OccamsRazor Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, CoachX said: Why would tocchet be any tougher or hold players more accountable than AV did? Being a tough bastard is not a reason to hire a coach. Neither is the fa t you were a significant player for past Flyer teams. We don't need nostalgia. We've had, STILL HAVE, enough of that It's going to be ok they don't suck as bad as we thought.... Crisis averted thank the heavens... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 5 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Crisis averted thank the heavens... The "L" in "OTL" may not mean what they think it means... 40 more games... 3 points every 10 games... 12 more points. Looking forward to not "losing" the rest of the season. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 "Flyers' record losing streak is 9 games in 2006; record winless streak is 12 games in '99" Challenge accepted 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 29 minutes ago, CoachX said: Why would tocchet be any tougher or hold players more accountable than AV did? Being a tough bastard is not a reason to hire a coach. Neither is the fa t you were a significant player for past Flyer teams. We don't need nostalgia. We've had, STILL HAVE, enough of that Since Tocchet actually played hockey and knows what it takes to win, I think he would be better than AV. Since we have no leadership on the ice, it may have to come from the coach, so a hard ass like Tocchet might help. The fear of Pronger punching you in the face helped a lot of Flyers step up their game. So I’m hoping Tocchet would have that effect. If there is another coach out there that is better, I am all for it. It seems that in the NHL they just rehire the some losing coaches from other teams that have been around for 20 years. We so need a coach who is gonna let the young guys prosper by putting them in a position to succeed. Guys like Yeo and AV put a finesse guy like Frost with the fourth line stiffs, he needs to play with skilled players to develop properly. We are losing anyway, so who cares if we lose by one goal or five. Be realistic and write off the season and let the young guys play and give them plenty of ice time so they can be better prepared for next season. These old school coaches will keep playing guys like Brassard over younger skilled players. Edited January 21, 2022 by RonJeremy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FD19372 Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 4 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: Since Tocchet actually played hockey and knows what it takes to win, I think he would be better than AV. Since we have no leadership on the ice, it may have to come from the coach, so a hard ass like Tocchet might help. The fear of Pronger punching you in the face helped a lot of Flyers step up their game. So I’m hoping Tocchet would have that effect. If there is another coach out there that is better, I am all for it. It seems that in the NHL they just rehire the some losing coaches from other teams that have been around for 20 years. We so need a coach who is gonna let the young guys prosper by putting them in a position to succeed. Guys like Yeo and AV put a finesse guy like Frost with the fourth line stiffs, he needs to play with skilled players to develop properly. We are losing anyway, so who cares if we lose by one goal or five. Be realistic and write off the season and let the young guys play and give them plenty of ice time so they can be better prepared for next season. These old school coaches will keep playing guys like Brassard over younger skilled players. Tocchet might be better than AV for this group, but he hasn't proven he can win a thing. Nor has Yeo. Not a damned thing will change until the higher-ups and their horrible hockey culture, are gone. I'm not a fan of hiring Tocchet, but in all honesty, it won't really matter who the coach is, until the *organization learns from their mistakes, and learns how to adapt to the new NHL...then puts it into practice. Flyers culture sucks. I've said it before and I'll say it again. The best thing that can really happen to this team, is Comcast sells it, and the new ownership forces Holmgren, Scott and the rest out. As it is, they are eroding their culture and fanbase...and they are in complete denial. They are killing the love of NHL hockey for their objective fanbase. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmatus Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 (edited) 25 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: The fear of Pronger punching you in the face helped a lot of Flyers step up their game. Did it? I honestly very much doubt this was the kind of thing that impacted many players to suddenly become more talented or capable on the ice. If fear of significant retribution is your primary motivator, you're on a slippery slope to crash and burn. Sure, holding players accountable is important, but it should never be the only tool in the belt or even the most important one. It's the kind of tool you yank out on occasion to push an underperforming player who's having a bad night, not something that can somehow make an entire team play measurably above their heads. This roster isn't good enough. Period. Does AV carry any blame for their failures? I'm sure he does to some extent, but definitely not all of it. He played with the cards he was