Flyers (now drafting #2 overall) and the 2017 NHL Draft (now with Poll)

[OccamsRazor]

Ok after watching as much video as i can i want the Flyers to get Nico....i just do.

[pilldoc]

51 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

Ok after watching as much video as i can i want the Flyers to get Nico....i just do.

 

I hear ya.  I agree...my first gut reaction was Patrick, however, I am slowly leaning towards to Nico

[brelic]

Can't remember if this was already posted, but it's got some interesting quotes. 

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/nhl-team-reps-say-nolan-patrick-vs-nico-hischier/

 

What stands out for me is how Patrick seems to be viewed as a player who makes those around him better. A true leader. 

 

I don't see those same feelings about Hischier. He seems like he might be more of a complementary player at the NHL level. 

 

Hard to say, but if I'm thinking long term, Giroux replacement, I'd probably want Patrick. Maybe we already have those complementary players in Konecny, Lindblom, etc. 

 

 

[OccamsRazor]

39 minutes ago, brelic said:

What stands out for me is how Patrick seems to be viewed as a player who makes those around him better

 

 

Yeah and i have to believe he gets some credit for when Ivan was there and helping lead by example as we have seen it first hand by him in the pros.

 

So he too was getting credit from having such great teammates such as Ivan, Macoy Erkamps, Jayce Hawryluk, Quenneville and Tim Mcgauley to name a few.

 

But this past year he couldn't get them out the 1st round. Now sure it wasn't all his fault because not having all those great players hurts him as well.

 

So as he shouldn't get all the blame he to can't get all the credit. With that said i hope you're right. Patrick goes to Devils and Flyers get Nico. I like it.

[AJgoal]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

But this past year he couldn't get them out the 1st round. Now sure it wasn't all his fault because not having all those great players hurts him as well.

 

You realize he was injured and missed the playoffs this year, right? 

 

I tend to lean Patrick only because there is a decent amount of opinion that Hischier could be a wing in the NHL, and a right wing to boot. Patrick seems to be a lock at center. I'm still happy with either, but good centers are tougher to get than wingers. 

 

Either way, it's not like the Flyers are going to go off board here. They're getting whoever Jersey doesn't. And that's great for the rebuild.

[flyercanuck]

2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

 

 

But this past year he couldn't get them out the 1st round. Now sure it wasn't all his fault because not having all those great players hurts him as well.

 

 

 

Neither did Hischier.

[OccamsRazor]

26 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

You realize he was injured and missed the playoffs this year, right? 

 

I tend to lean Patrick only because there is a decent amount of opinion that Hischier could be a wing in the NHL, and a right wing to boot. Patrick seems to be a lock at center. I'm still happy with either, but good centers are tougher to get than wingers. 

 

Either way, it's not like the Flyers are going to go off board here. They're getting whoever Jersey doesn't. And that's great for the rebuild.

 

Yeah I'm aware. And it's LW not right. And all the more reason for the Devils to take him. Hey you don't have to agree i've made my choice. And i'm ok with it.

 

It is a nice consolation prize. 

[OccamsRazor]

16 minutes ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Neither did Hischier.

 

Yeah i know. It all why i say the Devils take Patrick. I'm ok with Nico and in fact just like his style and think in time he could be the better player. And he could still grow some more. Devils have a need for Center more. 

 

Besides Nico could be where ever the Flyers put him doesn't matter what he is now.

[Podein25]

20 hours ago, jammer2 said:

 

 To be fair, I only rewatched a period and a half. He did put on a burst of speed on the forecheck, knocking the puck free behind the net. That is certainly a strong suit in his game. It seems like when he wants to get the puck, he will move heaven and earth to get it. A great quality. That is the one part of his game that reminds me of Matthews.

 

I was just not impressed on his speed entering the offensive zone. Even when he had a chance to wind up, he seemed lumbering and kinda stiff, no jump in his step type thing. Who knows, maybe he played a few games before the Orr/Cherry game?

 

 

Small sample and he could have been injured (isn't he always). The book on him says skating is not really an issue, except he talks about needing to improve. Which is all your can ask for I guess.

[jammer2]

3 hours ago, Podein25 said:

The book on him says skating is not really an issue, except he talks about needing to improve.

