Stanley Cup Final: Tampa vs Chicago

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

From CBS Sports:

 

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/eye-on-hockey/25207044/lightning-f-jonathan-drouin-could-get-another-chance-in-game-2

 

and from Yahoo Sports:

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/jonathan-drouin-may-be-lightning-s-game-2-spark-160751967.html

 

 

Jonathan Drouin may make his Finals debut.

 

He obviously won't provide much in the way of defense right now, but definitely will add another layer of offense.

Yes, yes, he hasn't done a whole lot offensively the entire year goals-wise, but he is still a talented player, and COULD make a difference if he does play, in the bottom six, while the overworked top 4 D-men of the Hawks are busy covering the Bolts top two lines.

 

If Drouin plays, the questions then become, Do the Bolts go back to 12 forwards and 6 defensemen?

or

Do the Bolts stay with 11 forwards, 7 "D" (as they have been), and simply scratch a forward such as Paquette, Namestnikov, or Morrow in favor of the rookie Drouin?

[jammer2]

  Had to work last night, rewatching what looks like a gem of a game right now...

 

 

 1st period...

 

 WOW, Paquette is playing some AWESOME inspiring hockey...very nice work ethic and wonderful toe drag before that goal! What a story he has become.

 

 Um, Mr.Drouin, this is not the Quebec league, you will not beat half the team one on one...SIMPLE is good, use your teammates, if they scored a goal after he got his pocket picked, he would have been done for the finals....the kid oozes talent, but he has gotta be careful!!  Protect the puck at all costs, dump it in if you have to...simple, easy plays when you are the last man back at the point, youngster!!

 

2nd period...

 

Despite being down 1-0, Crawford has been stellar!  Some very nice acrobatic saves. That goal by Cedric, that was a seeing eye shot, and he was screened also...not blaming him at all there, Crawford has held them in thus far, it could easily be 2-0, or even 3-0.

 

 Kucherov is SO silky smooth out there....very impressive, what a young core the Bolts will have for a LONG time.

 

 Shaw scores on a tap in...might be nit picky, but Garrison can't allow inside position like that. It was only inches, but he has to work harder to box out Shaw there....and what is UP with the Bolts and these shoddy line changes...they HAVE to dial that in!!

 

 Pretty cheap call on Killorn there, they have let that kinda play go, so don't like the inconsistency there....

 

 AND just like that...2-1 Hawks...you can see why Teravainen is ranked in the top 10 for prospects....out of this world finishing ability and wicked passing on top of it.

 

 Hossa might be the most underrated player on the Hawks..and maybe in hockey...just a wickedly gritty load to handle, a poor mans Zetterberg....LOVE his game!

 

 2-2....GREAT non whistle by Dan O'Halloran...this is why the best of the best ref the finals, lot's of refs would have blown that dead, but his SUPERB positioning allowed the play to continue, WICKED tip by Kucherov....his eye hand coordination is on par with Datsuyk!!  Ken Dryden would not have stopped that tip, Crawford had no chance.

 

 Heartwarming to see all the Bolts fans in Thunder alley...great show of support in a "supposed" non hockey market!

 

 What a WONDERFUL no look touch pass from Kane to Sadd, pure unadulterated skill there.

 

 What a beautiful skating stride Kieth has, so much fun to watch him wheel and deal at full speed.

 

 Sharp practically invisible...he HAS to be better.

 

 Who else, Mr.Everything Tyler Johnson, where would the Bolts be without him?? 3-2 Bolts, VERY exciting game! 13 goals in the playoffs for Johnson, despite not having scored in the past 5 games....are you kidding me!?!?

 

 If there was ANY question if the Bolts can skate with the Hawks, that has been answered, in SPADES!!

 

 Bolts 9-1 when scoring first....will that hold up??

 

 3rd period...

 

 will post thoughts on the 3rd tomorrow, to tired....LOL!

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

You are a tireless reporting warrior, @jammer2 , haha.

