Does the NHL Hate Naz?

[WordsOfWisdom]

First a fine for diving (still waiting for those video clips btw), and now a suspension for a light check to the shoulder of a Red Wings player (that rode up and hit his noggin)?  How is that comparable to the stick swinging incident with Keith? Come on. 

 

I'm starting to like Nazem Kadri more and more with each passing day. If he were playing this style of hockey 25 years ago, fans would be calling him DOUG GILMOUR. (Or at least a cross between Gilmour and Tucker.) Whatever happened to playing with a bit of an edge? Gilmour was a talented **** distuber on the ice. Kadri is that same type of hockey player. He scores. He hits. He gets under the opponents skin. Apparently that's illegal in the NHL today. 

 

[hf101]

I don't think so.  It's his 3rd offense.  Other than losing nearly 400K Kadri will get an early tee time.  

A focused summer will help prepare him for next year's season.

[WordsOfWisdom]

45 minutes ago, hf101 said:

I don't think so.  It's his 3rd offense.  Other than losing nearly 400K Kadri will get an early tee time.  

A focused summer will help prepare him for next year's season.

 

He's been playing so well lately. Usually star players are held to a different standard in the NHL. 

[flyercanuck]

Light check to the shoulder?

 

 

https://streamable.com/sf7g

[BluPuk]

Did you notice he had no helmet on at the time of the cross-check? Just askin' 

 

If the refs miss a call like that, the player has to respond. Good for Kadri. All the same - 4 games??? Really? That's a joke, sorry. They must have used the wheel for that one.

[WordsOfWisdom]

7 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Light check to the shoulder?

 

 

https://streamable.com/sf7g

 

Okay maybe it wasn't to the shoulder.   But we could probably agree on the fact that this type of play used to be 2 minutes for cross-checking and that was the end of it. I see players do this type of hit on a regular basis and most of them don't even get a penalty, let alone suspended for the rest of the season.  

[WordsOfWisdom]

Kadri and Chara exchange cross-checks:

 

 

 

 

[flyercanuck]

1 hour ago, WordsOfWisdom said:

 

Okay maybe it wasn't to the shoulder.   But we could probably agree on the fact that this type of play used to be 2 minutes for cross-checking and that was the end of it. I see players do this type of hit on a regular basis and most of them don't even get a penalty, let alone suspended for the rest of the season.  

 

Or light.

 

When you crosscheck  a guy in the head, I don't think it's just another hockey play. 

 

The rest of the season? 

[WordsOfWisdom]

1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Or light.

 

When you crosscheck  a guy in the head, I don't think it's just another hockey play. 

 

The rest of the season? 

 

Okay, so maybe the suspension "for the rest of the season" was in fact only 4 games.   I think we can agree that the plays Kadri has been suspended on were particularly "wispy" contact plays.

 

I looked through some highlights and he got suspended one time for bumping into a goalie. (A play that most players would get a 2 minute penalty for and nothing else.) He got suspended several games for brushing past a player along the boards, barely touching him in the process, and it was called a deliberate hit to the head or something. 

[flyercanuck]

Kadri is getting himself into the "jerk" division of NHL players..don't get me wrong he's got talent...but he does dirty stuff and he dives. He's has several incidents over the last few weeks of exactly that, after putting together a pretty good season. He's already had several "attitude" issues with the Leaf org. as well.

 

Maybe this will be yet another wakeup call for a guy who doesn't seem to have figured out whether he wants to be a good player or a pain in the arse for both his team and his opponent. 

[Podein25]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Kadri is getting himself into the "jerk" division of NHL players..don't get me wrong he's got talent...but he does dirty stuff and he dives. He's has several incidents over the last few weeks of exactly that, after putting together a pretty good season. He's already had several "attitude" issues with the Leaf org. as well.

 

Maybe this will be yet another wakeup call for a guy who doesn't seem to have figured out whether he wants to be a good player or a pain in the arse for both his team and his opponent. 

 

I don't like his body language. It looks like he is in a perpetual whine. It's just immaturity I'm sure. I do like his talent.

[WordsOfWisdom]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Kadri is getting himself into the "jerk" division of NHL players..don't get me wrong he's got talent...but he does dirty stuff and he dives. He's has several incidents over the last few weeks of exactly that, after putting together a pretty good season. He's already had several "attitude" issues with the Leaf org. as well.

 

Maybe this will be yet another wakeup call for a guy who doesn't seem to have figured out whether he wants to be a good player or a pain in the arse for both his team and his opponent. 

