Lucic and post game handshake

[Old School Hockey]

Old school - , carry on the conversation, but if you're going to stereotype us all into one you're going to get feedback.

1970's! Need I say more?

[ruxpin]

1970's! Need I say more?

Not unless you're going to eventually get around to saying something coherent

[flyercanuck]

1970's! Need I say more?

 

Gordie Howe, Ted Lindsay...need I say more?

 

You guys kicked our ass in the finals, I'm not holding that against you. (ok, maybe a bit  )

[Old School Hockey]

Gordie Howe, Ted Lindsay...need I say more?

Were angels compared to...............

[Old School Hockey]

Gordie Howe, Ted Lindsay...need I say more?

You guys kicked our ass in the finals, I'm not holding that against you. (ok, maybe a bit )

Without use the intimidation factor!

[flyercanuck]

Without use the intimidation factor!

 

True. Howe and Lindsay...not so much.

 

 And I have the utmost respect for both.

[hf101]

@ruxpin

 

Maybe there are some that go through the motions and some who shouldn't line up, but then there are those like Patrick Kane who name their opponents by first name, congratulating them on a great competitive series.  Many of these guys play with each other on international teams and may one day be teammates, I think it would be a shame if hockey chose to stop the handshake line for the few who don't get it.

 

[ruxpin]

@ruxpin

 

Maybe there are some that go through the motions and some who shouldn't line up, but then there are those like Patrick Kane who name their opponents by first name, congratulating them on a great competitive series.  Many of these guys play with each other on international teams and may one day be teammates, I think it would be a shame if hockey chose to stop the handshake line for the few who don't get it.

 

 

 

Fair enough. I still think the exact same thing is accomplished in other sports without the show of the handshake line. I didn't like it in little league, AYSO, some high school sports, etc.  I just think it's an entirely unnecessary compulsion to to do something that would/should come natural to an actual good sportsman.

[Old School Hockey]

Fair enough. I still think the exact same thing is accomplished in other sports without the show of the handshake line. I didn't like it in little league, AYSO, some high school sports, etc. I just think it's an entirely unnecessary compulsion to to do something that would/should come natural to an actual good sportsman.

In most it does come naturally. But in a small % (see Lucic) being a unsportsmanlike thug comes naturally.

[ruxpin]

I'm hesitant to make this comparison because it will likely inspire a debate we try to avoid on here.  

 

I understand tradition for tradition sake, etc.

 

But for me, the handshake line is similar in a certain respect to prayer at a public event.   I am not saying there is anything wrong with prayer (a distinction that some people have difficulty grasping; some here, apparently) but--to me and to some who don't need it done publicly but still believe in prayer--it is a personal thing not a group thing.  If someone wants to pray, go ahead and pray.  But even the meal invocations tend to have a room at least half full of people who are patiently or impatiently waiting for the prayer to be done so they can eat or kibitz or watch the high school sporting event or whatever.   At that point, it's great tradition but it's simply theater.  The whole point to the group tradition is left empty if everyone present feels the need to simply play along and aren't actually doing what is supposedly the activity.

 

Similarly, again, with the handshake line.  For those having trouble grasping the concept, NO ONE is arguing against sportsmanship.  But sportsmanship is a personal, individual act and attitude.  It is not and never will be a group activity.  To pretend it is is to not actually watch the handshake line where clearly half the players are doing the equivalent of having their eyes open and looking around the room and saying "hurry up before the food gets cold" during the invocation.   For me--and this is clearly just me and whatever minority are willing to acknowledge it--when this happens the act is a show.  There are clearly those individuals within the group who are giving heartfelt congratulations or "nice try" or "it's been an honor" or whatever.  But just like the "pray on your own" if those individuals want to be classy and show good sportsmanship--I maintain an individual act--no one is stopping them.  No one, despite the absence of a handshake line--is preventing Peyton Manning from going and congratulating whomever beat him this time.  So he goes and does exactly that despite no line. 

 

Again, I'm not arguing against the sportsmanship and the individual acts of class.   All I'm commenting negatively on is the group show that ends up coming across as fake for the vast majority of them.  Because, again, I simply do not acknowledge that sportsmanship is a group thing.  A bunch of individuals can group together to show class/sportsmanship.  We saw that with the Kings.  But you'll also notice it was not the entire Kings team, either.  It was a bunch who were truly moved individually to do something very cool.  And--for me (I don't believe I can convince anyone so I'm not trying.  Just trying to articulate where I'm coming from)--this is what made it really special.

[ruxpin]

In most it does come naturally. But in a small % (see Lucic) being a unsportsmanlike thug comes naturally.

 

I think the only way one argues "most" is if one has a much lower standard of class/sportsmanship than what I'm talking about.  Walking down a line tapping a glove and saying "good job" over and over again like it might as well be tape recorded just because everyone else is doing it really doesn't qualify for my definition of sportsmanship.  It does for you.  That's cool.  We disagree, though.

[hf101]

But for me, the handshake line is similar in a certain respect to prayer at a public event. 

