flashes of what he can do. Very up and down player but I'm hoping he dedicates this season to his Brother and plays like it!! I hope that doesn't seem selfish of me, but you use whatever motivations you can in life!! Do we see a hungry and passionate Kevin Hayes this year!? Can JVR be a shadow of his former self?.... I would take that! Lindblom? Laughton? NAK!?... who knows?! Not exactly bottom of the barrel players by any means. I mean, who do the Coyotes have on their fourth line?!....I'm waiting.

 

Alright everyone! Lets talk 2021 season! Speculate. Lines? Production from who?! You still got faith in Hart? Will our coaching staff bring up some youngin's if some of these "rentals" (brassard, etc) don't pan out?! Who makes the opening night roster out of camp?! Any surprises?

 

Hope this passes as decent content and a good start to a 2021 Camp/Preseason discussion. I would say not making the playoffs (despite our division) is a failure.

 

Cheers  Everyone, and LETS GO FLYERS!

 

 

 

 

[flyercanuck]

Never too early I guess. Training camp should be starting next week I would think.

 

Carter Hart should rebound this year. Camp may help him more than anyone. So too should the addition of Ellis. Time will tell whether Ristolainen or Yandle actually help him. Yandle I doubt. Risto should at least make it more difficult to stand in front of him. I'll assume Jones will give us an .896 save percentage. I can't believe that's the best Fletcher could come up with.

 

 Ellis was a nice add on D. Hopefully he's got the years left in the tank that the contract has. He was starting to look like he was breaking down a bit, but a fresh start may remedy that. Ristolainen has potential to be very good. He's just never lived up to it. Hopefully getting out of Buffalo inspires him to up his IQ. Was never a Yandle fan, so hopefully we don't see much of him. I do think York comes in halfway through the season. Then Fletcher can trade Yandle and a 2nd.   Provorov should benefit from having a good partner. Sanheim hopefully takes the next step.

 

The Farabee signing might be the best thing Fletcher has done IMO. Love the kids game. There should be zero bad years on that contract. Couturier is still one of the best 200 foot players in the league. Giroux still has gas in the tank, though it's far from full. Hopefully Hayes and Atkinson can play some inspired hockey. Hopefully JVR gets traded. Allison will continue to develop and get better. I'm confident Konecny has a much better year. And Lindblom. 

 

 

 

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

22 minutes ago, MaineFlyFan said:

I'm just really excited to see how this all plays out this year.

 

I have to say i am too. Great post too. I am nervous about all the new additions.

 

To me the biggest key is the goalies and the defense and how they mesh.

 

Especially when we think about Martin Jones and how his presence will go.

 

When you look at the number Jones was the best goalie at even strength glancing at Hart, Elliott and Jones stats.

 

Jones 904%

Hart 889%

Elliott 892%

 

So it seems Hart just needs his confidence back to maybe pick these numbers up.

 

Sure easier said than done but i hope the new guys Ellis, Yandle and Risto can help them retain the puck more and get the puck transitioned out of the defensive zone up to the forward and out to start the transition to offense and back in attack mode.

 

But will they??? The part none of us know now.

 

So i think the big improvement will need to come on special teams as well.

 

The PK looks like the weakest link.

 

Hart 913% not too shabby with the suspect blueline in front of him and Elliott was 889% which is about the same as when he was even strength not impressive at all.

 

And Jones was an impressive 935% short handed. So this could very well be an upgrade. I know that is hard to believe. We'll see.

 

So the strange part is the number on the power play you know when you have an extra skater.

 

Hart 777%

Elliott 865%

Jones 833%

 

So as we glance at these numbers it tells the let down in a nut shell was when they were on the power play by a huge margin. None of those numbers are impressive at all.

 

Very scary so in my mind the new guys like Ellis, Yandle and Risto can help with keeping the puck in the offensive zone and out the defensive zone and most importantly out the net.

 

So the big question can all the new additions help get this putrid power play playing at least like a top 10 unit....and by that i mean help score some goals and ease the burden through out the whole game.

