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New Gm. Still early but alot to prove


ezlot76

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While he hasn't even hit the draft yet, not liking the moves yet. Hate the Gudbranson traderik and not happy with giving up a 2nd Rd pick just to dump Savard. While the latter might be ownership pressure, we got 2 Ahl guys I'm return. If we were up again the cap it would be one thing.... now if we can sign Yandle this trade would be alright. Curious what the general consensus is here

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Looks like the Panthers have a plan to replace the 2nd defensive pair.  The plan is imo, to become a better fast skating puck possession defense and the stay at home Gudbranson didn't fit that plan. While the Gudbranson trade was one that surprised all of us, I don't think that the Panthers made a bad deal.  They got a former #1 pick and potentially top 6 forward for him plus picks.  There are many who think that Gudbranson although playing top 4 minutes also isn't a top 4 d-man, so I think it will be interesting to see where he plays in Vancouver.  By the numbers, Gudbranson  bleeds shots against, drags down the possession of his teammates, and provides no offense, and $3.5M is a lot to pay for a 3rd pairing d-man.

 

They are also planning to let Campbell walk and Yandle is his younger replacement. Why wouldn't Yandle sign a new contract with the Panthers? By removing both Campbell and Gudbranson they freed up over $11.5 M in cap space which is more than enough to sign Yandle plus have extra money to sign their talented young forwards such as Trocheck.

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6 hours ago, hf101 said:

Looks like the Panthers have a plan to replace the 2nd defensive pair.  The plan is imo, to become a better fast skating puck possession defense and the stay at home Gudbranson didn't fit that plan. While the Gudbranson trade was one that surprised all of us, I don't think that the Panthers made a bad deal.  They got a former #1 pick and potentially top 6 forward for him plus picks.  There are many who think that Gudbranson although playing top 4 minutes also isn't a top 4 d-man, so I think it will be interesting to see where he plays in Vancouver.  By the numbers, Gudbranson  bleeds shots against, drags down the possession of his teammates, and provides no offense, and $3.5M is a lot to pay for a 3rd pairing d-man.

 

They are also planning to let Campbell walk and Yandle is his younger replacement. Why wouldn't Yandle sign a new contract with the Panthers? By removing both Campbell and Gudbranson they freed up over $11.5 M in cap space which is more than enough to sign Yandle plus have extra money to sign their talented young forwards such as Trocheck.

While I get what you're saying, I dont agree with the move. Guddy might not be an offensive juggernaut by any means, but had hard shot. He was also pretty good skater and never seen him dragging down anything. Makes smart plays most of time. He was a shut down defenseman who played against the best fowards, so yeah there was some shots but to be expected. We now have no one to replace him in that style. He was a leader and one of few players on team with an edge. We got bullied in playoffs and he was one of few to step up. Now it got worse. He was also a first rd pick, and only couple years older. We escentially traded a top pairing defenseman for, at best this year and probably more, an out of position 4th line winger( 3rd top end). With Loungo getting up there and Montoya not far behind with no goalie ready for at least couple seasons we needed to build a little more for now. We got softer without adding much more offense. Id worry about the cap space if we were at all in danger of reaching it but we are good. Hope we could sign Yandle, as hed help. Not heartbroken about losing Cambell, he was good for us but also getting up there and we have other guys that can take his place.

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Willie Mitchell is done, Campbell likely wont be retained, Gudbranson has been dealt. Rumors are that they are kicking the tires on dealing Kulikov. That would be literally two thirds of a division winning defense. Even keeping Kulikov there is a serious vacuum on the back end that needs filled.

  Matheson is a solid puck moving prospect who should stick. Yandle if they sign him is the cherry on top, a favorite of mine for a long time, I have been hoping to see him wear the winged wheel but instead the odds are big that he will be playing against us in the own division. My initial reaction was a word that rhymes with fit.

  So if you look at it as late season addition Kindl replacing Mitchell, nothing fancy but can move the puck a bit, Yandle replacing Campbell, a serious upgrade as Yandle is a power play specialist and more, and then Matheson replacing Gudbranson, a hit defensively but a massive step up offensively, the back end will be joining the rush with all three pairs next year. And Bjugstad is not only generating whispers but they are getting louder. Rumor is with the development of Trochek and the addition of McCann that Bjugstad may be moved out for additional help on the back end.

  Well balanced team with a plan.

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46 minutes ago, yave1964 said:

Willie Mitchell is done, Campbell likely wont be retained, Gudbranson has been dealt. Rumors are that they are kicking the tires on dealing Kulikov. That would be literally two thirds of a division winning defense. Even keeping Kulikov there is a serious vacuum on the back end that needs filled.

  Matheson is a solid puck moving prospect who should stick. Yandle if they sign him is the cherry on top, a favorite of mine for a long time, I have been hoping to see him wear the winged wheel but instead the odds are big that he will be playing against us in the own division. My initial reaction was a word that rhymes with fit.

