Classic Disaster

[trevluk]

I was realy looking forward to the Winter Classic but now I am beginning to dread it. If Bryz is in net this could end up being an embarassment for the Flyers on national television against a rival team that is playing far superior hockey over the last few games. Then again maybe getting embarassed in front of the hockey world will be just the medicine this team needs and the push that Lavi needs to finally play the goalie that is playing better.

[flyercanuck]

When you have a goalie playing down to Bryzgalovs level, it's hard to play your game when you're cringing EVERY...SINGLE...TIME there's a shot on net. He has no lateral movement. He has no glove hand. He has a Gi-normus 5 hole. He can't handle the puck. WTF did anyone see in this guy???

[s3x]

Only the Flyers would find a way to take excitement about the Winter Classic away from their fans.

[Mad Dog]

I think even the Flyers themsleves (and I mean Holmgren, his assistants and Snider) realized a while ago how big of a mistake they made by signing this clown to the contract they did. What a disaster this truly is. When he implodes in the playoffs - and I really hope he does suck real bad - the team will be urged to make some drastic merasures to rid themsleves of this ludicrous contract. I don't even think it's even a question of IF, but WHEN. And I really hope it's as soon as this summer. They will have to get creative...

Edited December 28, 2011 by Mad Dog

[Flyguys03]

Oh yeah, they are gonna get smoked. They don't match up well against NY. If they want any prayer in the POs, they need to hope some teams eliminate Boston and NY.

[canoli]

Well there's still tomorrow night's game to turn things around - team-wide - get back in the win column. Not so much for Bryzgalov because I doubt he starts. But it's true what you guys are saying, the Rags are playing extremely well right now and we are...getting half-ass goaltending. The hope is (for the WC) we have the crowd, the momentum, the pride of the city etc. behind us and our offense goes on a tear, puts up 5, 6 goals. If Bryzgalov starts the WC that's prob the only way we take the 2 points that day.

What a crying shame we have this clown in net this year. I never dreamed our rookies would contribute on such a high level, that Jagr would look like he's 29 not 39, that our D without Pronger could still hold its own. But it's all for nothing if the guy between the pipes lets in teeny-tiny deflections, if every shot he swats back out into traffic - if he can't cover a puck that drops right in front of him and lets Callahan roof it over his head for an easy goal...

What a damn shame...

[Vincent05]

If they keep starting him and he's playing the way he is, you think we will make the playoffs???? Man, the first 2 months started with so much hope, how in just a few weeks changed so much.

@Mad Dog

It's a bad way of thinking but I'm with you there. We don't need this BS for another 8 years, don't know if Weber will make a big difference right now with this bum. Only if Bob somehow saves our season and stand on his head then Weber will help but we don't know for sure. Should we tank this year to get rid of Bryz and get in better position to draft a good dman in the upcomming draft? If they do somehow get rid of Bryz in the summer (free buyout with new CBA), I expect a Weber or Suter in orange and black next year.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Vincent05

[hf101]

I think even the Flyers themsleves (and I mean Holmgren, his assistants and Snider) realized a while ago how big of a mistake they made by signing this clown to the contract they did. What a disaster this truly is. When he implodes in the playoffs - and I really hope he does suck real bad - the team will be urged to make some drastic merasures to rid themsleves of this ludicrous contract. I don't even think it's even a question of IF, but WHEN. And I really hope it's as soon as this summer. They will have to get creative...

If they keep playing Bryz they won't be playing in the playoffs.

If they realized they've made a mistake then......put Bryz on the bench and play Bob!

[Mad Dog]

If they keep playing Bryz they won't be playing in the playoffs.

If they realized they've made a mistake then......put Bryz on the bench and play Bob!

It's all nice and good, but the problem is, it's difficult to justify letting your $6+ mil goalie ride a pine. I am sure Comcast Spectator follows the sport since it's their team and will want an explanation why their money is getting washed down the drain. Hell, Snider himslef, I am sure, will want a justification of the investment.

If somehow, by miracle, they can find a team who would be willing to take this joke off the Flyers' hands even for offering the Flyers nothing back in return, that would be incredible. Otherwise, they are stuck with him until at least the off-season.

But decision-wise, I am 100% with you. Bob has done nothing to lose his job as a #1 goalie. It's a no-brainer.

[flyercanuck]

It's all nice and good, but the problem is, it's difficult to justify letting your $6+ mil goalie ride a pine. I am sure Comcast Spectator follows the sport since it's their team and will want an explanation why their money is getting washed down the drain. Hell, Snider himslef, I am sure, will want a justification of the investment.

If somehow, by miracle, they can find a team who would be willing to take this joke off the Flyers' hands even for offering the Flyers nothing back in return, that would be incredible. Otherwise, they are stuck with him until at least the off-season.

