All overrated starting lineup

[yave1964]

Simple little question. Two wingers, a center two blue liners and a net minder. Most overrated by position in your opinion.

My list:

Wing Rick Nash. No denying the talent, just saying he was built up as the next best thing to Christ on the Cross with the fiasco that was his year long quest to exit Columbus. Solid player. Not a superstar by any standard.

Centre Dave Bolland. I am so sick of hearing how he is the 'best number two center in the game' from Hawk fans. First off, he is a third line center-period. Second, holes abound in his game, he is kind of like Derek Sanderson used to be with the big and bads, some of the star power of teammates rubbed off on him. Wait and see he will bomb with the Leafs.

Wing: David Clarkson. How much for how long did the Leafs give this guy?? Good second or third liner, will battle Bolland for flop of the year.

D-man Chara. Anyone who witnessed the Hawks disassemble the giant sized pylon in the finals knows he is not the player he used to be. Has wicked fast slapper for skills competition at all star game. That's about it anymore. Defines overrated.

D-man Mike Green. A couple of great offensive seasons followed by injuries tha have derailed him completely. Trying to get back where he was. Never will.

Goalie: (Tie) Ryan Miller and Carey Price. Miller has aged poorly and if someone would just please take him off the Sabres hands for free they could have him, while Price has shown himself to be a regular season goalie only. Mr. October was a compliment to Reggie Jackson, it is not so much to Price.

Honorable mention: Iginla, Getzlaf, Letang Elias and Skinner.

Your turn!!

[flyerrod]

Well for goalie, 2 obvious leaders are Ilya Bryzgalov and that indian guy that plays for the Pens.Marc Andre "Wilting Flower".....

D-men...Agree 100% on Mike Green but my second choice for over-rated would be a toss up between PK Subban and Kris Letang. These are not because they are "bad" d-men but both are seriously over rated.

Center/Forwards Rick Nash leads the show by a long shot. I don't think there is anyone who even comes in a close second. Ryan Clowe should also be on this list.(Funny how they both play for the Rags). If we are talking playoffs, I would give the title to most over-rated to the Sedin Twins.........

[yave1964]

Well for goalie, 2 obvious leaders are Ilya Bryzgalov and that indian guy that plays for the Pens.Marc Andre "Wilting Flower".....

D-men...Agree 100% on Mike Green but my second choice for over-rated would be a toss up between PK Subban and Kris Letang. These are not because they are "bad" d-men but both are seriously over rated.

Center/Forwards Rick Nash leads the show by a long shot. I don't think there is anyone who even comes in a close second. Ryan Clowe should also be on this list.(Funny how they both play for the Rags). If we are talking playoffs, I would give the title to most over-rated to the Sedin Twins.........

Yeah I thought about the Sedin sisters but left them off because they do still put up great numbers. Clowe also was on my list, but I figure because I just cannot stand him so much from his days of whining with the Sharks that objectivity was out the window. Love the 'wilting flower' Indian name.

[flyercanuck]

Wing : I'd disagree on Nash. I mean I think he's a bit overrated. He played on a horrible Columbus team his entire career and put up decent numbers. But can he play more than HALF a season on a new team before getting crucified? Especially when he spent part of that season playing with Richards whose game totally disappeared. James Neal looks like a superstar...take Malkin away and he can't score a goal. How many goals does Nash score on Malkins wing? Ovechkin? Hart trophy...gimme a break. The guy took TWO seasons off, he's doesn't have heart. Maybe more overpaid than overrated, I dunno. I like Lucic but think he's overrated sometimes. Bobby Ryan is certainly overrated around these boards.

Center ; Again, i LIKE Bolland. He's no #1 and noone ever said he was. He does his job very well IMO. Giroux gets overrated around here. He's shown potential, but he's no superstar yet. He just got paid to be one though. The Sedins? Ryan Kesler had one great year. Crosby is overrated by some in that he's nowhere near Gretzky, Orr , Lemieux, Howes league. Still the best player, when healthy. Brad Richards WAS overrated, the truth is out now. .

Dman - Kris Letang - the NEW Mike Green. If points are your thing, he's great. If you think defenceman should help stop the opposing team from scoring...yuck. Chara is getting old. He looked pretty damn good against the Pens. And bad against the Hawks. Phaneuf was voted the leagues most overrated player by NHLers a year ago. I'll take their word.