 

As a Flyers fan, I'm sure you're familiar with the exploits of a player by the name of Chris Pronger. He was one of the dirtiest and nastiest players in the game, who genuinely injured people, and even he didn't get suspended as severely as Kadri has been (at least on average). 

 

A look at past incidents involving NHL defenseman Chris Pronger:

 

• 1995: The league suspended Pronger, then with the St. Louis Blues, for four games after he hit Capitals forward Pat Peake in the throat with a stick during a Oct. 29 game at the Kiel Center. Brian Burke, the NHL's director of hockey operations at the time, held a hearing with Pronger, Blues GM and coach Mike Keenan, Pronger's agent and a NHL Players' Association rep. Peake suffered a fractured thyroid cartilage and was expected to miss four weeks at the time of the hit.

 

• 1998: Pronger, still with the Blues, was suspended for four games for slashing Phoenix's Jeremy Roenick on Dec. 17, 1998. Pronger drew a match penalty when he took a swing at Roenick's helmet. Colin Campbell, the NHL senior vice president and director of hockey operations, ruled that Pronger was attempting to injure Roenick in an "extremely reckless and dangerous manner."

 

• 2001: Pronger was suspended without pay for one game after leaving the bench and instigating a fight with the Kings' Kelly Buchberger during an Oct. 11, 2000 game. Blues winger Pavol Demitra suffered a broken nose when Buchberger hit him with an elbow during the second period. That hit provoked Pronger to leave the bench.

 

• 2002: Pronger received a two-game suspension without pay for cross-checking Stars forward Brenden Morrow in an April 3 game. The suspension cost Pronger $231,707.32 in salary. The cross-check left Morrow bleeding near one of his eyes. St. Louis beat Dallas 2-1 in overtime.

 

• 2004: Pronger, still with St. Louis, was suspended one game without pay for kicking Calgary's Ville Nieminen during a March 14 game. Pronger kicked Nieminen with 9:23 gone in the first period, but there was no penalty on the play. The suspension came as St. Louis was making a late push for the playoffs. The Blues were later ousted in the first round.

• 2007: Pronger, in his first postseason with the Ducks, was suspended one game for his hit on Detroit's Tomas Holmstrom in Game 3 of the Western Conference finals on May 15. Pronger and Rob Niedermayer drove Holmstrom into the glass from behind midway through the second period. The hit knocked off Holmstrom's helmet and left him on the ice with a cut to his forehead. Holmstrom did return to the game. Niedermayer received a five-minute boarding penalty and a game misconduct. Pronger was not penalized. Replays apparently showed Pronger hitting Holmstrom in the head with his elbows, leading the NHL to review the incident.

 

• 2007: Pronger was suspended one game for his blow to the head of Ottawa's Dean McAmmond in Game 3 of the Stanley Cup finals. McAmmond was
struck as he skated with the puck toward the Ducks net. He did a spin, fell backward, struck his head on the ice, and slid into the corner in the Anaheim zone at 2:01 of the third period. McAmmond was briefly knocked out and left the ice looking woozy after several minutes of on-ice attention.

 

Only two other players in NHL history have been suspended twice in the same playoff season. Ville Nieminen of the Calgary Flames sat out one game in the 2004 final after a head shot on Tampa's Vincent Lecavalier. Earlier, he'd received a one-game sentence for charging into Detroit goaltender Curtis Joseph in the second round. Claude Lemieux is the other and has the distinction of being the only player to be suspended twice in the same series. He earned a one-game ban for punching Slava Kozlov of the Detroit Red Wings in the 1996 Western Conference finals, and then, in one of the most brutal hits in playoff history, got a two-game hiatus when he drilled the Wings' Kris Draper from behind. Draper suffered severe facial injuries as a result of the hit.

 

The only other player to be suspended in the finals beyond Pronger and Nieminen was Detroit defenseman Jiri Fischer, who was suspended for cross-checking Carolina's Tommy Westlund in the 2002 finals.

 

 

• 2008: In the first minute of the second period of the Ducks' game March 12 against the Vancouver Canucks, Pronger and Canucks forward Ryan Kesler got tangled up in the corner behind the Anaheim goal. Kesler, a hard forechecker, hit Pronger but ended up on his back, with Pronger's right foot between his legs. Pronger got his foot free, but video shows he took his foot and stepped hard on Kesler's left leg. Kesler was not injured, but he was adamant after the game that Pronger intentionally stepped on his calf. The NHL reviewed it, and no punishment was initally administered. The league got better, clearer video the next day, and on March 15, handed down the eight-game suspension, the longest of Pronger's career.