But decision-wise, I am 100% with you. Bob has done nothing to lose his job as a #1 goalie. It's a no-brainer.

Snider, YOUR idea of a goalie is horrible. There's your justification.

Nothing in return? Heck I'd trade every pick but our first for the next 3 years just to get rid of him. And I'm not kidding.

Edited December 28, 2011 by flyercanuck

[hf101]

I'm sure they will lose a lot more money in the future it this team is allowed to sink to the depths of the league with a starting goaltender that can't move quick enough to catch a beach ball.

How can they justify putting a wealthy goaltender out there every night that in essence will give the team a loss due to crappy goaltending?

[Mad Dog]

One team that must be laughing their assess off right now is Phoenix. Until his recent injury, Mike Smith has been doing exactly what Bryzgalov was *expected* to do here: win games. And he didn't haver to cost them $6 mil/year for the next 100 years.

[hf101]

@MadDog

I know I for one thought the Flyers should have sought after Smith. Can't say that opinion had much support.

But I also though Bryz might make a good tandem with Bob for a few years, but not at the ridiculous deal Holmgren allowed.

[Mad Dog]

@hf101

To be fair, at the time of the acquisition I liked the fact we were getting (what I thought) a legit #1 goalie. I didn't like the contract, but I figured that was the market for his services.

What I didn't anticipate is to see how bad he is. My God....... We really acquired a mediocre goalie and on top of that, had to pay through the nose.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Mad Dog

[radoran]

Bob has done nothing to lose his job as a #1 goalie. It's a no-brainer.

My only point here is that Bob has done precious little to EARN a job as a #1 goalie.

If he had, we wouldn't be in this situation. His collapse at the end of last season and in the playoffs put the fear into management that they "needed a #1 G now"

Washington's deal with Vokoun reveals their decision about Bryzgalov as the panicky, knee-jerk style that they have used for at least the past few decades.

Who else out there would have bid for Bryzgalov last season??

[Vincent05]

@radoran

BoB did nothing to earn the no.1 but Bryz is playing himself out of the no.1 goalie. Do we have any other options right now? I agree that was a knee jerk reaction last offseason. Brian Burke had him and the Leafs had a unproven goalie going into the season and he didn't even make a pitch for Bryz at all. That tells the tale of how he thought of Bryz.

[radoran]

@radoran

BoB did nothing to earn the no.1 but Bryz is playing himself out of the no.1 goalie. Do we have any other options right now? I agree that was a knee jerk reaction last offseason. Brian Burke had him and the Leafs had a unproven goalie going into the season and he didn't even make a pitch for Bryz at all. That tells the tale of how he thought of Bryz.

I was just responding to MD saying that Bob hasn't done anything to lose his job as a #1 goalie. He did. Ending last season with four losses and getting pulled against the Islanders and then imploding in Game 2 (I would have gone back to him in Game 3 but that's another story).

That's why he wasn't the #1 goalie coming into this season and has not been the #1 goalie this season.

I just don't know if the forest Bryz is in is the size of the universe or if he can find his way out of it.

I do think that the coach simply doing the same things expecting different results - which is what I see out there - isn't working. Go more defensive. Tighten up. Be a tough team to play against. You've got three good scoring lines and should be able to score from that position. Heck, Hitchcock's teams did. The 03-04 squad had five 20-goal scorers and Roenick with 19 in 62 games, plus two more 10+ players.

Heck, Eshe was 2.04/.915 behind a pretty defensive-minded team.

And, no matter what happens - NO LEIGHTON.

[Mad Dog]

@radoran

I don't disagree, Rad. Bob hasn't quite put the world on fire, either. The only comment I would have to this is the disparity in salaries. Bob is an average goalie and so is Bryz. But Bryz is getting paid the money of a premier goalie. It really makes very little sense to stick with him moving forward. The Flyers seem to be in a position to stick with him at least through the end of this year. But moving into the next season (unless Bryz suddenly proves us all wrong), I think they have to stop screwing with this. There may be no better options as premier goalies are tough to come by. I think Bob has a decent skill set and can grow into a good, while not spectacular goalie.

Bob may not be the answer, but this may just be a situation where the Flyers would be finding a way out of a pile of crap they chose to step into this past summer.

[TedZep]

Hi, Devil's Advocate here. Prior to this losing streak Bryzgalov did win 6 or so in a row with a GAA of 1.66 or some such. If I were Lavvy I would platoon the goalies, spark a competition, burdensome contract be damned.

No matter what, the Flyers are going to have the most expensive backup goalie in the league.

[radoran]

@Mad Dog

As you note, "premier goalies are tough to come by" - why the Flyers thought that at the exact moment they decided they "needed" a "#1 G" that the universe would simply drop one in their laps is beyond me.

