King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said: Very well could be sounds like Homer. Ron gave him a hell of a hand to deal from now....assets galore!! And they have 4 days to work out something for Nylander...scares the bee jezus out of me... And it should, right? At least if it's Nylander, they're getting a 22 year old kid who is pretty good now and can still get better. I'd totally send a pick for that actually. Maybe even Simmonds. But Toronto holds all the cards and they will want something to push for a cup now and they'll know that they can get more than Simmonds on a rental for a 22 year old RFA. They'll want Ghost or Provo or Sanheim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 7 minutes ago, King Knut said: What rhymes with "Two Cups" ? Uwe Krupp? (that ones for HJ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 4 minutes ago, King Knut said: I'd totally send a pick for that actually. That is what i would be doing i would prefer to send picks. But not sure if Toronto wants to really send him in the Eastern conference unless it is for a Travis Sanheim or someone who is ready to jump in right now and help. You know what i would have done and now that Homer is in charge we have seen him do this before to be a dick... ...you could just send an offer sheet Nylander's way and really force the Leafs hand and then you would only give up draft picks. Just throwing that out there! They have the cap space to do it. #dickmove Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: That is what i would be doing i would prefer to send picks. Whether it's Panarin, Nylander, Grubauer, Varlamov, and on and on, it's gonna cost more than picks. It will cost a prospect or player that no one wants to see go. That's how trades for good players work. Would you be willing to part with Sanheim in any trade? What about Frost? Ghost? Farabee? Second-tier prospects won't get you much, neither will bottom-half roster players. 3 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: You know what i would have done and now that Homer is in charge we have seen him do this before to be a dick... ...you could just send an offer sheet Nylander's way and really force the Leafs hand and then you would only give up draft picks. Just throwing that out there! They have the cap space to do it. #dickmove That's what got Homer blacklisted in the first place. He specifically mentioned that the offer sheet made his job increasingly difficult because other GMs were unwilling to deal with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 Just now, brelic said: Would you be willing to part with Sanheim in any trade? Yes but not for Nylander. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 1 minute ago, brelic said: That's what got Homer blacklisted in the first place. I don't give a f**K it's rules...it isn't like he is doing something illegal. So these guys who get mad can go f**k themselves don't want someone to offer sheet your guys then sign him. Now for the record i have stated many times i don't want Nylander. I was just saying it is an option without giving up prospect- just draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 4 minutes ago, brelic said: Whether it's Panarin, Nylander, Grubauer, Varlamov, and on and on, it's gonna cost more than picks. It will cost a prospect or player that no one wants to see go. That's how trades for good players work. Yeah, I think some people are sitting there going: "trade a bunhca these guys. throw in the obligatory 2nd rounder" and get a blue chip prospect. Quantity for quality only happens in fantasy GMing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 4 minutes ago, Podein25 said: Yeah, I think some people are sitting there going: "trade a bunhca these guys. throw in the obligatory 2nd rounder" and get a blue chip prospect. Quantity for quality only happens in fantasy GMing. What are you talking about? Give the Leafs Mcdud, Lehtera, Weise and Neuvy for Nylander is more than enough but ok I will give them a 7th rounder too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 2 hours ago, brelic said: I can't keep track of what's been posted and what hasn't, so here you go... Say goodbye to a 2nd rounder and roster player or prospect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said: ...you could just send an offer sheet Nylander's way and really force the Leafs hand and then you would only give up draft picks. #dickmove Well now this is actually a pretty decent idea... I'm just not sure you're allowed to offer sheet a guy at this point in the season. I guess they're not technically in arbitration are they? But that makes me wonder why they're not in arbitration? Toronto would get a first, 2nd and third. Am I okay with that? I think I am. The thing is, you have to do it right now and Homer has to be the one to do it because everyone already hates him so much and then what? You just hope they don't take it out on the new guy? Then you have to make damn sure the new guy is someone that EVERYONE in the league loves. To me, that's Yzerman, but my problem with that is I do not believe that Yzerman would come work for Homer under any circumstances. It's a real interesting idea and the Flyers may be in a unique position to do it. If they were really really really clever and conniving (and I know they're not, so don't think I actually believe this is possible) Homer could get the offer sheet done and then after everyone in the league freaks out so much, just re-hire Hextall and say, "I was way off... my bad. I'm really sorry. I'm gonna let you deal with this guy again, y'all seemed to like him." Maybe Dave Scott even suspends him for the rest of the season or something. But make no mistake, a public shaming of Homer of that magnitude (probably nothing short of firing him actually) is the only way the league ever forgives the Flyers enough to cut a deal with them ever again after a B.S. move like that. Still... I kinda like it. The only question is whether you're willing to give Nylander the amount and term he actually wants that Toronto isn't willing to go to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, King Knut said: Well now this is actually a pretty decent idea... I'm just not sure you're allowed to offer sheet a guy at this point in the season. I