If we fail on this road trip, is it enough to sign Hakstols walking papers and the rest of the coaches.

[elmatus]

43 minutes ago, brelic said:

Hartley just started coaching Avangard Omsk in the KHL this season, so I doubt he'd leave his gig like 25 games in.

 

He won a Cup with the Avs, seems decent, but the rest of his track record after the Avs is pretty underwhelming. Missed the playoffs in 6 of the 8 other NHL seasons he coached.

 

Vigneault's teams made the playoffs 11 times, and missed 4 times. 8 of those 11 playoff trips went past the first round.

 

There's also Marc Crawford, who is an associate coach with the Sens right now under Boucher. 

 

Kevin Dineen and Ulf Samuelsson (under Quenneville).

 

 

 

 

 

I agree wholeheartedly that Hakstol should go. I've been saying as much for a year now.

 

That said, Hexy has proven to be fiercely loyal to his HC and many players as well. Part of me feels it would be out of character for him to fire Hakstol mid-season. I'm under the impression most sensible GMs would have canned him this off season at the very latest, but we got no coaching staff moves at all. That could mean a wholesale change of some sort, but frankly large and abrupt changes are the very opposite of the Hexy standard formula. It seems more likely to me we'll see incremental coaching and line up changes at best. 

 

I hope I'm wrong about all that. I really do. But somehow I get the feeling Hakstol is surviving another season.

[murraycraven]

1 hour ago, elmatus said:

 

I agree wholeheartedly that Hakstol should go. I've been saying as much for a year now.

 

That said, Hexy has proven to be fiercely loyal to his HC and many players as well. Part of me feels it would be out of character for him to fire Hakstol mid-season. I'm under the impression most sensible GMs would have canned him this off season at the very latest, but we got no coaching staff moves at all. That could mean a wholesale change of some sort, but frankly large and abrupt changes are the very opposite of the Hexy standard formula. It seems more likely to me we'll see incremental coaching and line up changes at best. 

 

I hope I'm wrong about all that. I really do. But somehow I get the feeling Hakstol is surviving another season.

 

 

completely agree...

 

Hextall is too patient IMO *BUT* you have to think that, based on history, that he is going to stand pat and let this thing ride itself out.  I don't agree with it but I am not expecting any wholesale changes here.   

 

At some point Hextall needs to feel the pressure to make changes for the good of the hockey team.  He is the one that went into the season with two goalies that are mediocre at best.  He also ignored the 3rd line center position and really should have brought in a solid veteran D-man.

 

I dont see this team working this out and making the playoffs this year.   This was supposed to be a year where the team takes a step forward and right now they appear to be taking 2 steps back -- and JvR is not going to magically fix the issues.   

 

So the question I ask to everyone is where are we in the "plan"?  We can sit around and wait for the kids to come up or you can find a coach that can actually coach these players up to perform.   Or, you look to trade a piece to send a message.  I dont see many takers for Jake on his contract (another bad move signing Jake in a UFA year)...  if there a few takers I would all but assume that we will be taking on another bad contract...

 

As Andy Reid would say...   "time's yours..."  -- do something Ron.

[notfondajane]

16 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

We may as well stop putting off the inevitable,  let's hope for a miserable west coast trip and upon returning, the coaching staff is fired and an overpaid player like Voracek is traded. That will certainly be a wakeup call.

Who would want Voracek contract? I dont think Pittsburgh.

[RonJeremy]

The Penguins took Kessel a one dimensional player with a bloated contract. There’s always a deal to be made.

[notfondajane]

2 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

The Penguins took Kessel a one dimensional player with a bloated contract. There’s always a deal to be made.

Im not sure I want him. The only reason I see the Pens taking him is in hopes that he plays well enough to get under the Flyers skin. . And thats only 4 or 5 games a year excluding playoffs.

[mojo1917]

5 hours ago, murraycraven said:

He also ignored the 3rd line center position

Who was available that was a certain upgrade ?

 

There's the guy from Pgh, but he was always going to resign there. Sheehan.

There was that undrafted Euro who's playing pretty well for some team out west.

There was...I don't know, who was available and better ? 