 

I have heard along the same lines. My memory of Nolan in Brandon is kinda fuzzy, I was focusing more on Provs.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

I know I said the lfyers require a game breaker, but I need to rethink that statement. With regards to centers, there's a few potential game breakers in the system. We can look at last year's first round pick, German Rubtsov. I know he played on the left wing in Chicoutimi, but he's going to be going back to center this year. As well, we all saw he can finish and he can certainly distribute the puck. He's also got some good size to him and he's defensively aware.

 

We can then go to fourth round pick Connor Bunnaman, who's a 6'4, 200 pound center that scored 37 goals on the checking line in Kitchener. The line in total scored 66 goals and Bunnaman was accountable for nearly 60 percent of the goals from that line. Another guy that's defensive astute and can play in all situations. A real gem of a mid round pick.

 

Finally, there's Mikhail Vorobyov. We all saw against his peers at the WJC that he can be an elite playmaker. We also know that he's another defensively sound center that can play in all situations. Once he gets that added leg strength, his skating won't be a 'question' mark any longer (not that it was a huge question mark to begin with, but like Oskar Lindblom, he needs to add some strength to his lower legs to get that jump).

 

Adding someone like Patrick or Hischier is a coup, no doubt and it really bolsters the center prospects. At the same time, I'm hoping that this draft, Hextall adds at least three more centers to mix. Personally, I'd like to see three centers, three wingers, two defenders and two goalies taken. Might as well really cram the pipeline full of talent.

[jammer2]

8 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

We can then go to fourth round pick Connor Bunnaman, who's a 6'4, 200 pound center that scored 37 goals on the checking line in Kitchener. The line in total scored 66 goals and Bunnaman was accountable for nearly 60 percent of the goals from that line. Another guy that's defensive astute and can play in all situations. A real gem of a mid round pick.

 

 

Watching Connor dominate my hometown Spits was a sight to behold. He was really strong on the forecheck, great hands in front of the net, very respectable skater for a big man, in fact, he plays like a dynamic 6 footer but stands 6'4. One of my favourite Hexy picks, a total steal of a 5th rounder.

 

 

 It's not hard to envision a Center crew of Giroux. Nolan Patrick, Bunnaman, Cooter. Bunnaman would have to have a big camp, but he's capable of delivering. I believe he plays his way on to the team, forces their hands. The size, the work ethic, the skill...all there. I don't think he will be superfast in the NHL, but not slow either.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

15 hours ago, jammer2 said:

 

Watching Connor dominate my hometown Spits was a sight to behold. He was really strong on the forecheck, great hands in front of the net, very respectable skater for a big man, in fact, he plays like a dynamic 6 footer but stands 6'4. One of my favourite Hexy picks, a total steal of a 5th rounder.

 

 

 It's not hard to envision a Center crew of Giroux. Nolan Patrick, Bunnaman, Cooter. Bunnaman would have to have a big camp, but he's capable of delivering. I believe he plays his way on to the team, forces their hands. The size, the work ethic, the skill...all there. I don't think he will be superfast in the NHL, but not slow either.

 

Bunnaman's a fantastic hockey player. I love the fact he still scored 37 goals in a checking role. I'm excited to see what he does when he goes back to Kitchener and he's used on one of the top two lines there. I don't know where he's going to play as a pro. He likes center, but I've read the Flyers see him on the left wing. My only concern is that once he gets to Lehigh Valley, dipshit Gordon will either use him on the fourth line or scratch him for ECHL fodder because Gordon wants to ensure that Bunnaman plays the game 'the right way' and doesn't want to 'put undue pressure' on him to perform.

[OccamsRazor]

Also i am not knocking Patrick by any means if the Flyers get him i would be excited. I'm just putting myself in the Devil's shoes.

 

Who would they least like to play against the next 10+ years???

 

They have Michael Mcleod they just took at center to go with Patrick's teammate Quenneville.

 

You also have Zacha who is better suited at LW. To go with Hall and Cammalleri at LW in the pros. 

 

It is why i think they lean hard for a center because i think Devils would play Patrick in the pros next year.

 

So their depth chart could look something like this...

 

Hall - Zajac

Camm - Henrique

Zacha - Patrick

Josefsen - Quenneville

 

Or something like that. I didn't list the RW spots.