guess they're not technically in arbitration are they? But that makes me wonder why they're not in arbitration? Toronto would get a first, 2nd and third. Am I okay with that? I think I am. The thing is, you have to do it right now and Homer has to be the one to do it because everyone already hates him so much and then what? You just hope they don't take it out on the new guy? Then you have to make damn sure the new guy is someone that EVERYONE in the league loves. To me, that's Yzerman, but my problem with that is I do not believe that Yzerman would come work for Homer under any circumstances. It's a real interesting idea and the Flyers may be in a unique position to do it. If they were really really really clever and conniving (and I know they're not, so don't think I actually believe this is possible) Homer could get the offer sheet done and then after everyone in the league freaks out so much, just re-hire Hextall and say, "I was way off... my bad. I'm really sorry. I'm gonna let you deal with this guy again, y'all seemed to like him." Maybe Dave Scott even suspends him for the rest of the season or something. But make no mistake, a public shaming of Homer of that magnitude (probably nothing short of firing him actually) is the only way the league ever forgives the Flyers enough to cut a deal with them ever again after a B.S. move like that. Still... I kinda like it. The only question is whether you're willing to give Nylander the amount and term he actually wants that Toronto isn't willing to go to. That is a very interesting idea ..... Flyers would really be hated but you potentially get a guy without giving up prospects. However, as some on here have mentioned...is he actually worth it ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 3 minutes ago, pilldoc said: That is a very interesting idea ..... Flyers would really be hated but you potentially get a guy without giving up prospects. However, as some on here have mentioned...is he actually worth it ???? Is he worth 8 million right now? No. But he could easily be worth 8 million very soon. He's actually pretty damn good. The major knock is what? That he doesn't have the compete level? That he's holding out so he must be a locker room cancer? I don't like it, none of us do, but him holding out actually makes a lot of sense. It shows that he's looking forward. With Matthews and Tavares in place, there's no way Nylander will ever be anything more than a 3C on this team. With Marner and Lindholm and Kapanen and Kadri and even Reilly and Leivo doing as well as they are, he's not even going to get much PP time over the next 4-5 years. Toronto has to sign him now and they have a TON of cap space. Next year however, they are going to have to sign all the guys currently kicking butt without Nylander in the lineup. Mitch Marner alone is going to get a LOT of money and he'll have earned MORE than Nylander. But including Nylander, there are 7 other RFAs on their roster that they'll want to keep INCLUDING Austin Matthews and they're only going to have about $32 million to do it. Assume Matthews is looking at 10 million alone and Marner will probably get 7 at least. That's more than half of their cap space on two guys leaving about $3 Million per every remaining RFA needing to be signed. This doesn't even include replacing either the two starting D men who will go UFA next summer. Even if they resign Nylander now at the reported $6million they offered him, then they'd have abuot $9million for 4 guys that include 3 of their top 6 scorers and power play producers. Yes, they will get $8 million more off the books in two seasons which is why they're hoping to get Nylander on a shorter term bridge deal now. If they are forced to sign him now, they'll probably have to buy out Patrick Marleau who is still helpful even though he's older than the hills. Now if I'm Nylander (or his agent), I'm looking at that situation and I'm saying, I'm now their 3C. I'm not getting great PP minutes anymore. I'm not playing with Matthews or Tavares or Marner or even Kappanen or Lindholm at this point. How on earth am I going to put up the Point Per Game numbers that I know I could be and that I know would earn me $8 million after I do it for two years? I'm not. However, if I force their hand now, I'll either get the deal I want or they'll have to trade me to a team that I could get those numbers for and that I could get that deal from in two years. It actually makes a lot of sense and seems pretty savvy. And before everyone goes off on me about how that's not the way a team player does it, I'll just ask about all that "it's a business" talk that got Hextall fired. It's a business and the Leafs are currently dealing with a businessman playing hardball. Now the offer sheet idea... it kinda gets everyone off the hook. Nylander gets his deal without having to earn it. Toronto gets a pretty decent return for a player they're leading the league without and they get to kick the can down the road a bit on all their cap issues. What's MORE, if Toronto wants to add a piece at the deadline for their cup run, they now have an extra first, 2nd and third rounder to play with. They could even trade us our first back to us for Simmonds at the deadline! It's not going to happen... but this is actually starting to look like a win win win... which almost never happens. Biggest losers would be the Flyers, but they apparently don't care about cap space or picks anymore, so why not pull the trigger? I like this idea a lot now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 2 hours ago, brelic said: Whether it's Panarin, Nylander, Grubauer, Varlamov, and on and on, it's gonna cost more than picks. Bingo... however, signing Panarin or Varlamov will only cost you dollars IF YOU WAIT UNTIL JULY. 2 hours ago, brelic said: Would you be willing to part with Sanheim in any trade? What about Frost? Ghost? Farabee? It would have to be a helluva trade, and frankly speaking, trading Sanheim would never get us an upgrade on Defense and that's what this team actually needs most personnel wise IMHO. I would not trade any of them for a "proven" goalie now because I can get a "proven" goalie as a UFA in 6 months, thus keeping my top Defensive prospects. By making moves now, Homer and Scott could make the Flyers better this