I wouldn't have been in favor of signing a guy just to sign a guy, There are some good players in the system, truly I don't see what was wrong with hoping someone would "rise". The jury is still out on Vorobyev because the coach won't ****** play him.  That dude has some serious talent, he's not being allowed to grow at this level though...so 

 

gah, this has been frustrating, I had hope this team would be better and not the dumpster fire we're watching.

 

[OH1FlyersFan]

5 hours ago, RonJeremy said:

with a bloated contract

I've always thought Kessel himself looked a little bloated too.  Last year he put up the most points in a season in his career.  With our luck, wherever Voracek or any current Flyers goes, they'll do the same thing for their new team.  It's our curse.  Send anyone we trade far far away!

[OccamsRazor]

30 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

Who was available that was a certain upgrade ?

 

 

I'm not saying he is for certain an upgrade but the Flames haven't been happy with Sam Bennett i would kick the tires on a trade for him.

 

He just turned 22 this past June and i think i would like a look at him as a 3rd line center over Weal.

 

It's better than just rearranging the current deck chairs...just throwing it out there...

[murraycraven]

50 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

Who was available that was a certain upgrade ?

 

There's the guy from Pgh, but he was always going to resign there. Sheehan.

There was that undrafted Euro who's playing pretty well for some team out west.

There was...I don't know, who was available and better ? 

I wouldn't have been in favor of signing a guy just to sign a guy, There are some good players in the system, truly I don't see what was wrong with hoping someone would "rise". The jury is still out on Vorobyev because the coach won't ****** play him.  That dude has some serious talent, he's not being allowed to grow at this level though...so 

 

gah, this has been frustrating, I had hope this team would be better and not the dumpster fire we're watching.

 

 

 

Honestly, with the cupboard of great prospects/picks that everyone likes to talk about you could have made a move.  Off the top of my head there was Nash, Bozak, Letestu, Plekanic, etc.... not saying the dollars are worth it but there were options.  Ron went into camp pumping the tires of Weal which was nothing more than a crap shot of working out.  Vorb had a great camp but that was just it - it is not that hard looking good in games that are meaningless and for the most part AHL level talent.  

 

Hextall and Hak gave the kid a chance and he made the team.  Then the moron of a coach basically benched him and now he is back in the AHL.  Last I heard from Hexy NAK needed more seasoning in the AHL and was not ready for the Flyers.  I guess that has changed over the course of 10 games in the AHL?

 

It is Hextall's job to make this team a good lineup and frankly he has not done enough.  It is even more frustrating that this is the year we were supposed to take a step forward - that is Ron's admission at the beginning of the season.  

 

Year 5 of Hextall and Year 4 of Hak and we are still not progressing...  this is ANOTHER wasted year while G/Jake/Simmer only get older.  

 

From where I sit this "plan" is becoming a joke.   

[OccamsRazor]

46 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

  I guess that has changed over the course of 10 games in the AHL?

 

Well he has played well in the small sample size.

 

So yeah they are desperate and WTF not?

[murraycraven]

7 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Well he has played well in the small sample size.

 

So yeah they are desperate and WTF not?

 

 

I am not saying not to do it...  But WTF not give Vorb more than one period to work on his game...  Oh wait, that is our genius Coach. 

[OccamsRazor]

2 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

 

 

I am not saying not to do it...  But WTF not give Vorb more than one period to work on his game...  Oh wait, that is our genius Coach. 

 

 

I agree but Misha at times hasn't hustled and yet looked confused on what he should be doing...now he is alone that is Mcdud everyday...

 

 

..but that is a different argument/question.

[RonJeremy]

I think we go full rebuild, keep G ,dump Bore a chec and Simmonds get some NHL ready prospects and a few first round picks. With our defense and goaltending as it is, we are still 3 years away, so dump the older guys and get some top NHL ready talent.  No point in keeping them .

[ruxpin]

On 10/29/2018 at 8:34 AM, brelic said:

Hartley just started coaching Avangard Omsk in the KHL this season, so I doubt he'd leave his gig like 25 games in.

 

He won a Cup with the Avs, seems decent, but the rest of his track record after the Avs is pretty underwhelming. Missed the playoffs in 6 of the 8 other NHL seasons he coached.