[jammer2]

@TropicalFruitGirl26  I'm really torn on playing Drouin or not. You can see the pure skill with the kid, but the risk is he tries to do to much and it leads to a goal going the other way. I'd play him, cause he really can break a game open real quick, just have to put him on a tight leash, make sure he knows to utilize his linemates and don't try to beat half the Hawks team.

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

@TropicalFruitGirl26  I'm really torn on playing Drouin or not. You can see the pure skill with the kid, but the risk is he tries to do to much and it leads to a goal going the other way. I'd play him, cause he really can break a game open real quick, just have to put him on a tight leash, make sure he knows to utilize his linemates and don't try to beat half the Hawks team.

 

Thing with Drouin is, he seems like he might still be rooted in the "flashy and fancy" type plays....which of course, my work some in the regular season, but really much harder to rely on in the post season.

 

That sort of thing can be worked on with him. As long as he is open to listening to experienced minds and people who can clearly see what is going on during any given play, he should learn.

A bit of hot dog to him? Sure....but from what I can tell, nothing that can't be ironed out.

So far, none of Drouin's play style has hurt the Lightning. He hasn't been productive mind you, but he hasn't hurt the team and that is very important.

 

I think between being returned to Juniors, then spending time on the bottom six once called to the big club again, then sitting out the bulk of playoff games....all that should serve to make him understand that sometimes, the path to getting to and STAYING at the NHL level (and getting regular play time) is a process...one that HE controls based on how serious he wants to get about being a professional.

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

According to NHL Network's Hockey at Noon show, Ben Bishop participated fully in the team's practice, taking his normal compliment of shots and he  IS expected to play tonight.

 

Bolts are still vague on what exactly was the issue with him last game and frankly, as a TB fan, I don't care what the issue was, so long as he truly is ok now and ready to go.

 

Andrei Vasilevskiy wouldn't be such a bad fallback plan, but let's face it: Ben Bishop is "The Man" in net for this team at this point in time.

Better to have Bishop able and ready to go than NOT having him in.

Bottom line.

[fanaticV3.0]

According to NHL Network's Hockey at Noon show, Ben Bishop participated fully in the team's practice, taking his normal compliment of shots and he  IS expected to play tonight.

 

Bolts are still vague on what exactly was the issue with him last game and frankly, as a TB fan, I don't care what the issue was, so long as he truly is ok now and ready to go.

 

Andrei Vasilevskiy wouldn't be such a bad fallback plan, but let's face it: Ben Bishop is "The Man" in net for this team at this point in time.

Better to have Bishop able and ready to go than NOT having him in.

Bottom line.

 

Goaltending might be one of the most overrated positions in sports. Actually, scratch that. There are plenty of teams that seem to know you don't have to have one of the best to win. It helps to have a stud, but it's certainly not necessary.

[J0e Th0rnton]

Goaltending might be one of the most overrated positions in sports. Actually, scratch that. There are plenty of teams that seem to know you don't have to have one of the best to win. It helps to have a stud, but it's certainly not necessary.

Uh, nah.

 

A leaky sieve of a goalie like Niemi who cannot even make the routine stops affects the team in front of him. They play scared. Hold leads instead of increasing them. Overthink things.

 

Ask the wild. Kuemper was unable to provide simple routine stops for them all season. They played more and more like crap. Trade for Dubnyk, he makes the routine stops and a few big ones, suddenly the team is playing with confidence again

[fanaticV3.0]

Uh, nah.

 

A leaky sieve of a goalie like Niemi who cannot even make the routine stops affects the team in front of him. They play scared. Hold leads instead of increasing them. Overthink things.

 

Ask the wild. Kuemper was unable to provide simple routine stops for them all season. They played more and more like crap. Trade for Dubnyk, he makes the routine stops and a few big ones, suddenly the team is playing with confidence again

 

The hockey gods themselves could not have blessed me with a more ironic example.