Goalie : Well Bryz was NEVER overrated by me. Fleury is overpaid, but I think the cats out of the bag there. Price looked promising but has come down. Miller gets my vote. He looked like the best in the world a few years ago, and is pretty bad nowadays. Yet he still thinks he's great.

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[blocker]

Remember Gilbert Dionne? He was over-rated in his own mind. Told everyone that his nickname was "The King", despite the fact that noone had ever called him that. When a sportswriter asked him why he wasn't scoring goals, he named and blamed his linemates. He said that since he played on a Stanley Cup winner while his brother Marcel never did, he must be the better player. Claimed goals that others had actually scored.

[flyercanuck]

@blocker

A throw in on the Recchi- LeClair DesJardins trade if my memory serves me right. And he didn't last long in Philly.

[J0e Th0rnton]

Wing : I'd disagree on Nash. I mean I think he's a bit overrated. He played on a horrible Columbus team his entire career and put up decent numbers. But can he play more than HALF a season on a new team before getting crucified? Especially when he spent part of that season playing with Richards whose game totally disappeared. James Neal looks like a superstar...take Malkin away and he can't score a goal. How many goals does Nash score on Malkins wing? Ovechkin? Hart trophy...gimme a break. The guy took TWO seasons off, he's doesn't have heart. Maybe more overpaid than overrated, I dunno. I like Lucic but think he's overrated sometimes. Bobby Ryan is certainly overrated around these boards.

Center ; Again, i LIKE Bolland. He's no #1 and noone ever said he was. He does his job very well IMO. Giroux gets overrated around here. He's shown potential, but he's no superstar yet. He just got paid to be one though. The Sedins? Ryan Kesler had one great year. Crosby is overrated by some in that he's nowhere near Gretzky, Orr , Lemieux, Howes league. Still the best player, when healthy. Brad Richards WAS overrated, the truth is out now. .

Dman - Kris Letang - the NEW Mike Green. If points are your thing, he's great. If you think defenceman should help stop the opposing team from scoring...yuck. Chara is getting old. He looked pretty damn good against the Pens. And bad against the Hawks. Phaneuf was voted the leagues most overrated player by NHLers a year ago. I'll take their word.

Goalie : Well Bryz was NEVER overrated by me. Fleury is overpaid, but I think the cats out of the bag there. Price looked promising but has come down. Miller gets my vote. He looked like the best in the world a few years ago, and is pretty bad nowadays. Yet he still thinks he's great.

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Pretty good sum up

[blocker]

A throw in on the Recchi- LeClair DesJardins trade if my memory serves me right

I think Montreal was happy to be rid of him. For some reason, Jacques Demers kept giving him chance after chance.

[jammer2]

I agree with fc on Nash. A tad overrated, yeah...I can buy that, but he did have some crappy linemates in Columbus and NYR. Look at Nash's international play. On a team full of stars for Team Canada at the past Olympics, he was on the top 2 lines and actually stood out in the crowd. Amazing what happens when a skilled guy actually gets to play with other stars....ha ha. Let's face it, not many guys would fill the net with Richards as their center, or even the young and promising Stephan leaves a lot to be desired.

[ZeZel25]

Nash...Lucic on wing

Center I'll take B Richards

Defense...PHANEUF and Jay Bouwmeester

Goal...Luongo

[J0e Th0rnton]

I agree with fc on Nash. A tad overrated, yeah...I can buy that, but he did have some crappy linemates in Columbus and NYR. Look at Nash's international play. On a team full of stars for Team Canada at the past Olympics, he was on the top 2 lines and actually stood out in the crowd. Amazing what happens when a skilled guy actually gets to play with other stars....ha ha. Let's face it, not many guys would fill the net with Richards as their center, or even the young and promising Stephan leaves a lot to be desired.

I hate that idea. Usually the truly skilled superstars can make magic happen no matter who their linemates are. Joe Thornton turned Cheechoo into a 56 goal scorer and scored 96 points at one point when michalek was 2nd with 55 points. Occasionally you get a superstar who needs others specific tools to make him stand out, but usually, players who need to carry the load and play more because they are the team do better than Nash.