  So if you look at it as late season addition Kindl replacing Mitchell, nothing fancy but can move the puck a bit, Yandle replacing Campbell, a serious upgrade as Yandle is a power play specialist and more, and then Matheson replacing Gudbranson, a hit defensively but a massive step up offensively, the back end will be joining the rush with all three pairs next year. And Bjugstad is not only generating whispers but they are getting louder. Rumor is with the development of Trochek and the addition of McCann that Bjugstad may be moved out for additional help on the back end.

  Well balanced team with a plan.

Yes with all that being said, it looks like we are building to be regular season champs again. Does us no good when we cant win a playoff series like that though. we need some mix, unless you can be that much more skilled, and were not. we sign Yandle, I'll be happy giving a 4th and 6th for him, no prob. Be very mad we trade Bjugstad.  I believe hes a huge part of this team and its developement. He started slow, and had the concussion and all, but he finished strong and played well in the playoffs. with his size and skill be a shame to lose him. Kulikov I'm torn on. For the right deal, absolutely. he is just so inconsistent. Some times he shows you hes a extremely talented player, than he goes off deep edge and has couple awful games and makes horrible plays. I call him Dr.Jeckle.

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@ezlot76

 

Kulikov for Pysyk made no sense to me, Kulikov has been a steady producer for 7 years on the back end. Not flashy, but like Gudbranson a good player who does the dirty work and allows his partner to roam.

  I still like the Gudbranson trade for the Panthers, I think McCann will be a great fit, but this one, I am not sure what the thinking is. Pysyk has a bit more offense upside , a bit but not much mind you. He has a whopping 5 goals in 125 games over 4 years. This deal makes no sense.

 

   Yandle for Campbell, Matheson for Gudbranson, Pysyk for Kulikov, the back end has more offense than in years past now, but weaker in coverage, weaker in helping out Luongo. And the trade for Berra and letting Montoya go makes no sense.

  So yeah, I see your point, a strange summer for the Cats so far.

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1 hour ago, yave1964 said:

@ezlot76

 

Kulikov for Pysyk made no sense to me, Kulikov has been a steady producer for 7 years on the back end. Not flashy, but like Gudbranson a good player who does the dirty work and allows his partner to roam.

  I still like the Gudbranson trade for the Panthers, I think McCann will be a great fit, but this one, I am not sure what the thinking is. Pysyk has a bit more offense upside , a bit but not much mind you. He has a whopping 5 goals in 125 games over 4 years. This deal makes no sense.

 

   Yandle for Campbell, Matheson for Gudbranson, Pysyk for Kulikov, the back end has more offense than in years past now, but weaker in coverage, weaker in helping out Luongo. And the trade for Berra and letting Montoya go makes no sense.

  So yeah, I see your point, a strange summer for the Cats so far.

And that first Rd pick. He was at highest slotted late 2nd Rd that I read. Heck hockey news had him 77. To take him that high with everyone that was still available was crazy 

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12 hours ago, ezlot76 said:

And that first Rd pick. He was at highest slotted late 2nd Rd that I read. Heck hockey news had him 77. To take him that high with everyone that was still available was crazy 

I know I was blown away, thinking Whatt!!!????

 

  Sometimes the new and improved kids who come along wanting to deride the old way as archaic and who try to reinvent the wheel your your guys in florida and the child out in Arizona should simply take a step back and instead of mocking the old ways and the old thought process should consider why it has worked for 40 or 50 years instead of slinging slurs and automatically saying that there way is better. There is a reason that it has worked so long, it is not because nobody has tried anything new, every decade or so someone tries to reinvent the wheel and they quickly fade into oblivion, the old ways work. Not saying that there is anything wrong with trying something new, with adding to what has always worked, but to completely throw away the old ways of team building and go with a foreign concept is as a rule foolhardy. Just like Boucher in Tampa had success for a year with his weird trap system and like the Devils and Wings with the left wing lock for a short time, after awhile the old timers adjust and that is that. Short term success at best is usually replaced with becoming a footnote. At best.

  That said, I do like the additions of Yandle and the kid Matheson going to be a regular. I believe Ekblad is ready to gear it up to another level, if he and Yandle play on the same power play it will be unstopable, with Matheson QB'ing the second unit. Not sure about the defense in 5 on 5 or on the P/K but there is still penty of time. And again I like McCann and think you won the trade.

  It is not the trade of Gudbranson, or the trade of Kulikov, or the retirement of Mitchell, or the showing of the door to Campbell, it is all of it combined. Two thirds of the defense is gone, it may take awhile for them to gel and get it together. There is still time to get a few more defensive bodies for the back end and they can be added for cheap, I am in agreement that Gudbranson and Kulikov were at the stage of the career of a stay at home d-man where they start becoming overpaid. Not overrated, but overpaid for what they bring to a team especially if they are still with the team with which they found their frist success. I get it, sort of, but man that is a lot of changes on the back end. This is not Ottawa or Colorado with bad boring defenses this is a team that won their division. I would have kept at least one of Gudbranson or Kulikov. I get Mitchell and Campbell but too much change is a shock to the system.