 

That same leaky sieve of a goalie won a Cup vs. my own Philadelphia Flyers. He played all but 1 playoff game that year after splitting the regular season with Huet. Cam Ward says hi, as does Giguere. Chris Osgood wouldn't have a career if it weren't for the teams that played in front of him. The same exact thing could also be said of Vernon. Ever look at his career SV%? It's nothing to brag about. You think Corey Crawford is leading a team that doesn't have that team in front of him to a Cup?

 

It's obviously more desirable to have a clear cut, more traditional, proven #1, but it's not necessary at all. It's happened several times in the last 10-15 years.

[J0e Th0rnton]

The hockey gods themselves could not have blessed me with a more ironic example.

 

That same leaky sieve of a goalie won a Cup vs. my own Philadelphia Flyers. He played all but 1 playoff game that year after splitting the regular season with Huet. Cam Ward says hi, as does Giguere. Chris Osgood wouldn't have a career if it weren't for the teams that played in front of him. The same exact thing could also be said of Vernon. Ever look at his career SV%? It's nothing to brag about. You think Corey Crawford is leading a team that doesn't have that team in front of him to a Cup?

 

It's obviously more desirable to have a clear cut, more traditional, proven #1, but it's not necessary at all. It's happened several times in the last 10-15 years.

No duh he won a cup on a stacked team, but that is the exception rather than the rule. The hawks were blessed with two #1 defensemen in Keith and Seabrook and a solid #2 in Hjalmarsson(One of the best Defensive puck moving Dmen in the league), as well as multiple Selke caliber forwards. The trick with Niemi is shoot high. He is bad on even routine high shots and he handles the puck like it is a live grenade. The Hawks were able to use their vast elite personnel to force almost all low shots and quick retrieval.

 

All 7 goals the Sharks scored in that sweep were 18" above the ice for a reason.

 

On most teams not blessed with multiple ridiculous hall of fame Dmen and Selke forwards(Which is usually 28 out of 30 teams), the goalie has to be at least able to make the routine saves.

 

Cam Ward was a case of getting hot at just the right time. Ward had a Patrick Roy like rookie season, winning the Smythe. He never replicated that success, but he was the only reason they won the cup. Overrated as the position may be, he is the reason they won. The exact opposite of the point you are trying to make.

 

Giguere made the finals first in the clutch and grab era with huge illegal now pads and won the Smythe over even players on the cup winning team, indicating he is the only reason they got that far, and then won a cup with 2 First ballot Hall of fame Dmen and the Selke runner up on the team. An example of both scenarios.

 

Osgood is another example of stacked team. Use it is you wish, but it is easier to get 1 elite goalie than multiple selke winning players and Norris candidates/Winners.

 

There are more examples of teams winning because of amazing goaltending than with mediocre goaltending.

[Commander Clueless]

Wooo! Go friggin' Tampa go!

 

 

Down with the Hawks!

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

Wooo! Go friggin' Tampa go!

 

 

Down with the Hawks!

 

Hmm...Blackhawk Down?

Never did see that movie.....but after last night's game, maybe I should.  

[Yorick]

Blackhawks down!

 

Lightning up! Sounds unnatural, but whatever...

[fanaticV3.0]

No duh he won a cup on a stacked team, but that is the exception rather than the rule. The hawks were blessed with two #1 defensemen in Keith and Seabrook and a solid #2 in Hjalmarsson(One of the best Defensive puck moving Dmen in the league), as well as multiple Selke caliber forwards. The trick with Niemi is shoot high. He is bad on even routine high shots and he handles the puck like it is a live grenade. The Hawks were able to use their vast elite personnel to force almost all low shots and quick retrieval.

 

All 7 goals the Sharks scored in that sweep were 18" above the ice for a reason.

 

On most teams not blessed with multiple ridiculous hall of fame Dmen and Selke forwards(Which is usually 28 out of 30 teams), the goalie has to be at least able to make the routine saves.

