RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 2 hours ago, radoran said: In one sense, you're not wrong and I'm not totally disagreeing here. Two of them are all but guaranteed to be 25+. And the Flyers' pair are now likely to be in the middle of the round. To @flyercanuck's point, you could get four Scott Laughtons with those picks... Football isn't the best comparison as the talent doesn't drop off as precipitously as it can in hockey. But Howie did trade up to #2 to get Wentz and traded up into the top 10 to get Carter last year. In fact, he's traded up in each of the past three drafts. Let's see what happens with the current bounty. (Oh, and one of the 2nds that they're "getting" is because they didn't manage to sign one of the 1sts. #winning!) The main question is what does "the rebuild" look like? Winning a Cup or back to being a consistent lower half playoff team? Although I hate basketball ,let’s not forget “Trust The Process “ . The Sixers had countless high first and second round picks and they drafted what they thought was the best player available with those picks. They had no blueprint or plan to fit those new pieces in to complement the nucleus they had, all they did was collect pieces that did not fit the overall puzzle.Then they figured they could trade those former high pick players that didn’t fit and get equal value back, they got jack **** back because the players became devalued due to lack of playing time and development. You have to look at the team you have and what you need and draft accordingly and trade up or down to get what you need. For example we are loaded at right wing, you can’t have a big scorer on the third line because all you do is draft right wings and there’s nowhere to put him, not every player is capable of playing the off wing. Flyers have some finishers for the first time in ages, but no setup men, we have some smaller/non physical puck moving defensemen but no big shutdown defenseman. We have some good complementary wingers but we lack the couple of high end difference makers other than Michkov, we need to do everything we can to get the right players and build a balanced team. Drafting the “best player available” doesn’t always work, the Sixers are proof of that. Or the best player available better actually turn out to be the best player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerdog Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 3 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: Although I hate basketball ,let’s not forget “Trust The Process “ . The Sixers had countless high first and second round picks and they drafted what they thought was the best player available with those picks. They had no blueprint or plan to fit those new pieces in to complement the nucleus they had, all they did was collect pieces that did not fit the overall puzzle.Then they figured they could trade those former high pick players that didn’t fit and get equal value back, they got jack **** back because the players became devalued due to lack of playing time and development. You have to look at the team you have and what you need and draft accordingly and trade up or down to get what you need. For example we are loaded at right wing, you can’t have a big scorer on the third line because all you do is draft right wings and there’s nowhere to put him, not every player is capable of playing the off wing. Flyers have some finishers for the first time in ages, but no setup men, we have some smaller/non physical puck moving defensemen but no big shutdown defenseman. We have some good complementary wingers but we lack the couple of high end difference makers other than Michkov, we need to do everything we can to get the right players and build a balanced team. Drafting the “best player available” doesn’t always work, the Sixers are proof of that. Or the best player available better actually turn out to be the best player. A lot of validity to this...I find that the 'Best Player Available" mantra works best when your team is already somewhat balanced...however if you are lacking in certain areas, you have to look at things more positionally and draft more for need, especially with higher picks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 (edited) 8 minutes ago, flyerdog said: A lot of validity to this...I find that the 'Best Player Available" mantra works best when your team is already somewhat balanced...however if you are lacking in certain areas, you have to look at things more positionally and draft more for need, especially with higher picks. Yes look at all the picks the Sixers had and the only guy left is Embiid and they haven’t won anything and they aren’t going to. They never had a balanced enough team and always had too many holes in the lineup to compete with the top teams. They pissed away so many high picks and the window is closing for Embiid. Edited March 7 by RonJeremy 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 10 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: Although I hate basketball ,let’s not forget “Trust The Process “ . The Sixers had countless high first and second round picks and they drafted what they thought was the best player available with those picks. They had no blueprint or plan to fit those new pieces in to complement the nucleus they had, all they did was collect pieces that did not fit the overall puzzle. Much like in Buffalo hockey, they fired the guy who started "the Process" after letting him start it. The people who then replaced in both situations had no interest in pursuing the plan. Obviously lots of top picks doesn't guarantee anything - Edmonton says "hello" - but you'll be hard pressed to find a post-lockout Cup winning team this century that doesn't have a top five pick on it... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerdog Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 3 minutes ago, radoran said: Much like in Buffalo hockey, they fired the guy who started "the Process" after letting him start it. The people who then replaced in both situations had no interest in pursuing the plan. Obviously lots of top picks doesn't guarantee anything - Edmonton says "hello" - but you'll be hard pressed to find a post-lockout Cup winning team this century that doesn't have a top five pick on it... or...look closer to home across the Parking Lot...Philadelphia Eagles. Howie Roseman says he always builds in the trenches...and stocks the OL and DL...but then he tries to continually find diamonds in the rough for LB and S and CB. As a result the second and third layers of the defense continually get exploited Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 7 Author Share Posted March 7 59 minutes ago, flyerdog said: for real? that's a LOT of inexperience in that third pairing...would rather they pair Staal and Sanheim with each of the call ups, for stability They want Sanheim on the right side with York It's going to be ok It's a rebuild let the chips fall where they may. If they make the playoffs then fine. If not then they'll have a better draft pick. Not sure how serious they are about making the playoffs anyways. If they are serious then they should claim Raanta off waivers to backup Ersson and return Sandström to the AHL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 6 minutes ago, flyerdog said: or...look closer to home across the Parking Lot...Philadelphia Eagles. Howie Roseman says he always builds in the trenches...and stocks the OL and DL...but then he tries to continually find diamonds in the rough for LB and S and CB. As a result the second and third layers of the defense continually get exploited It’s all about balance and being able to go up against any team and play any style. One dimensional teams always have to hope for a good matchup when the playoffs start, that’s one of the biggest problems Toronto had over the years. They went up against some physical teams and couldn’t compete. I know it’s hard, but you can’t be stacked in one area and weak in another and expect to win. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 7 Author Share Posted March 7 4 hours ago, CoachX said: Isn't that why Laughtons so coveted here, because of those intagibles he brings Trade related. Cross your fingers!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 19 minutes ago, radoran said: Much like in Buffalo hockey, they fired the guy who started "the Process" after letting him start it. The people who then replaced in both situations had no interest in pursuing the plan. Obviously lots of top picks doesn't guarantee anything - Edmonton says "hello" - but you'll be hard pressed to find a post-lockout Cup winning team this century that doesn't have a top five pick on it... It’s all about luck and circumstances as well, imagine if Patrick wasn’t a flop or if we picked any of the other guys in the top of that draft instead. If Gauthier decided to stay, then you add Michkov and we have a nice core. We had high level incompetence and some real bad luck to go with it. Before we think or talk about anything else , center is the #1 priority and a shutdown dman with some size is #2. It’s like building a house, foundation, walls, roof ,etc. I wish we could somehow make some deals and trade Konecny and picks and come away with Cayden Lindstrom and Sam Dickinson in this draft. We have Tippett ,Brink and Foerester and soon Michkov…you won’t miss Konecnys offense. Overall we’re a better rounded team instead of having four scoring wingers and no center or defensive stalwart. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 7 Author Share Posted March 7 Does he report? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 23 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Trade related. Cross your fingers!!! I sure hope so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 20 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: It’s all about luck and circumstances as well, imagine if Patrick wasn’t a flop or if we picked any of the other guys in the top of that draft instead. If Gauthier decided to stay, then you add Michkov and we have a nice core. We had high level incompetence and some real bad luck to go with it. Before we think or talk about anything else , center is the #1 priority and a shutdown dman with some size is #2. It’s like building a house, foundation, walls, roof ,etc. I wish we could somehow make some deals and trade Konecny and picks and come away with Cayden Lindstrom and Sam Dickinson in this draft. We have Tippett ,Brink and Foerester and soon Michkov…you won’t miss Konecnys offense. Overall we’re a better rounded team instead of having four scoring wingers and no center or defensive stalwart. Whether its Laughton, or Konecny, or both...whatever, when you trade guys like that, as long as you know what you're doing in the draft, you take a step back (get higher draft pick with your own picks) and hopefully take 2 steps forward. Philly is constantly taking one step back, one step forward. That's ok when you're on top, but we're in the middle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 18 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Does he report? I'd report to Haiti for $8 million. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 4 hours ago, OccamsRazor said: You mean their #1 center? 3 million for a #1 is a steal... not if he cant deliver on ice. If you're ok with your No 1 center having 10g, and 22 assists, so be it. But you arent going to win many playoff games with that kind of production I digress, this if off topic and not about Laughton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 4 hours ago, flyercanuck said: Flat beer is better than no beer.... amirite? I'm glad to have 4 - 1st round picks. But it would be nice to have top 10 picks where your chances of finding a stud are greatly improved....all those picks we have, FYI, could end up being FOUR SCOTT LAUGHTONS. warn me next time. REPORTED! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 4 hours ago, mojo1917 said: I don't view signing a good soldier to a modest contract as the harbinger of ineptitude that a lot of other folks do. DING! DING! DING! we have winner 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JR Ewing Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 1 hour ago, RonJeremy said: It’s all about balance and being able to go up against any team and play any style. One dimensional teams always have to hope for a good matchup when the playoffs start, that’s one of the biggest problems Toronto had over the years. They went up against some physical teams and couldn’t compete. I know it’s hard, but you can’t be stacked in one area and weak in another and expect to win. What's been galling is to see a guy the size of Matthews basically disappear when things get physical. Steve Stamkos, outweighed by 20 lbs, bullied Matthews a couple of playoffs ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said: Does he report? Funny I was thinking the very same thing as I was scrolling down .... then I saw your post ........does he even report????? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 14 minutes ago, JR Ewing said: What's been galling is to see a guy the size of Matthews basically disappear when things get physical. Steve Stamkos, outweighed by 20 lbs, bullied Matthews a couple of playoffs ago. There are big guys who play small and small guys who play big. You need some guys that play with fire and suddenly it rubs off on the softies. Back in the better years the Flyers were never the most talented but they came to play every night and won against more talented teams on sheer will and determination , we took the Oilers to 7 games in 87, they had Gretzky and Messier, we had Poulin and Sutter…on paper we didn’t compare. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 21 minutes ago, CoachX said: DING! DING! DING! we have winner After Chuck Fletchers reign of ineptitude, anything looks good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 22 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: You need some guys that play with fire and suddenly it rubs off on the softies. This is the primary argument for Nick Seeler, and it's a good one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 7 Author Share Posted March 7 1 hour ago, CoachX said: not if he cant deliver on ice. If you're ok with your No 1 center having 10g, and 22 assists, so be it. But you arent going to win many playoff games with that kind of production I digress, this if off topic and not about Laughton Just joking with @CoachX 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted March 7 Share Posted March 7 37 minutes ago, radoran said: This is the primary argument for Nick Seeler, and it's a good one. 25 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Just joking with @CoachX I agree with that, but I wish he didn’t turn into this shot blocking dynamo at the age of 30 as an UFA. I’m skeptical that he reverts to a popcorn maker next season. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted March 7 Author Share Posted March 7 2 hours ago, radoran said: This is the primary argument for Nick Seeler, and it's a good one. Thought that was the excuse for Nic Deslauriers being on the team? I don't buy that...more nonsense sports talk that isn't true when they say that crap. To believe other wise is being disingenuous not towards you but Torts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted March 8 Share Posted March 8 1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said: more nonsense sports talk that isn't true when they say that crap. You definitely need guys who will make the playoffs to spark the team. There are many such plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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