 

Generally that has been replaced by a moment of silence.  But why go there with the prayer thing?   Why not challenge the singing of the National Anthem before sporting events? - there has got to be quite a few non-Americans, probably Americans also at a hockey game that go through the motions of attempting to stand at attention.

[ruxpin]

Generally that has been replaced by a moment of silence. But why go there with the prayer thing? Why not challenge the singing of the National Anthem before sporting events? - there has got to be quite a few non-Americans, probably Americans also at a hockey game that go through the motions of attempting to stand at attention.

What??? Attack the National Anthem??? B..b..but..but that's TRADITION!

Yes, also not a bad example although probably even a harder sell.

By the way, you're in a slightly more 21st century area than I am. This would land like a thud in your area but here they honest to God open some of their public school events with the Lord's Prayer.

Really not trying to encourage or continue the prayer thing but just saw a little bit of a similarity in a certain respect to make the analogy

[hf101]

What??? Attack the National Anthem??? B..b..but..but that's TRADITION!

Yes, also not a bad example although probably even a harder sell.

By the way, you're in a slightly more 21st century area than I am. This would land like a thud in your area but here they honest to God open some of their public school events with the Lord's Prayer.

Really not trying to encourage or continue the prayer thing but just saw a little bit of a similarity in a certain respect to make the analogy

 

No I'm not in a more 21st century area, far from it.  I just thought I'd throw that out there as an example of the lack of respect while keeping the discussion to sporting events.... probably should have added the sarcasm font.  

[flyercanuck]

@ruxpin

 

 I'm telling you right now, don't mess with our seal hunt. If I can't clobber baby seals with a bat with a nail stuck through it, life ain't worth living.

[ruxpin]

No I'm not in a more 21st century area, far from it.  I just thought I'd throw that out there as an example of the lack of respect while keeping the discussion to sporting events.... probably should have added the sarcasm font.  

 

Yeah, probably should have led with the National Anthem thing.  But I thought that would cause even a bigger firestorm.  I'm already in the "me" generation (because that's accurate or relevant) and a pig like Lucic (probably both accurate and relevant).

[ruxpin]

By the way, I do agree with folks who think Lucic is a bad sport.  I just think there are much better examples in general and in this series in particular than the handshake line thing.

[ruxpin]

@ruxpin

 

 I'm telling you right now, don't mess with our seal hunt. If I can't clobber baby seals with a bat with a nail stuck through it, life ain't worth living.

 LOL! Why would anyone mess with that?  It's tradition!  (had I remembered the seal hunt thing, maybe I would have referenced that instead of the absurd slavery thing!)

[mojo1917]

@ ruxpin

Fwiw. I understand your point and agree with it to a point.

For me the conflict on the issue came in games where I didn't play. I hadn't had a good game, I sat. if we won I didn't feel like telling the losing team hey good game because it wasn't good enough and if we lost I didn't want to see the smug look on the bastards faces when I couldn't get a chance to change the outcome.

.

[flyercanuck]

 LOL! Why would anyone mess with that?  It's tradition!  (had I remembered the seal hunt thing, maybe I would have referenced that instead of the absurd slavery thing!)

 

And actually, I don't have a problem with the seal hunt. What else are they supposed to do....they decimated the cod stocks on them, what they're not allowed to feed their families? I say let them bash the seals brains in, until they get the internet up there. Then they can do it on a virtual basis.

[radoran]

 LOL! Why would anyone mess with that?  It's tradition!  (had I remembered the seal hunt thing, maybe I would have referenced that instead of the absurd slavery thing!)

 

Don't worry, Cliven, nobody took that seriously.

 

And, no, sorry, we're not going to take away your NAHANA franchise.

 

[ruxpin]

@flyercanuck

And after they bash the seals brains in they can be sporting about it and tell the seals they did a good job and it was an honor to kill them.

[ruxpin]

Don't worry, Cliven, nobody took that seriously.

And, no, sorry, we're not going to take away your NAHANA franchise.

LMAO!

[Vanflyer]

I've seen many people 10000x better than Lucic be gracious in defeat!

 

Nobody plays to lose. In one video, Lucic seemed pretty chocked up. But, c'mon ever since pee wee you always shake hands and EVERY team management from that level on up teaches respect. Its one of the greatest things about the sport I love. I have had to shake players hands that I hated during the game. But if they beat me, they beat me. 99.1 percent of those players had nice things to say and .9 % grumbled something kind of like respect. 

 

This is a weird playoff for hockey. I have seen some things I have never before. 

[J0e Th0rnton]

@ruxpin

 

The handshake line is more about tradition, respect, and honor for the game.

 

If one can't respect those traditions then how can we expect respect for the game on the ice?  Players who do not honor the game really don’t deserve to play. It is really that simple.

So Chelios should not have been allowed to play? He often did refuse and walk off the ice when his team lost. Ed Belfour did a few times too.

 

Lucic was being a douche and going overboard, but I would love to see a bit of that fire in the eyes of some sharks. Some guys just hate to lose and hate some opponents after a hard series