 

Bottom line they need to find a way to make the other team pay and fear to actually go to the box and that will change how teams play vs the Flyers.

 

I sure hope it all helps but every other team they need to face made changes too so who made the right changes will be what matters most.

 

Wins is all that matters making the playoffs is all that matters...and most importantly any season that doesn't end in a Cup win will be a disappointment.

 

I have faith it will be turned around until well they show me it hasn't. The addition by subtraction of Jake Voracek to me is the best move made all offseason...

 

[OccamsRazor]

9 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

I'll assume Jones will give us an .896 save percentage.

 

As i just posted you have to give the guy props for his even strength of 935%.

 

The problem with him and maybe the team in front of him at the time was the power play 833% is not going to cut it.

 

His short handed numbers aren't that bad either. 904% is very respectable and yes needs to be better too.

 

So to me we don't want him to be playing too much and the biggest thing is Carter Hart rebounding.

 

His 777% power play numbers were Bryzgalov bad....so the key is Cart Hart.

 

They will go as far as he takes them. He will give this team the confidence it sorely lacked.

 

If not this could be a very bad and long season. I hate putting the pressure on a young kid but well it is what it is.

 

A few guys who will be playing for their next contracts i expect to show up and earn new ones are Frost, NAK and most importantly Risto.

 

Pressure is on everyone.

 

Will it burst pipes or make diamonds...

 

[OccamsRazor]

I expect this guy to at least help the power play.

 

 

If not yes Chuckles will more than likely move him to a team needing some vet defensive help.

 

Is it possible that if this guy has a huge season he could still decide to test the market in the offseason???

 

 

But they don't need a bad season from him to keep his resigning price tag down.

 

Worse case maybe they can move JVR next offseason to help resign Risto...which i hope is a good problem to have wondering what he wants.

 

Would he expect a Seth Jones type deal??? 9 mill??

 

Or a team friendly Parayko type deal?? 6.5 mill per??? I guess we'll know more by 2022 gets here.

[ruxpin]

53 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

So the strange part is the number on the power play you know when you have an extra skater.

 

Hart 777%

Elliott 865%

Jones 833%

 

is this save percentage?

 

It's not terribly strange to me that the shorthanded SV% is worse than full strength.  Often the shots faced shorthanded are from breakaways or 2 on 1 attempts where something broke down at the blueline on the opposite end.   Or a situation where people are back but scrambling and in disarray following the 2v1, etc. from the breakdown at the other end.

 

The other thing I'd say about the stats is that unlike Hart & Elliott, Jones's crap numbers were not an aberration but rather the third consecutive year of "OMG why are they still playing him???"

 

That said, I'm scared but optimistic he'll thrive with the change and the PT status.   If something happens to Hart and he's starting all or the bulk, turn out the lights and go home.

[OccamsRazor]

19 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

is this save percentage?

 

It's not terribly strange to me that the shorthanded SV% is worse than full strength. 

 

No this is on the power play not shorthanded.

 

Hart 777%

Elliott 865%

Jones 833%

 

Which is unacceptable when you have an extra guy.

 

Yeah re reading my post I may have confused some my bad.

 

Power play is the weak link.

 

 

Edited September 8, 2021 by OccamsRazor
#boubonup

[pilldoc]

What a riot ... LOL

 

 

LOL .... "I should be a forward ... that was nasty .. I felt like McDavid out there"

 

this guy is hilarious!

Edited September 8, 2021 by pilldoc

[mojo1917]

@pilldoc

comes across as a person who loves what he's doing.

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

No this is on the power play not shorthanded.

 

Hart 777%

Elliott 865%

Jones 833%

 

Which is unacceptable when you have an extra guy.

 

Yeah re reading my post I may have confused some my bad.

 

Power play is the weak link.

 

 

 

Sorry, I miswrote it.  I meant the powerplay.   I'm the one that confused you.   