They didn't "need' to sign a guy this past offseason - they NEEDED a PLAN to get/develop a premier goalie. A "plan" isn't the owner telling the GM to acquire a guy who had four career appearances against the Flyers. And three starts. Granted he was 1.86/.927 in those games - and @TedZep notes Bryz does have the capability of playing to that level - but how many times could Snider POSSIBLY have seen Bryzgalov actually play?

I don't think Bryz's situation will improve with "competition" - it's not lack of effort of desire at this point. It is simply that he is not the world-beating goalie he was touted as by Flyer management.

At this point, IMO, the best thing Lavy could do is get his team to, yes, play tighter defense. Let's look at Tampa. It wasn't Bryzgalov who lost track of Steven "leading the league in goals" Stamkos in the slot right in front of Bryz. It was Giroux. And it wasn't Bryzgalov who left Stamkos open again on the power play, nor was he responsible for the penalty.

You leave Steve Stamkos wide open in the slot or alone on the left side during a power play and more often than not you're going to have two goals against no matter WHO is in goal.

The Schenn screen/redirect on goal one is debateable - but there have been a ridiculous amount of deflections and "own goal" deflections this season (IMO).

The Downie goal was inexcusable. And indicative of Bryz's lack of lateral mobility.

On top of that, you have forwards who, IMO, are more interested in being at the front of a rush than making sure some of the league's most dangerous players are covered down low.

Bryz has played abysmally. But you can't really say the Flyers have been playing solid team defense in front of him.

[Mad Dog]

@Mad Dog

At this point, IMO, the best thing Lavy could do is get his team to, yes, play tighter defense.

And I am sure they tried it and are still working on it. My guess, they are working on it at each practice because after Bryzgalov's pathetic perfoprmance, team's sporadic D is the next glaring issue. Laviolette knows it. But I don't know how much he can improve that, honestly. Without Pronger, this is just not the same group. And the whole team defense has been very inconsistent at best. But this group is what it is. Unless they trade for either Letang or Weber (both of whom actually happen to be out with concussion, by the way) or someone of Dion Phaneuf's caliber, this defense will be pretty much the way we see it today.

But they *can* make a change in net. This, to me, is what Holmgren and the coaching staff should be working on as we speak... or this will be another disappointing season before we notice it.

Edited December 28, 2011 by Mad Dog

[mojo1917]

@Mad Dog

dion phaneuf ?

did he all of the sudden get the suck off of himself... that guy was so overrated the last time i saw him, has he turned into a beast in toronto ?

unless that's happened, i'd pick a different cat to use as an example. how about francois beauchamin , he's solid , tough and may actually fit into the salary cap... in truth, when we traded for pronger, beauchamin was the guy i was hoping we'd sign to bolster the corps.

Edited December 28, 2011 by mojo1917

[DaGreatGazoo]

His goals against average has crept above 3.00 and his save percentage has dropped to the bottom five in the NHL (third lowest among goalies who have made 20 or more starts)

Read that sentence over and over and over....Bryz is making $10,000,000.00 this year. Yes, that's 10 million. The highest salary in the league this year for a goalie, and I believe the highest 1 yr goalie salary in NHL history. He is also signed for 8 more years. He was signed to stop the goalie carousel, he was signed to be the goalie we haven't had for 20 years, he was signed to be better than he has been. I don't care about the teams' play in front of him, I don't care that Pronger is out..none of it matters...none of it. This team is where it is for every reason BUT the goalie!!!

We(myself included) KILL a kid like JVR...yet we all continue to make excuses for the the goalie. His play is unacceptable, he is not making key saves, he is not making big saves, and he is not helping his team. Damn..does he pass the "eyeball" test right now???? NO!

Can he get better, can he be the goalie they Flyers thought they signed, can he carry the team..I think the answer to all those is yes. I'm not giving up hope, and there's a lot of hockey left this year. But for me...I'm tired of the excuses, apologists, etc...step up, own the crease, make the key saves, inspire your teammates. EARN YOUR ******* PAYCHECK!!!

[Vincent05]

EARN YOUR ******* PAYCHECK!!!

I think we all agree with your points but this is America, when has someone really earned their paycheck?

[radoran]

Without Pronger, this is just not the same group. And the whole team defense has been very inconsistent at best. But this group is what it is. ...

But they *can* make a change in net. This, to me, is what Holmgren and the coaching staff should be working on as we speak... or this will be another disappointing season before we notice it.

I'm not expecting a Cup, but they should make the playoffs.

I'm not opposed to a change in net at all. But I don't expect it to make a blossoming bit of difference if the team keeps leaving players like Steven Stamkos wide open in scoring position.

The goalies also are what they are. And the Flyers shot themselves in the foot with how they've handled Bob, IMO.