What I notice about Nash is, his lack of effort. Sometimes, you can see him just dictate his will. He decided to show up that night and the other team is easing up on the forecheck and crossing their fingers every time he is on the ice.

But if for whatever reason he decides he is not happy that night, he will float. Which is 2/3rds of the games I see him play.

Edited July 20, 2013 by J0e Th0rnton

[jammer2]

@J0e Th0rnton I don't see a lot of NYR games, just the ones against the Flyers. I have seen the floating you were talking about, but have no idea how much it happens in games that don't involve the Flyers. He has a legit shot at making the Canadian Olympic squad again, if he is really overrated, why not just pick one of the other 10 stars that Team Canada has access to? With guys like Stevie Y, Gretzky advising, I don't think you skate by on reputation.

[J0e Th0rnton]

@J0e Th0rnton I don't see a lot of NYR games, just the ones against the Flyers. I have seen the floating you were talking about, but have no idea how much it happens in games that don't involve the Flyers. He has a legit shot at making the Canadian Olympic squad again, if he is really overrated, why not just pick one of the other 10 stars that Team Canada has access to? With guys like Stevie Y, Gretzky advising, I don't think you skate by on reputation.

I saw it a lot in Shark games vs Columbus. but also when I happened to catch a columbus game vs anyone. Often if the sharks are not playing, I will watch whatever team strikes my fancy.

[yave1964]

When Hitch coached the Jackets he gave Nash the additional responsibility of penalty killing and even time on the checking line against other teams top lines, and got the most out of him of anyone. Post Hitchcock Nash played for himself. I love Vigneault as a coach and feel if anyone can get him on track he is the guy.

[blocker]

When Hitch coached the Jackets he gave Nash the additional responsibility of penalty killing and even time on the checking line against other teams top lines, and got the most out of him of anyone

That's Hitchcock's gig. He picks a horse and rides it. In Philadelphia, it was Primeau. In Dallas, it was Modano. In Columbus, it was Nash. He squeezes the sap out of a particular player to further his own career.

Edited July 20, 2013 by blocker

[jammer2]

@blocker Never saw it put that way, but I would agree for the most part.

Edit...except who is that guy in St.Louis? Oshie? I like T.J as a player, but don't think he's the type of dominating player a coach could ride per say...maybe Backes, but his pts have been down for a while now....I dunno..

[flyercanuck]

@jammer2

Pietrangelo?

[jammer2]

@flyercanuck Yeah, there is no where that says it has to be a forward. I would venture to guess Pietrangelo is the best player on that team overall, so it would make sense.

[bags2]

Kunitz-H.Sedin-P.Kane

Subban-Kaberle

Fleury

Outside of MAF I think all these guys are great players, just not as great as many seem to think they are.

[flyercanuck]

@bags2

I was going to mention Kane. He does score big goals, but needs someone else to do the dirty work for him.

[jammer2]

@bags2 Subban seems like an odd choice, he just got 38 pts equaling his career high, but only played in 42 games. I know pts are not everything, but this guy is super creative, and looks like he matured and grew up a lot in the past year. He is average in his own end, but he's no Mike Green. I see the Norris for this guy, with plenty of 80 pt seasons ahead. As Montreal's youth movement gets better, his pts will go up, up, up.

[blocker]

I'd take Subban on my team anyday.

[bags2]

@jammer2 I like Subban, and I think he's a very good defenseman. But he was given the Norris this year, and I don't think he's the best defenseman in the league. Offensively he's top notch no doubt there, but he's incredibly undisciplined and although I love the huge checks he throws, at times he gets himself out of position.

I'd gladly take Subban on my team, but there are other defenseman I'd take over him.

[jammer2]

@bags2 I think PK made a lot of strides last year in regards to positioning, when to pinch, when to not etc....last year at this time, I'd have happily included him on the all overrated team, but he has grown up a lot in the past year, even in the respecting the game and other players etc. It might take a few years for him to shed that image, but he's headed in the right direction IMHO.

[bags2]

@jammer2 I agree he has definitely improved, and he is a top tier defenseman in the league IMO. But to me he's not the best that's the only reason I put him on this list. But I look forward to see where guys like him, Letang, and Karlsson max out. All very exciting players to watch with a ton of skill.