 

We agree the power play is [a] weak link.   But I wonder what that looks like across the board with other team's goalies.  Teams with really strong PPs not so much, but generally speaking the goalie's save percentage will tend to be lower on the power play because many of the shots are on the breakaway or 2-1, etc., stemming from a breakdown or errant/intercepted on the other end.  A fall at the blueline, etc.  

 

Or in the aftermath as people get back following the save on the breakaway, etc. but are a scattershot, incoherent mess after rushing back to the D-end.

 

None of this is meant to excuse the power play.  It's bad.   Challenged in ineptness only by our penalty kill.   Just saying I'm not shocked overall that the numbers are lower than other situations.

[mojo1917]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

Jones's crap numbers were not an aberration but rather the third consecutive year of "OMG why are they still playing him???"

 

A question I have about Jones' numbers is how much of that .896 is a reflection of the Sharks slowly circling the drain?

Were they bad because he ruined everything, was their suckitude symbiotic, or was the team terrible and he was looking at 15 to 20 grade A scoring chances against  nightly?

That team has been on a decent since the finals loss to the Pens.

I wonder  if the team's collective malaise effected MJ.

He was good for a minute. 

Could be a chicken or egg scenario. 

That said I'm glad he's not option A.

 

[MaineFlyFan]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Hopefully Hayes and Atkinson can play some inspired hockey.

Dammit! Knew I was forgetting someone!

 

Atkinson! (JVR would of never made the "depth" conversation had I simply remembered Atkinson!)

 

I agree, get what you can for JVR if he plays well early!

 

I'm interested in your distaste for Yandle. He's an Ironman. Never misses a game. Veteran with a cup. I would think his presence alone might inspire? Is he an asshole or something?!

 

Thanks for playing along!

[MaineFlyFan]

2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

So i think the big improvement will need to come on special teams as well.

 

The PK looks like the weakest link.

Great Point!

 

Is Lappy still in charge of that  mess? I hope we get a little more creative on the ol PP too!...I remember a lot of "pass the puck" last year and very few quality chances/shots.

 

At least Jake won't be out there stinking it up!!

[mojo1917]

I'm cautiously optimistic about this year's team.

I do think all the guys that sucked last year bounce back, even if they don't bounce all the way back, I don't see them playing to their 2020/21 level.

Hayes was hurt, so was Couturier, Konecny actually produced some but he wasn't a player that needed game planned for. Oscar has a year to get his muscle mass and timing back. Last year was a perfect **** storm of a year. 

Reverting to the mean will be an improvement. 

I can't help but think having a top pair RHD will make the team better, that was missing last year so, having a legit top 4 in the league guy at that position over pick a stiff from 2020/21 will be a dramatic improvement. I think Ristonlainen could play to a pre-smashed face Brayden Coburn level, if he does...that's  going to be good and fun to watch.

I can't help but think Cam Atkinson shooting the puck will result in more goals than Jake Voracek turning it over every 4th time in the O zone.

Hayes will be healthy and he may struggle for a little, but if he's not injured he'll be good on the PK, he'll be good in  OTs...I think he'll be more like 19/20 Hayes than 20/21.

I cannot help but think this team will be better than the pu-pu platter we iced last season. 

[mojo1917]

2 minutes ago, MaineFlyFan said:

Is Lappy still in charge of that  mess?

No he's the head coach at Lehigh Valley. 

He's going to get them playing the AV structure and focus on developing players. 

I actually think he'll be decent in this role. 

[Podein25]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

scared but optimistic

 

Fantastic new slogan for the season

[OccamsRazor]

50 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

Were they bad because he ruined everything

 

Can't be and put up a 935% with basically the 14th rated PK.

 

Pretty much almost all the top 10 PK team made the playoffs...except the Kings and Rangers.

 

The goalie to me seems to be the difference see the Flyers 2nd to last ranked PK because their goalies were down right bad.

 

This isn't to say that Jones doesn't share some blame because he does.

