murraycraven Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Wow people are really angry what a difference in opinions just within a week or two from when they were winning. Guys hate to break it to you but were going to half to ride it out. We are not going to be able to trade away for defense... We just got to keep on heading forwards take our lumps and keep rebuilding through the draft...Guys the Flyers are finally doing it right don't screw it up now with arm chair gm panic moves. Just like any team that is still not ready for cup contention and are still drafting to fill pieces that they need...there not going to be the blackhawks or pens yet guys...doing all these panic trades has put us in this position, could you imagine if we had this mentality of letting it ride years ago... I am not talking about the RIchards, Carter but everything else. God I wish we had JVR still on the team...Wish we got Carlson instead of Eminger.... I agree 29... There is no magic bullet that will fix this Team. Patience is the key but having faith the Flyers brass will actually develop players is another story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I can't help but think of Torey Krug in Boston and Justin Shultz with the oil.those guys played NCAA and were pretty well ready for the NHL right away, i know Krug has been up and down twixt the A and the B's, and shultz has be uneven, but at least with those guys there is upside there. this is why i would like to see what Alt and Ghost can bring, they are a little older Ghost is very mobile , and Alt is a very good athlete with great size. i don't see where the extended look at Mezaros and Gil is helping the Flyers much Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I will bet that Homer "fixes" the defense by trading for Big Buff... hate to say it but I can really see this happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 As pilldoc mentioned, this topic could use its own thread.. thanks for the shoutout. I had to leave and take my son to Gym class. (he is home schooled), so I did not get a chance to start the topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 In my opnion Flyers should send Giroux and Streit for Weber and Paul Gaustad or Cullen just take back salary from them It's time for dramitic change and rebuiltWhy would NSH take Streit? Bad contract and he is 35+. Would love to land Weber somehow, but that ship has sailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 The issue is there are no #1 defensemen on the market and you are going to have to blow up this Team to try and acquire one. When you do this (again) you are stuck back into the rebuilding mode. Teams will not be sending off their top bona fide #1. You can look at Teams that have a plethora of dmen that are 1 and 1A types but they hardly exist. We are not getting a Weber type dman w/out losing a lot of your young talent and talent in the farm. If you go this route when does the revolving door stop? Teams like the Hawks, Wings, Ducks, Blues, etc.. all have born and bred dmen from their system. I know this sounds crazy but drafting and developine players really does work but it requires patience. Something this Club does not have and something the fans frankly dont have either. The only thing I think we can hope for is a move here or there to solidify the defense. You are not going to get a top pairing guy in this market but you might be able to grab someone that actually can play defense. Something this current group knows nothing about...It all comes down to drafting. I just don't trust Homer and company being able to draft a legit D-man prospect. That is why with the little win streak the Flyers had at the end of the season hurt so bad. It cost them in the Draft pecking order. I know I will be flamed because of this statement, but I was ok with them losing last year knowing they had a bad team and knowing that they should have had at least a top 5 pick. However, that win streak shot that idea to pieces. I know fans where happy they won near the end of the season, I was not purposely wanting them to lose, but I was not shedding a tear when they did. I know some on here disagree with that. I don't know what the 2014 Draft looks like, but being a mediocre team will get them in the 12-15 spot. This team needs to get into the top 5 in order to get a legit shot at hopefully a bonafide D-man prospect. I agree with just about everyone else's thoughts. No team will be will to part with a #1 D-man unless due to injury somewhere else. How many times are we going to gut this team? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Wow people are really angry what a difference in opinions just within a week or two from when they were winning. Guys hate to break it to you but were going to half to ride it out. We are not going to be able to trade away for defense... We just got to keep on heading forwards take our lumps and keep rebuilding through the draft...Guys the Flyers are finally doing it right don't screw it up now with arm chair gm panic moves. Just like any team that is still not ready for cup contention and are still drafting to fill pieces that they need...there not going to be the blackhawks or pens yet guys...doing all these panic trades has put us in this position, could you imagine if we had this mentality of letting it ride years ago... I am not talking about the RIchards, Carter but everything else. God I wish we had JVR still on the team...Wish we got Carlson instead of Eminger....The win streak, though nice to enjoy, is just a band-aid covering up the real issues of this team. I for one was never fooled. This team needs to play mistake free hockey to win and when they don't, they simply are not good enough to over come there mistakes. Case in point. Exhibit A: Downie's dumb penalties at the end of the Isles game which enabled the Isle to tie the game and eventually win in a shootout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 It all comes down to drafting. I just don't trust Homer and company being able to draft a legit D-man prospect. definitely tougher to find the ready now guys once you get out of the top 5. no question.I know I will be flamed because of this statement, but I was ok with them losing last year knowing they had a bad team and knowing that they should have had at least a top 5 pick. However, that win streak shot that idea to pieces. not going to flame you , but losing like that sets a bad example on an impressionable core of players who will benefit from achieving victory in the NHL. that said i'm all for it . Start the tank-a-thon, draft Eckblad, then go forward with Alt, Ghost , Hagg, who's going to be ready for the A next year (and we'll see if he's ready for more) Eckblad, Grossman, Striet and Coburn. this period of growth has been frustrating because occasionally one can see what may one day be, Schenn and Simmonds plus player X wearing bitches out on the forecheck, Couturier and Read plus player with good puck skills starting in the D zone and winding up with scoring opportunities .Giroux shooting and making plays that make you think , hell yes, he's a damn good player. I would prefer the full on **** sandwich to this trying to "reload". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackhole Posted January 24, 2014 Author Share Posted January 24, 2014 pilldoc - And to think of how close they were to coming into Seth Jones at 4th or 5th or whatever he went at. That was their position until right at the end Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 @jackhole Jones went 4th, Nurse 7th and Ristoleinen 8th. It was a good year to suck. We went the mediocre route yet again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Ah yes... and we have Fluke Schenn. great... just great. @docj227, agree w/ everything about your post. We really shot ourselves in the foot last year. Nurse and Risto are closer to NHL ready than Morin and Haag. We cant even lose correctly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 (edited) Ah yes... and we have Fluke Schenn. great... just great. @docj227, agree w/ everything about your post. We really shot ourselves in the foot last year. Nurse and Risto are closer to NHL ready than Morin and Haag. We cant even lose correctly Well, sure, if you mean that Ristolainen has actually played in the NHL You just know they would have gone with Bo Horvat though. Edited January 24, 2014 by radoran Nurse isn't Jones isn't Nurse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 You just know they would have gone with Bo Horvat though. Bo knows hockey! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EightyEight Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I will bet that Homer "fixes" the defense by trading for Big Buff... hate to say it but I can really see this happening. I agree, I can see this happening as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Well, sure, if you mean that both of them have actually played in the NHL You just know they would have gone with Bo Horvat though. Nurse hasn't played in the NHL yet. I did think he had a good chance to play this year though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Nurse hasn't played in the NHL yet. I did think he had a good chance to play this year though. Yeah, I was looking at Jones.... Will Edit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Yeah, I was looking at Jones.... Will Edit You're forgiven. But just this ONE time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 definitely tougher to find the ready now guys once you get out of the top 5. no question.not going to flame you , but losing like that sets a bad example on an impressionable core of players who will benefit from achieving victory in the NHL.that said i'm all for it . Start the tank-a-thon, draft Eckblad, then go forward with Alt, Ghost , Hagg, who's going to be ready for the A next year (and we'll see if he's ready for more) Eckblad, Grossman, Striet and Coburn.this period of growth has been frustrating because occasionally one can see what may one day be, Schenn and Simmonds plus player X wearing bitches out on the forecheck, Couturier and Read plus player with good puck skills starting in the D zone and winding up with scoring opportunities .Giroux shooting and making plays that make you think , hell yes, he's a damn good player. I would prefer the full on **** sandwich to this trying to "reload". Agree about losing with young kids. Just a fine line. You want them yo succeed but in the same token I want the better draft pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 pilldoc - And to think of how close they were to coming into Seth Jones at 4th or 5th or whatever he went at. That was their position until right at the end Hence my frustration! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jackhole Posted January 24, 2014 Author Share Posted January 24, 2014 Big Buff?.......don't say that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 The issue is there are no #1 defensemen on the market and you are going to have to blow up this Team to try and acquire one honestly, i think the real issue is that the term #1 defensemen is itself meaningless, and should management go chasing that without any clearer idea of what they are looking for, they'd be doing what we are all pretty upset that they keep doing. a #1 defenseman, obviously, is the guy at the top of the depth chart. that is the extent of it. there are basically no similarities between zdeno chara and drew doughty, outside of the position they play and their ranking on their teams' depth charts. they are different presences, have different skillsets, bring different different strengths, different weaknesses, and ultimately mean very different things to their teams. if paul holmgren went shopping, pulled up his list of "legit #1 dmen", he'd be looking at a list of maybe, what, 12 guys? ranging from chara to doughty to subban to letang to weber to keith. do all of those guys fill the flyers' needs, outside of a conspicuous empty spot on the depth chart? from where i sit, the flyers most pressing need on the blueline is a focus, a leadership presence. they need both offensive and defensive skill, but mostly they need someone that can be the face of the defensive corps. when the going gets tough, this guy is the one to lean on. the role that pronger filled, that desjardins filled. timonen did for a little while, kind of, but not anymore. chara and weber, not subban or doughty. and not dougie hamilton or even OEL. the thing missing is someone who can carry WEIGHT, not just icetime. talent and commitment aren't enough, character and leadership and experience are what the flyers' blueline is missing. and, in the end, there really are only a couple of guys out there like that. weber is the only one i can see being in any way possible, but that is still really really really hard to see happening. the others out there, they would add points or maybe drop the shots against a little, but the flyers' problem isn't about allowing a few too many shots or needing to score a few more goals, it's about backbone and structure. throughout the lineup, but especially on the blueline. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Who the hell is giving up a top defenseman for anything we have?Even Giroux ( who I don't trade no matter what)!Who wants what the flyers have to sell?As pilldoc mentioned, this topic could use its own thread...I think we need to package up a center to make this happen. Its really our only strength. We have centers playing wing, and Laughton is ready to make the step.It will take quality to receive quality so, the real question remains....Who do you offer up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Isn't it beyond the realm of possibility?Who is giving up a #1 d man for a center not named Claude Giroux!That goes back to "who" are we talking about?And what team that "needs a center" for a playoff push is giving up their #1 defenceman to get that center? What's more important to the playoffs?It's not beyond the realm of possibility, but I wouldn't be putting everything on 17-black and hoping for the ball to drop right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I so totally agree! Last year's team was so bad they didn't even know when to keep being bad!!! It hurt them so much winning those last games when no one else was trying!!! There was a reason no one else was trying!It all comes down to drafting. I just don't trust Homer and company being able to draft a legit D-man prospect. That is why with the little win streak the Flyers had at the end of the season hurt so bad. It cost them in the Draft pecking order. I know I will be flamed because of this statement, but I was ok with them losing last year knowing they had a bad team and knowing that they should have had at least a top 5 pick. However, that win streak shot that idea to pieces. I know fans where happy they won near the end of the season, I was not purposely wanting them to lose, but I was not shedding a tear when they did. I know some on here disagree with that. I don't know what the 2014 Draft looks like, but being a mediocre team will get them in the 12-15 spot. This team needs to get into the top 5 in order to get a legit shot at hopefully a bonafide D-man prospect.I agree with just about everyone else's thoughts. No team will be will to part with a #1 D-man unless due to injury somewhere else. How many times are we going to gut this team? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colorado_al Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Ok, I'm more that willing to tank this season... let's try for the most PMs for a goal then And then some great drafts. ( ok so I'm dreaming about the last part ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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