Information from The Associated Press and SportsTicker was used in this report.

[WordsOfWisdom]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Maybe this will be yet another wakeup call for a guy who doesn't seem to have figured out whether he wants to be a good player or a pain in the arse for both his team and his opponent. 

 

He's trying to be that guy that has talent and acts like an agitator (or is at least tough to play against). There are skilled players in this league that turn the other cheek when someone is dominating them physically. ie: The Sedin twins. Then there are skilled players in the NHL that have a nasty edge -- players that will give you a buttend or an elbow for taking liberties with them. A Gordie Howe / Mark Messier type that don't get bullied. Kadri stands up for himself. He initiates contact. He's like a Jeremy Roenick was, or an Eric Lindros, or a Peter Forsberg. He hits people. He gets hit back. I hope we're not losing this aspect to our game.   

[Podein25]

16 minutes ago, WordsOfWisdom said:

Pat Peake

 

There was one unlucky bastard. 

[flyercanuck]

I like physical skilled players too. And Kadri can be that guy...but he's got to tone down the diving. Yes, everyone does it. But some do it lots...and he's one of that some. 

 

No one is going to dispute how dirty Pronger was.

 

The league is clamping down on headshots. They weren't during the Broad Street Bully days. And they weren't when Pronger joined the league in 93. Those were different eras. Today, if you're going to crosscheck someone in the head...the odds are you're going to get suspended. Especially when you've been suspended before.for headshots.

 

This guy has been suspended by his own team before. He's been fined for diving.

 

Good player...who seems to be a jerk. 

[WordsOfWisdom]

4 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

I like physical skilled players too. And Kadri can be that guy...but he's got to tone down the diving. Yes, everyone does it. But some do it lots...and he's one of that some. 

 

No one is going to dispute how dirty Pronger was.

 

The league is clamping down on headshots. They weren't during the Broad Street Bully days. And they weren't when Pronger joined the league in 93. Those were different eras. Today, if you're going to crosscheck someone in the head...the odds are you're going to get suspended. Especially when you've been suspended before.for headshots.

 

This guy has been suspended by his own team before. He's been fined for diving.

 

Good player...who seems to be a jerk. 

 

It's a delicate balancing act to be sure.

 

I wonder if he'll be on the cover of the next Hockey News Yearbook.  

[BluPuk]

Diving is not an actual penalty, like hooking or holding and so on. With the exception of some obvious soccer-like dives, unless you can get inside the body of the 'offending' player, you don't know if he dove or not - there are no forensics. Calling a dive is someone's personal opinion - there is no actual way to prove it. Getting fined for it should require a joint NHL/NHLPA board to approve - with each having veto power. I think there would a lot fewer fines...

[Podein25]

39 minutes ago, BluPuk said:

Diving is not an actual penalty, like hooking or holding and so on. With the exception of some obvious soccer-like dives, unless you can get inside the body of the 'offending' player, you don't know if he dove or not - there are no forensics. Calling a dive is someone's personal opinion - there is no actual way to prove it. Getting fined for it should require a joint NHL/NHLPA board to approve - with each having veto power. I think there would a lot fewer fine

 

I think you might be wrong on all of this. 

[WordsOfWisdom]

3 hours ago, BluPuk said:

Diving is not an actual penalty

 

It's called "Unsportsmanlike Conduct - Diving". It is indeed a penalty.   

 

Whether or not Kadri actually is a diver or not, I'd like to see the video footage of these alleged dives. I have yet to see a highlight showing Kadri diving.  

 

rs ago, BluPuk said:

Calling a dive is someone's personal opinion - there is no actual way to prove it.

 

This is true. It's entirely subjective. When does a fall become a dive? The refs can't even get hooking, holding, and tripping right. How on earth can they tell when a player went down too easily? The easiest thing to do is just don't call a penalty. 

 

[JR Ewing]

Chris Pronger. Filthy, filthy, filthy...

 

What a magnificent bastard.

 

[WordsOfWisdom]

1 hour ago, JR Ewing said:

Chris Pronger. Filthy, filthy, filthy...

 

What a magnificent bastard.

 

 

I loved the NHL suspension flowchart you posted. Between that and the NHL suspension wheel, I couldn't stop laughing. 

[OccamsRazor]

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

 

[BluPuk]

Both good deals. Very happy here....

[flyercanuck]

They both look like good deals...at the moment.

 

I've grown skeptical with the long term contract. If you're going to give one...at least these two are young enough that you should have them for their best years. I'm not sure Kadri is the type of player you want with no motivation financially...Reilly I'm not worried about.