 

Cam Ward was a case of getting hot at just the right time. Ward had a Patrick Roy like rookie season, winning the Smythe. He never replicated that success, but he was the only reason they won the cup. Overrated as the position may be, he is the reason they won. The exact opposite of the point you are trying to make.

 

Giguere made the finals first in the clutch and grab era with huge illegal now pads and won the Smythe over even players on the cup winning team, indicating he is the only reason they got that far, and then won a cup with 2 First ballot Hall of fame Dmen and the Selke runner up on the team. An example of both scenarios.

 

Osgood is another example of stacked team. Use it is you wish, but it is easier to get 1 elite goalie than multiple selke winning players and Norris candidates/Winners.

 

There are more examples of teams winning because of amazing goaltending than with mediocre goaltending.

 

When there are more than a couple of examples of it, it's not the exception anymore.

 

You're going through each of the names I mentioned and trying to explain why each guy won. This guy was hot, that team was stacked, so and so played during a different era. That's not the point. It's not why they won, it's that they did it period. You don't have to have the best goalie in the game or even a top 5 guy to win. That is the point - particularly if you look at the last 15 or so years. It's become really noticeable in recent years. There's more one hit wonders, flukes, so-so, or even just good (but not great) players between than pipes than there are unquestionable #1s. In recent years, a guy like Quick is the exception, not the rule. I only pointed out the easy ones too. Fleury and Khabibulin's names have also been tossed around in similar conversations.

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

I realize defense wins championships, but let's face it: 

Unless the big two of Kane and Toews get things in gear, the Bolts may just skate away with Lord Stanley's Cup when all is said and done.

Particularly in a series like this one where the offense HAS outshined the defense on many occasions.

 

I found this interesting:

Patrick Kane playoff stats: 

10 G, 10 A in 20 GP, +4, 3 GwG, 56 SOG

 

Jonathan Toews playoff stats:

9 G, 10 A in 20 GP, +5, 51 SOG

 

But in the 3 games so far against the Lightning, this has become:

 

Kane

0 G, 0 A in 3 GP, -2, and only 6 SOG

 

Toews, a hair better, but still pretty anemic

0 G, 1 A in 3 GP, Even, 8 SOG

 

 

I do also understand the Blackhawks ARE  a deep team and that they are MUCH more than just Kane and Toews, but hey, if you are the Lightning, and you are keeping those two guys with such pedestrian numbers after they had been doing so well against everyone else, you KNOW you are doing something good.

 

And let's give credit to the Bolts: Kane and Toews suddenly didn't forget how to generate offense.

I think the Bolts' defense has caused them to perhaps hang on to pucks longer, maybe take very low % shots by not allowing any real shooting lanes for these guys, and simply taking away their time and space......with Ben Bishop there to stop whatever does happen to get through.

 

That said, either one of those guys could explode over the course of the next two games, but for now, ya gotta love the job the Tampa Bay defense has done on them.

 

When people were saying similar about Stamkos in the Detroit and Montreal series, at least guys like the Triplets were there to pick up the slack.

Right now, with big stars Kane and Toews not doing what they are accustomed to, things are clearly in the Bolts' favor with regards to big time offense.....even though Stamkos and even Johnson to a degree, have gone a bit quiet themselves.

Bolts are still getting good production from others in the lineup....Callahan, Kucherov as well as contributions from the defense.

 

Also, while Johnson and Palat haven't been scoring profusely in this series so far, the goals they HAVE gotten, have been game changers or game winners.

 

Lightning fans will hope the Tampa D will continue to keep Kane and Toews slumbering just a bit more.....

[ruxpin]

This is the weirdest finals for me.

I picked Chicago in six. I really like the way the Hawks play and thought I'd be cheering for them. I even said I WANTED them to win.

But I've noticed all series long that I've audibly cheered when Tampa scores and feel deflated / upset when Chicago scores. I still say I'm cheering for Chicago, but clearly I'm wrong.