[Podein25]

47 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

Also i am not knocking Patrick by any means if the Flyers get him i would be excited. I'm just putting myself in the Devil's shoes.

 

Who would they least like to play against the next 10+ years???

 

They have Michael Mcleod they just took at center to go with Patrick's teammate Quenneville.

 

You also have Zacha who is better suited at LW. To go with Hall and Cammalleri at LW in the pros. 

 

It is why i think they lean hard for a center because i think Devils would play Patrick in the pros next year.

 

So their depth chart could look something like this...

 

Hall - Zajac

Camm - Henrique

Zacha - Patrick

Josefsen - Quenneville

 

Or something like that. I didn't list the RW spots.

 

Yeah I think the Deb's will take Patrick

[AJgoal]

4 hours ago, Podein25 said:

 

Yeah I think the Deb's will take Patrick

 

I think Patrick would make sense as well. Insiders are disagreeing though. Hradek and a couple others have the Devils leaning Hischier based on sources inside the organization. Which makes some sense in that Shero has said he wants the Devils to become a fast team. And it's not like the Debs need to use any misdirection, they could announce who they're picking tomorrow and nobody could outdraft them. This 6 week wait thing is ridiculous.

[jammer2]

3 hours ago, AJgoal said:

 

I think Patrick would make sense as well. Insiders are disagreeing though. Hradek and a couple others have the Devils leaning Hischier based on sources inside the organization. Which makes some sense in that Shero has said he wants the Devils to become a fast team. And it's not like the Debs need to use any misdirection, they could announce who they're picking tomorrow and nobody could outdraft them. This 6 week wait thing is ridiculous.

 

 

The 6 week wait could benefit the Devils. It gives the other NHL GM's a chance to get an itchy trigger finger perhaps offering something the Devils could not turn down. A lot would depend on where the team moving up drafts in the 1st round, and what kind of prospect pool they have. The Wings for instance, could offer a package including Mantha, their 9th overall pick and maybe some other mid level prospect or some 2nd or 3rds. They have the ammo to move up if they really wanted to. Devils get Mantha, Cody Glass and a few other chances to hit home runs.

[jammer2]

9 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

So their depth chart could look something like this...

 

Hall - Zajac

Camm - Henrique

Zacha - Patrick

Josefsen - Quenneville

 

Or something like that. I didn't list the RW spots.

 

 

 

 One thing we have found out, Henrique and Zajac are not #1 centers. We don't know what Quenville will be, but he also looks more like a #2 than a legit #1. I don't think the Devils will use this pick to strengthen a particular position however, it really is gonna be best player available. Who knows, perhaps Nico becomes a legit star center instead of moving to wing, stranger things have happened. If the Devils think Nico will turn out to be a more prolific scorer, they will probably pick him, since there is no real weakness, from all accounts, Nico is good in his own zone. The big question for the Devs is if Patrick's vaunted leadership skills  and awesome intangibles outweigh his injuries.

 

 Missing on this pick could cost a GM his job. I'm glad Hexy is in the position to just draft the leftover, a lot less pressure and literally no blowback, this will all be on the shoulders of the Dev's GM.

[OccamsRazor]

11 minutes ago, jammer2 said:

 

 One thing we have found out, Henrique and Zajac are not #1 centers. We don't know what Quenville will be, but he also looks more like a #2 than a legit #1. I don't think the Devils will use this pick to strengthen a particular position however, it really is gonna be best player available. Who knows, perhaps Nico becomes a legit star center instead of moving to wing, stranger things have happened. If the Devils think Nico will turn out to be a more prolific scorer, they will probably pick him, since there is no real weakness, from all accounts, Nico is good in his own zone. The big question for the Devs is if Patrick's vaunted leadership skills  and awesome intangibles outweigh his injuries.

 

 Missing on this pick could cost a GM his job. I'm glad Hexy is in the position to just draft the leftover, a lot less pressure and literally no blowback, this will all be on the shoulders of the Dev's GM.

 

 

I think Patrick gets a bad wrap about injury history too though. Hard to hold  a broken collarbone against anyone. 

 

Soft tissue injuries like groin issue is more debateable.

 

Some could/would say it was due to training and lack of conditioning.

 

Maybe but it happens to a lot of athletes regardless of rhe sport.

 

So i have to say the injury thing is really BS.