 

But as i say a 904% isn't that bad 5 on 5 on that team...but his 833% on the power play is damning and sounds like they suffered from the same issues plaguing the Flyers they just failed to execute on the PP....and the goalie didn't help much to give them a chance.

 

But only two goalies were worse than Hart 5 on 5 Quick and Holtby. Not good company.

 

5 on 5 Jones was 10th in the NHL. And 10th most shots/60 with 31.5.

 

So long story short the Flyers are going to need much better goaltending than they have been getting we can agree no matter the stats.

 

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, MaineFlyFan said:

Veteran with a cup.

 

Really when did this happen??

 

I know i have over done the bourbon lately but i must have missed this.

 

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, MaineFlyFan said:

Is Lappy still in charge of that  mess?

 

He is the Phantoms head coach now.

[flyercanuck]

1 hour ago, MaineFlyFan said:

 

 

I'm interested in your distaste for Yandle. He's an Ironman. Never misses a game. Veteran with a cup. I would think his presence alone might inspire? Is he an asshole or something?!

 

Thanks for playing along!

 

I've just always thought defencemen should be able to play....defence.

[OccamsRazor]

21 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

I've just always thought defencemen should be able to play....defence.

 

But i thought you liked Sanheim?

 

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, mojo1917 said:

A question I have about Jones' numbers is how much of that .896 is a reflection of the Sharks slowly circling the drain?

Were they bad because he ruined everything, was their suckitude symbiotic, or was the team terrible and he was looking at 15 to 20 grade A scoring chances against  nightly?

 

I think it's a big heaping helping of both.   I'm with you on chicken/egg.  I'm not sure which precipitated which but it's certainly became a circular thing.

So, I'm hopeful that the change, reuniting with old coach, and part-time turns things around for him.  I don't watch enough Sharks hockey to have had eyes on him to know whether he's slowed down or he got positionally screwed up or if it was mental.  If he's just slowed, that might be a problem but maybe could be compensated for.   The rest could be a reason for optimism.

 

 

[flyercanuck]

9 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

But i thought you liked Sanheim?

 

 

I'd like to think he's still a work in progress. 

[OccamsRazor]

LW	C	RW	Forwards
CLAUDE GIROUX Rating: 77.8#9 LW	SEAN COUTURIER Rating: 78.6#12 C	TRAVIS KONECNY Rating: 76.5#20 RW	FL1 Rating Rating: 77.66#4 FL1
JOEL FARABEE Rating: 72.4#63 LW	KEVIN HAYES Rating: 75.4#31 C	CAM ATKINSON Rating: 75.3#28 RW	FL2 Rating Rating: 74.36#19 FL2
SCOTT LAUGHTON Rating: 72.5#58 LW	DERICK BRASSARD Rating: 69.7#136 C	JAMES VAN RIEMSDYK Rating: 74.9#28 RW	FL3 Rating Rating: 72.39#8 FL3
OSKAR LINDBLOM Rating: 72.8#50 LW	NATE THOMPSON Rating: 69.4#145 C	NICOLAS AUBE-KUBEL Rating: 72.6#67 RW	FL4 Rating Rating: 71.59#6 FL4

DEFENSIVE PAIRINGS		Defense
IVAN PROVOROV Rating: 76.3#8 LD	RYAN ELLIS Rating: 77.0#9 RD	DL1 Rating Rating: 76.62#3 DL1
TRAVIS SANHEIM Rating: 74.8#20 LD	RASMUS RISTOLAINEN Rating: 73.0#40 RD	DL2 Rating Rating: 73.92#11 DL2
KEITH YANDLE Rating: 73.5#43 LD	JUSTIN BRAUN Rating: 71.8#68 RD	DL3 Rating Rating: 72.63#8 DL3

 

 

 

GOALIES
CARTER HART Rating: 71.6#11 G1	MARTIN JONES Rating: 62.4#64 G2

 

 

So what we are looking at till someone steal a spot.

[OccamsRazor]

I swear the Wade has to be Scottie Hartnell's secret offspring...

 

 

#talkischeap