 

Vigneault's teams made the playoffs 11 times, and missed 4 times. 8 of those 11 playoff trips went past the first round.

 

There's also Marc Crawford, who is an associate coach with the Sens right now under Boucher. 

 

Kevin Dineen and Ulf Samuelsson (under Quenneville).

 

 

 

 

 

Kevin Dineen is interesting to me.   I hadn't thought about Crawford, either.

 

Some idiot saying "Mike Keenan" in 3...2..1....

[ruxpin]

On 10/29/2018 at 9:24 AM, elmatus said:

I'm under the impression most sensible GMs would have [finish the sentence with any of the following]:

1.   canned him this off season at the very latest, but we got no coaching staff moves at all.

2.   Looked at the goaltending and done something about it

3.   Seen a gaping hole at 3C and done something about it.

4.   Seen the issues on the PK and would have either a) replaced the coach b) gotten someone who could penalty kill and/or c) gotten a damn goalie

5.   Brought in a competent veteran defenseman

6.   Bought out MacDud

7.  Not left $10M+ on the table after seeing how well that played in Montreal last year

 

Not exactly fixed, but thought I'd add.

[ruxpin]

On 10/29/2018 at 10:44 AM, murraycraven said:

He is the one that went into the season with two goalies that are mediocre  the contents of a sick baby's diaper at best

 

Fixed.It.For.You.

[ruxpin]

On 10/29/2018 at 10:44 AM, murraycraven said:

  I dont see many takers for Jake on his contract (another bad move signing Jake in a UFA year)...  if there a few takers I would all but assume that we will be taking on another bad contract

 

We'll trade Jake at the deadline so we can extend Simmonds.    There'll be kids and picks coming back.

[ruxpin]

On 10/29/2018 at 3:55 PM, mojo1917 said:

The jury is still out on Vorobyev because the coach won't ****** play him.  That dude has some serious talent, he's not being allowed to grow at this level though...so 

 

Quote

@OccamsRazor: 

I agree but Misha at times hasn't hustled and yet looked confused on what he should be doing...now he is alone that is Mcdud everyday...

 

I've said this and repeating it doesn't help, but I firmly believe that he and Coots and Patrick were/are being asked to do something that is against the grain of what they've always been taught.  Not that it's wrong, just that it's unnatural.  Like "don't attack.   we need you to fall back and play nickel defense so we can help our invalid goalies."   I think Vorobyev probably was (justifiably) confused.   

 

The problem is you can get everyone back --and that's not working, btw -- and the goalie still give up soft crap.    Just GO.  Full-throttle offense and try to outgun the teams you can.  You're going to give up 5/game either way.

[ruxpin]

With $10M on the mantelpiece, would Rick Nash on a one-year been such a horrible move if just to help with the PK and a little veteran leadership?

 

I'm not a fan of Rick Nash by any stretch, but it might have been better than Corban Knight or Dale Waste.

[darthbal]

8 hours ago, ruxpin said:

With $10M on the mantelpiece, would Rick Nash on a one-year been such a horrible move if just to help with the PK and a little veteran leadership?

 

I'm not a fan of Rick Nash by any stretch, but it might have been better than Corban Knight or Dale Waste.

 

The problem with that is that Nash is still trying to get over some concussion issues, hence why he has not signed anywhere yet.

[ruxpin]

6 minutes ago, darthbal said:

 

The problem with that is that Nash is still trying to get over some concussion issues, hence why he has not signed anywhere yet.

Well, that answers that! 

 

I didn't realize that. Thanks. 

[OccamsRazor]

10 hours ago, ruxpin said:

With $10M on the mantelpiece, would Rick Nash on a one-year been such a horrible move if just to help with the PK and a little veteran leadership?

 

I'm not a fan of Rick Nash by any stretch, but it might have been better than Corban Knight or Dale Waste.

 

Doesn't he play only RW?

 

So who you bumping out the lineup?

[ruxpin]

8 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

Doesn't he play only RW?

 

So who you bumping out the lineup?

I *think* he's also played LW, but in any case, i only was thinking for 4th line/PK specialist. Doesn't really work and I would have been against it in the offseason. I'd entertain it now, but I doubt he would