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I looked up what the Panthers have for talent on defense coming up the pipeline and it appears that the roles of Gudbranson might be replaced with Ian McCoshen, who would be a senior this year at Boston College.  Having a roster spot ready and awaiting probably is key to forgoing the last year of college.

 

Quote

McCoshen has the type of size that NHL teams covet in a defender but doesn't always put that size to good use. He has some offensive ability, including an above-average snapshot, that would be useful on any NHL power-play. McCoshen uses his long reach well and is generally sound in his own end but could stand to be a bit more physical with opposing forwards. -- HockeysFuture

 

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Yes I know of this kid and happy to have him. But we need now. And even when he comes up it will be at least a couple yrs most likely to be able to get to Guddy's level. Would be nice to have Guddy here to mentor him. Besides with what this gm seems to want, I'm doubting we ever see him up with us

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17 minutes ago, ezlot76 said:

Yes I know of this kid and happy to have him. But we need now. And even when he comes up it will be at least a couple yrs most likely to be able to get to Guddy's level. Would be nice to have Guddy here to mentor him. Besides with what this gm seems to want, I'm doubting we ever see him up with us

 

I think he'll definitely play with the Panthers, the only if imo, is whether or not he plays this year.  Rowe could also be looking to add a FA D-man.  Luke Schenn wouldn't be a bad choice for a stay at home guy.

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  • 5 months later...

Yeah, I'm afraid you're in for dark times, @ezlot76.   It just doesn't seem like the GM has any idea what he's doing. 

 

Who knows, it's early.  Maybe he has some plan and Gallant wasn't his guy.   It's a head scratcher, though.

 

@FD19372 said it jokingly, but Jagr as player-coach?

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4 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

Yeah, I'm afraid you're in for dark times, @ezlot76.   It just doesn't seem like the GM has any idea what he's doing. 

 

Who knows, it's early.  Maybe he has some plan and Gallant wasn't his guy.   It's a head scratcher, though.

 

@FD19372 said it jokingly, but Jagr as player-coach?

I only said it half-jokingly just because I think Florida management is so inept, they won't even try it. They could do worse than one of the top 10 players to ever play the game. The players would just have to overcome the 'in awe' factor. I think Jagr's personality might allow it to work.

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11 hours ago, hf101 said:

 

 

That's all fine, but Steve Simmons has a complete and total axe to grind with anything related to analytics and their influence on hockey. He takes the time only to point out only what he sees as the debits and never the credits, and has zero objectivity on this issue.

 

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4 minutes ago, JR Ewing said:

 

That's all fine, but Steve Simmons has a complete and total axe to grind with anything related to analytics and their influence on hockey. He takes the time only to point out only what he sees as the debits and never the credits, and has zero objectivity on this issue.

 

 

Even the way he says it is so condescending:

 

"The most clueless front office in the NHL fires Gerard Gallant as coach. Guess the computer boys ran the numbers and it didn't add up."  - Steve Simmons

 

So somehow people like me are "computer boys" because we choose to analyze the game using more than just our gut feeling? Because we choose to use advanced statistics? When it happens in every other profession, they refer to these people by such names as:

  • Financial planners (the folks that analyze your investments)
  • Chartered Accountants (the folks that analyze the health of your business)
  • Statistical Analysts (the folks that analyze how darn near everything in our society works)

This is my way of giving a proverbial middle finger to the neanderthal: Mr. Simmons.  Steve Simmons, it's okay if you failed grade 10 math in school, but don't take it out on the people that succeeded.  :)

 

 

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12 hours ago, ruxpin said:

Yeah, I'm afraid you're in for dark times, @ezlot76.   It just doesn't seem like the GM has any idea what he's doing. 

 

Who knows, it's early.  Maybe he has some plan and Gallant wasn't his guy.   It's a head scratcher, though.

 

@FD19372 said it jokingly, but Jagr as player-coach?

Gallant definitely wasn't his guy. Only reason he kept job this long is because of his success. They were waiting for opportunity to finish cleaning house, like new owners doing everywhere. And some places might have needed, some didn't. Viola wants only his guys here, no matter what, and hockey knowledge is apparantly not required. Locally coming out more and more the tensions between Gallant and front office. The fan reaction is real bad, and waiting for them to turn this into our now figure head(cause he was also to successful to fire) Tallons fault, so they can let him go to.

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  • 3 weeks later...
1 minute ago, J0e Th0rnton said:

Oh look. Tallon is back in charge!

 

lolol.

 

He was basically bulled out of his position to make room for statisticians and now the owners realize how stupid they are and bring him right back.

 

Ill bust a gut if he hires gallant back

Weird story right now. Dreger announced it, local guys silent. Than 1 local guy tweets his respect for Dreger but says sources say it's untrue. Than erases tweet just to tweet 10 mins later confidential sources again say untrue. Than reporter from other paper reports Tallon has "increased " personnel role. Something funny. But yeah I'd love if he rehired Gallant just for the reaction! This also would leave Tallon open to being scapegoat, so as to be able to fire him saying it's his fault we couldn't turn it aroind. 

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