[Podein25]

This is the weirdest finals for me.

I picked Chicago in six. I really like the way the Hawks play and thought I'd be cheering for them. I even said I WANTED them to win.

But I've noticed all series long that I've audibly cheered when Tampa scores and feel deflated / upset when Chicago scores. I still say I'm cheering for Chicago, but clearly I'm wrong.

Same here. I attributed it to having TB players in a pool and an outside chance to win, place or show. But that chance is long gone and I still find myself cheering for TB.

I was having beers with an acquaintance the other night who was militantly anti-Chicago/anti-dynasty. So maybe it's that?

[jammer2]

No duh he won a cup on a stacked team, but that is the exception rather than the rule. The hawks were blessed with two #1 defensemen in Keith and Seabrook and a solid #2 in Hjalmarsson(One of the best Defensive puck moving Dmen in the league), as well as multiple Selke caliber forwards. The trick with Niemi is shoot high. He is bad on even routine high shots and he handles the puck like it is a live grenade. The Hawks were able to use their vast elite personnel to force almost all low shots and quick retrieval.

 

All 7 goals the Sharks scored in that sweep were 18" above the ice for a reason.

 

On most teams not blessed with multiple ridiculous hall of fame Dmen and Selke forwards(Which is usually 28 out of 30 teams), the goalie has to be at least able to make the routine saves.

 

Cam Ward was a case of getting hot at just the right time. Ward had a Patrick Roy like rookie season, winning the Smythe. He never replicated that success, but he was the only reason they won the cup. Overrated as the position may be, he is the reason they won. The exact opposite of the point you are trying to make.

 

Giguere made the finals first in the clutch and grab era with huge illegal now pads and won the Smythe over even players on the cup winning team, indicating he is the only reason they got that far, and then won a cup with 2 First ballot Hall of fame Dmen and the Selke runner up on the team. An example of both scenarios.

 

Osgood is another example of stacked team. Use it is you wish, but it is easier to get 1 elite goalie than multiple selke winning players and Norris candidates/Winners.

 

There are more examples of teams winning because of amazing goaltending than with mediocre goaltending.

Agree with all of that.

[jammer2]

I do also understand the Blackhawks ARE a deep team and that they are MUCH more than just Kane and Toews, but hey, if you are the Lightning, and you are keeping those two guys with such pedestrian numbers after they had been doing so well against everyone else, you KNOW you are doing something good.

 

 I know it's a team effort kinda thing, but I give a LOT Of the credit to Paquette. Not only is he right in Toews face everytime he turns around ( I mean, Johnathan is CLEARLY frustrated). Not only has Cedric shut down one of the greatest clutch centers of all time (have not watched last nights game yet, just getting home from work) but he has a game winner....you can't ask for more than he has given....Boyle also...playing his heart out!!

[jammer2]

@TropicalFruitGirl26  OK, just watched Game #5. Wow, Vasilevsky was decent in this game, but if the Bolts happen to lose this series, there will always be some looking back at what coulda been had Bishop been in net. I thought Crawford was very good early and excellent late, some key game saving stops from a goalie who has been there and done that.

 

 Just when I praise the Bolts for keeping Kane and Toews off the board, they strike....shoulda known.

 

 The Hawks have one all game #4's in the playoffs, one in triple OT against the Preds, one in double OT against the Ducks.....they just find a way to get it done when it really matters.

 

 Stammer will be looking back at the 2 late chances in this game for a long time....on the first chance, the one that went off Seabrooke's heel of his stick....he had to get that up a bit, if it's in the upper half of the net, we go to OT and the Bolts have a chance to deliver a close to knock out blow....if the Bolts lose this series, that miss by Stammer will always be viewed of as "the one that got away". It was much like Carter missing the open net at the end of game #5 against the Hawks....very similar plays.