 

So no matter what the Flyers will great player. Nico is just my choice preference.

[Podein25]

5 hours ago, AJgoal said:

 

I think Patrick would make sense as well. Insiders are disagreeing though. Hradek and a couple others have the Devils leaning Hischier based on sources inside the organization. Which makes some sense in that Shero has said he wants the Devils to become a fast team. And it's not like the Debs need to use any misdirection, they could announce who they're picking tomorrow and nobody could outdraft them. This 6 week wait thing is ridiculous.

 

I stand corrected

[AJgoal]

24 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

I stand corrected

 

Nah. It's all speculation until it actually happens. 

[AJgoal]

11 hours ago, jammer2 said:

 

The 6 week wait could benefit the Devils. It gives the other NHL GM's a chance to get an itchy trigger finger perhaps offering something the Devils could not turn down. A lot would depend on where the team moving up drafts in the 1st round, and what kind of prospect pool they have. The Wings for instance, could offer a package including Mantha, their 9th overall pick and maybe some other mid level prospect or some 2nd or 3rds. They have the ammo to move up if they really wanted to. Devils get Mantha, Cody Glass and a few other chances to hit home runs.

 

Glass seems to be the second fastest riser in the draft, looks to go in the 5-7 range, depending on what kind of run you get on defensemen early (You could see 3-4-5, though I think Vancouver probably still goes F). I have seen a few write-ups that think that he will turn out to be the best player out of the draft when all is said and done.

 

Don't forget the Debs have McCleod at center too. Who knows what they're thinking from a need standpoint with the possibility of Kovalchuk coming back, as well.

 

And the six weeks thing is mostly about me having to wait to see the pick. You are right about Hextall really having no pressure. Unless he gets a really juicy trade offer.

[flyercanuck]

28 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

 

Glass seems to be the second fastest riser in the draft, looks to go in the 5-7 range, depending on what kind of run you get on defensemen early (You could see 3-4-5, though I think Vancouver probably still goes F). I have seen a few write-ups that think that he will turn out to be the best player out of the draft when all is said and done.

 

Don't forget the Debs have McCleod at center too. Who knows what they're thinking from a need standpoint with the possibility of Kovalchuk coming back, as well.

 

And the six weeks thing is mostly about me having to wait to see the pick. You are right about Hextall really having no pressure. Unless he gets a really juicy trade offer.

 

Glass is THE guy I wanted in this draft back when I was sort of in the reality of NOT picking 2nd overall. Before we jumped way up in the lottery I'd have been happy as hell if he'd have dropped to us (which I knew was doubtful). 

 

McLeod, to me, is a #2. Zacha doesn't look like a centre. So they're still looking for a #1. I have no clue whether they feel that's Nolan or Nico. 

 

 A lot of us like Hischiers speed. One thing that I read on another forum that people should take into consideration is this....Patrick has been considered the best player in this draft for years. Everything that could possibly go wrong for the guy did in the past year. A year ago nobody had Hischier at the top of this class. Everythings gone right for him. Yet the two of them are basically neck and neck. 

[AJgoal]

1 minute ago, flyercanuck said:

A lot of us like Hischiers speed. One thing that I read on another forum that people should take into consideration is this....Patrick has been considered the best player in this draft for years. Everything that could possibly go wrong for the guy did in the past year. A year ago nobody had Hischier at the top of this class. Everythings gone right for him. Yet the two of them are basically neck and neck. 

 

Also, Nico was an MVP of the top prospects game. So he's going to be the guy the Flyers pick. (Konecny, Laberge)

[icehole]

On 5/5/2017 at 8:39 PM, OccamsRazor said:

Ok after watching as much video as i can i want the Flyers to get Nico....i just do.

Can you explain what you saw in the videos that made you lean Nico?  I'll be honest, I was trying to find a Patrick alternative because I think he'll go #1, they say he isn't "flashy", and he has some injury history.

 

But after watching some video, I've completely flipped.  Patrick looks like something special and dominating with his size.  Hischier just looks like a guy that might take a year or two to make the team, and then end up at 2nd line wing getting you 50-60 points a year.  That's great if you get him with the 5-10 pick, but I want something special at 2.

 

So the only red flag for me with Patrick is his injury history.  If he had a clear history, there's no doubt he's be #1.