fanaticV3.0 Posted April 8, 2014 Share Posted April 8, 2014 @B21@ruxpinBut then we're back to teams playing for a tie to preserve the point, just like pre-shootout era. I think the problem is the points system itself. Any time you reward something that isn't a win, it's counterproductive. The win is always the ultimate goal, but I think we're all in agreement here there comes a certain point in the game where they seem to float and settle for the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TedZep Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 To put it simply, Ruxpin is right and Polaris is wrong, particularly when he says the shootout is the "purest" form of Hockey and that it is team oriented. That's just plain silly right there. Ties are fine, but ~25% of games ending in ties is too much. Some games being worth 2 and some games being worth 3 has skewed the standings a bit, but after seeing Rux's chart, maybe not by too much. Damn the shootout, damn it to Hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 To put it simply, Ruxpin is right and Polaris is wrong, particularly when he says the shootout is the "purest" form of Hockey and that it is team oriented. That's just plain silly right there. Ties are fine, but ~25% of games ending in ties is too much. Some games being worth 2 and some games being worth 3 has skewed the standings a bit, but after seeing Rux's chart, maybe not by too much. Damn the shootout, damn it to Hell. I have a new signature! Mostly just to document the one and only time you will ever see the first part of that in print. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 @TedZep@ruxpinAnd I'll reiterate the context being a shooter vs. goaltender situation. Lol. Go on Rux... Have your moment in the sun (even if it IS still wrong). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted April 10, 2014 Share Posted April 10, 2014 I say a ten minute 4 on 4 overtime, and if nobody scores call it a night. What is wrong with a tie? I like this idea. I think the 5 minute OT started becoming futile because teams would just sit back and be happy with the point. But having to play an extra 10 minutes v. 5 minutes is more incentive (from a players perspective) to try and win. As a player, I am already beat from playing 60 minutes and want to go have a steak and a beer. I don't want to have to play another 10 minutes. Maybe from a coaching angle it would be same old same old (lets be happy with the point and get out of here). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old School Hockey Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 27% of all games went a Shootout this past year. That's way too many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 27% of all games went a Shootout this past year. That's way too many. Thus far nearly 40% of all playoff games have gone to overtime, that's still too many. Parity in the league? The league needs to find a way for more teams to end in regulation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old School Hockey Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Thus far nearly 40% of all playoff games have gone to overtime, that's still too many. Parity in the league? The league needs to find a way for more teams to end in regulation.Slowly the league going back to clutch and grab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yave1964 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 I don't have any problem with the 10 and then calling it a tie. I don't recall your position on the loser point and don't want to scroll. IF...just if...they went to 10 minutes and 2 pts for a win, 0 points for a loss, and 1 point each for a tie, I bet you a turkey sandwich that you won't see the 60-70 more games decided. I bet you end up with two teams skating around trying to protect that one point. If...just if...they went to 10 minutes and 2 pts for a win, 1 point for an OT loss, and 1 point each for a tie, you may see an increase in games decided but still have the three point game set-up I hate. God help me, but I think I would prefer the 10 minutes and then a shootout. 2 pts. for a win. 0 for a loss. As much as I don't like the shootout, I think my dislike of the three-point game is stronger. Hopefully, this particular set up would eliminate the 3-point game altogether and maybe reduce the need for the shootout significantly. The problem is the league wants the 3 point system to artificially make fans feel their team is better than they are. If at or near the break a team is 20-16-9 with 49 points the fans can say hey, we are above .500 and in contention. If the same record is translated to 20-25 the fans get disenchanted and quit coming. It is a fact. The third point boosts attendance and fan interest. And it pisses me right off. I absolutely hate the third point and the soccer style finish to a game with a skill competition shootout. Both the shootout and 3rd point are designed for the casual fan who needs a winner. Both are absurd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yave1964 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Oh yeah - this, too. No points for getting to OT for me. 2 for a win. Any win. 0 for a loss. 1 for a tie.My God once again we are in complete agreement in a subject. Wonders never cease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 The problem is the league wants the 3 point system to artificially make fans feel their team is better than they are. If at or near the break a team is 20-16-9 with 49 points the fans can say hey, we are above .500 and in contention. If the same record is translated to 20-25 the fans get disenchanted and quit coming. It is a fact. The third point boosts attendance and fan interest. And it pisses me right off. I absolutely hate the third point and the soccer style finish to a game with a skill competition shootout. Both the shootout and 3rd point are designed for the casual fan who needs a winner. Both are absurd. I think this is accurate, if only somehow on a psychological level. When I converted the standings using other formats, the results were quite similar.Some "bubble" teams flip-flopped positions, but seemingly the same number of teams were still in the hunt (or were in the hunt in some imaginary way just as now--was Ottawa really "in the hunt" despite still being mathematically possible?). Despite that, I do think what you're saying is the rationale for it. And, with you, I absolutely hate it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Zero points for ties. That'll clean it up. And do away with clutch n grab stuff completely. The not so good teams will no longer be able to compete with the good ones just by holding on like a lite in the wind. Win or get nothing. Play it right or kill penalties all night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Zero points for ties. That'll clean it up. And do away with clutch n grab stuff completely. The not so good teams will no longer be able to compete with the good ones just by holding on like a lite in the wind. Win or get nothing. Play it right or kill penalties all night.It still has the problem of some games awarding more points than other games but in this case I will suffer that because I actually like the "you don't win you get nothing!" I actually agree that in this scenario that the teams who actually want the points will do their damndest to make it happen (or fail trying, which gets the other team the points). Make it so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 My God once again we are in complete agreement in a subject. Wonders never cease. Great minds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted April 23, 2014 Share Posted April 23, 2014 Bettman: “I like the shootout in the way we use it. I wouldn’t like the shootout in the playoffs, and the fact is I like the shootout better than ending a game in a tie. And so the issue is can we tweak overtime so maybe there are slightly fewer shootouts? But the fact is, no matter what your opinion is – from the media or hockey person or fan – watch the buildings when the shootouts are going on. Everybody is on their feet. Everybody is interested. Everybody is watching. When games were ending in ties, that wasn’t so much the case in overtime. ... Nobody is looking for a fundamental adjustment. We’re looking more for a tweak to see if maybe we can get a few more games decided in overtime, but the shootout is a concept that’s here to stay." http://www.nj.com/flyers/index.ssf/2014/04/nhl_commissioner_gary_bettman_talks_shootouts_outdoor_games_playoff_format_2014-15_cap.html? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old School Hockey Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 http://www.nj.com/flyers/index.ssf/2014/04/nhl_commissioner_gary_bettman_talks_shootouts_outdoor_games_playoff_format_2014-15_cap.html? Really everyone would stop watching? Do people go to and watch games for the game itself or are they there waiting a Shootout? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted October 5, 2014 Share Posted October 5, 2014 I personally don't like the idea of a shootout. It should be like the NBA play till there's a winner,then do without the point system. If the point system is used then 1, 20 minute period,if still no winner 1 point per team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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