[FD19372]

The media in general (as well as many hockey fans in general) does not give Corey Crawford enough credit. He stepped up in a HUGE game for the Hawks last night. He doesn't make the prettiest of saves, but the way the Lightning totally dominated the last 7 or 8 minutes of the game, Chicago doesn't win that game if he doesn't have a lights out 3rd period. Guys like Vas, Saad, Keith and Toews were great, but he was the number one star for them, and it isn't even questionable IMHO. Yeah, Stamkos missed an open net, but still, Crawford has had a fire under him since the 2nd round of the playoffs, and at times,been great.

[jammer2]

 @FD19372  I think it's fair to say that both Chicago and the Bolts would not be here were it not for some outstanding goaltending. Crawford has been simply amazing at times.....and yeah, he does not get enough credit. He's not just a average goalie who is having a good playoffs, he's an awesome goalie who is literally keeping his team alive and kicking. He rarely lets in a soft goal, and is great at holding the fort down until the Hawks offense can find a way to get it done!

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

From NBC Sports:

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/2015/06/13/cooper-hopes-theres-decision-to-make-on-bishop-who-felt-terrible-watching-game-4/

 

From USA Today:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nhl/2015/06/13/injured-tampa-bay-goalie-bishop-still-uncertain-for-game-5/71170738/

 

 

Ben Bishop's status is still up in the air.....looks like it will be a game time decision.
Either way, I am sure Andrei Vasilevskiy is preparing (as usual...he is professional that way) as if HE were going to get the start.

While I personally would prefer to have Ben Bishop start the game, Vasilevskiy in goal would be the least of my worries in net.
Bolts simply need to make good on offensive chances. The Hawks will give them up....in spades!
Just gotta take advantage...especially on PP opps, which could help to take away some of Chicago's aggressive checking if TB starts clicking with the man advantage.

One last area for the Bolts to at least try to match Chicago: the face off department.
Chicago has been excellent in that area, certainly much better than TB, and thus always seem to start out with possession of puck.

Let's go Bolts.
Bishop or not, the Hawks are FAR from an impossible task.....last change at home, match ups we want.

[TBD_94]

Think Bishop will play tonight. I think the team wanted to take advantage of giving him 4 days of rest and he participated during the entire morning skate. When it comes down to it I think Tampa needs this win more than Chicago, but I certainly would feel confident we can win another at the UC if needed.

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

Think Bishop will play tonight. I think the team wanted to take advantage of giving him 4 days of rest and he participated during the entire morning skate. When it comes down to it I think Tampa needs this win more than Chicago, but I certainly would feel confident we can win another at the UC if needed.

 

I certainly think Bishop WANTS in.....but at the same time, I hope both he and Jon Cooper realize that a healthy Vasilevskiy is more beneficial than a Bishop who can't move properly out there.

 

As long as Big Ben can do what he needs to do, while fighting through whatever it is that ails him, I am good with it.

But if he is seriously compromised and it's his pride that won't let him sit out another game, well then, THAT I would have an issue with.

 

Coach Cooper is an intelligent man though. I don't think he will let Bishop's pride overrule common sense.

This is the Finals...very high stakes, and at a critical juncture with a lead to be had and be put one win away from a Stanley Cup Championship.

Only way Bishop may get by Cooper's logic is if he lies to his coach about how he can perform....but I'd like to think Bishop has more integrity than that.

 

But no matter who is in net, as I said before, it's going to come down to offense, the face offs, and special teams.

Chicago's wins were both low scoring, 2-1 games....the Bolts wins saw much higher goal totals, which means, I believe TB is EXTREMELY comfortable when things open up.

 

Even Steve Stamkos said during interviews that it doesn't matter who is in net, that the skaters, himself included, need to do THEIR jobs.

 

Funny how things have turned out for the Lightning...they were a dominant home team throughout the season, just so-so on the road (so much so, that in fact, many pundits thought the Bolts would make an early exit because "they couldn't play on the road"), and now in these playoffs, they have been #RoadWarriors, while being a somewhat pedestrian .500 club at home.

 

Go figure.