season. By waiting until the Summer, Hextall would have made the Flyers better for the next 10 seasons. Despite Grabner (that's really the big one because I still DO NOT BLAME HIM FOR THE GOALIE SITUATION) Hextall had the right path for this team... if He'd have just fired the G.D. coach after the Toronto game, we'd still be on the right path and getting closer to a BETTER one --because I believe this team won't ever be great with this staff-- and on our way to signing those guys everyone's talking about next summer. It's for this reason I'm mad at Hextall. Not for not signing friggin' Grabner. For being so loyal to his crappy coaching gamble (it was a gamble you win some, you lose some) that he screwed his entire plan for the sake of that loyalty. At what point to you veer from your "process" for the sake of preserving some portion of your process? By not firing Hakstol, he destroyed his process and put this team back in the sweaty hands of the itchiest trigger finger in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 1 hour ago, King Knut said: I'm just not sure you're allowed to offer sheet a guy at this point in the season. Yes you are he isn't under contract...you have till December 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 2 hours ago, pilldoc said: However, as some on here have mentioned...is he actually worth it ???? I would be more interested in just giving up the picks than say a defenseman like Sanheim who is here now and you are already 4 years invested into his development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 44 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Yes you are he isn't under contract...you have till December 1st. Do it Homer. They’ll have to maintenance the reaction, but do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 41 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: I would be more interested in just giving up the picks than say a defenseman like Sanheim who is here now and you are already 4 invested into his development. Bingo. Toronto May happily do this just for the picks at this point. It’s going to be REALLY hard to pay their roster next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 27, 2018 Author Share Posted November 27, 2018 41 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: I would be more interested in just giving up the picks than say a defenseman like Sanheim who is here now and you are already 4 invested into his development. Bingo. Toronto May happily do this just for the picks at this point. It’s going to be REALLY hard to pay their roster next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FD19372 Posted November 27, 2018 Share Posted November 27, 2018 8 minutes ago, King Knut said: Bingo. Toronto May happily do this just for the picks at this point. It’s going to be REALLY hard to pay their roster next year. Yeah, but I don't know that I really want Nylander at 6 mil + per, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaskaFlyerFan Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 4 hours ago, King Knut said: The thing is, you have to do it right now and Homer has to be the one to do it because everyone already hates him so much and then what? You just hope they don't take it out on the new guy? Then you have to make damn sure the new guy is someone that EVERYONE in the league loves. To me, that's Yzerman, but my problem with that is I do not believe that Yzerman would come work for Homer under any circumstances. Why wouldn't he? Think about it. Its an ideal situation for a GM to step into...A young team with a decent core, house money to play with that the upper management wants you to spend, a slew of draft picks, and a stocked farm system. Plus he can come in and fire the current head coach and bring in Quenneville or any other coach of his choosing. And if Stevie Y came in, why wouldn't any coach want to take the job here and be in that situation? One can dream... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 28, 2018 Author Share Posted November 28, 2018 59 minutes ago, AlaskaFlyerFan said: Why wouldn't he? Think about it. Its an ideal situation for a GM to step into...A young team with a decent core, house money to play with that the upper management wants you to spend, a slew of draft picks, and a stocked farm system. Plus he can come in and fire the current head coach and bring in Quenneville or any other coach of his choosing. And if Stevie Y came in, why wouldn't any coach want to take the job here and be in that situation? One can dream... Pretty sure he hates Homer. Probably not thrilled by seeing how Homer just treated the guy who fixed all the problems Homer crested either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted November 28, 2018 Author Share Posted November 28, 2018 3 hours ago, FD19372 said: Yeah, but I don't know that I really want Nylander at 6 mil + per, either. He’s outperforming any current Flyer at the same age. Why on earth would t you want him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 4 minutes ago, King Knut said: He’s outperforming any current Flyer at the same age. Why on earth would t you want him? Nylander for Nolan Patrick. Do it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 7 hours ago, King Knut said: And it should, right? At least if it's Nylander, they're getting a 22 year old kid who is pretty good now and can still get better. I'd totally send a pick for that actually. Maybe even Simmonds. But Toronto holds all the cards and they will want something to push for a cup now and they'll know that they can get more than Simmonds on a rental for a 22 year old RFA. They'll want Ghost or Provo or Sanheim. I'm on board with Nylander. If it was Sanheim and a 2nd round pick, do you do it? I think I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 6 minutes ago, King Knut said: He’s outperforming any current Flyer at the same age. Why on earth would t you want him? I think the hesitation is being able to afford new contracts for Patrick and Provorov and Konecny. I don't want to give up on Patrick, but right now as I type I'd risk not being able up afford Patrick to get Nylander. We'd get something for Patrick when the time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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