dealt. Could he have played a bit better? Maybe, but he was also dealt a weak hand. There's only so much you can do. I would love to see the organization gutted. Tear it down. Replace the old boys club with fresh eyes and minds. Let them develop a new vision that properly suits the modern NHL, and give them the chance to enact that vision by drafting and developing a better core, and acquiring whatever other key pieces needed to complement that core. Will that happen? Likely not, but hey, we can hope. At the very least, I want to see less passing the blame around and more admitting their part in this whole deal. I want to hear Clarke, and Homer, and Fletch say: "I messed up. I take responsibility for MY mistakes. The vision and planning I was a part of has failed, and I share in that blame." I doubt we'll get any of that either, but it would be a great start to at least make fans feel like they're not just shouting in the wind all the time. Edited January 21, 2022 by elmatus 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 17 minutes ago, FD19372 said: Tocchet might be better than AV for this group, but he hasn't proven he can win a thing. Nor has Yeo. Not a damned thing will change until the higher-ups and their horrible hockey culture, are gone. I'm not a fan of hiring Tocchet, but in all honesty, it won't really matter who the coach is, until the *organization learns from their mistakes, and learns how to adapt to the new NHL...then puts it into practice. Flyers culture sucks. I've said it before and I'll say it again. The best thing that can really happen to this team, is Comcast sells it, and the new ownership forces Holmgren, Scott and the rest out. As it is, they are eroding their culture and fanbase...and they are in complete denial. They are killing the love of NHL hockey for their objective fanbase. Unfortunately, I don’t think Comcast is selling the team, so at best they would fire Clarke, Homer and Scott . The Rangers had a similar problem for many years , poor drafting and trading and with that moron Dolan from Cablevision butting in and they sucked for 20 years. I don’t know what happened but they seem to be on the tight track now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FD19372 Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 2 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: Unfortunately, I don’t think Comcast is selling the team, so at best they would fire Clarke, Homer and Scott . The Rangers had a similar problem for many years , poor drafting and trading and with that moron Dolan from Cablevision butting in and they sucked for 20 years. I don’t know what happened but they seem to be on the tight track now. Maybe Comcast gets tired of seeing empty seats, which I guarantee you, unless the construct of this team drastically changes, will happen next year. Maybe they'll be fed up from bleeding money. This team might just be giving them a bad image, recently. I just fear that we're going to have to go through another year of this. I mean..look at what happened last night. They honored one of the most overrated players in the history of the franchise, Jakub Voracek. WHHHYYYY??? They are completely out of touch with reality, and the fanbase. That's why. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said: It's going to be ok they don't suck as bad as we thought.... Crisis averted thank the heavens... I wonder if this means that of the few teams with 10 game losing streaks...we are the winners? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizz Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 1 hour ago, FD19372 said: Maybe Comcast gets tired of seeing empty seats, which I guarantee you, unless the construct of this team drastically changes, will happen next year. Maybe they'll be fed up from bleeding money. This team might just be giving them a bad image, recently. I just fear that we're going to have to go through another year of this. I mean..look at what happened last night. They honoured one of the most overrated players in the history of the franchise, Jakub Voracek. WHHHYYYY??? They are completely out of touch with reality, and the fanbase. That's why. Seriously? They honoured Voracek. Why oh why......lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 3 hours ago, RonJeremy said: Since Tocchet actually played hockey and knows what it takes to win, I think he would be better than AV. So when can we expect this to take place? He has a coaching record of 178-200, and a .406% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 21, 2022 Author Share Posted January 21, 2022 2 hours ago, FD19372 said: I just fear that we're going to have to go through another year of this Just a year? When did you become Mojo1917? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 22 minutes ago, CoachX said: So when can we expect this to take place? He has a coaching record of 178-200, and a .406% He coached crappy teams, he isn’t God. Scotty Bowman would have had a similar record with that team. We can expect this to happen when the GM builds a proper team and gives the coach the pieces he needs to win. It is then up to the coach to motivate and execute winning hockey. Considering we have sucked for most of the past eleven years and been through seven coaches it may never happen with the current upper management and their old school mentality in place. I have no problem bringing in some younger coach or someone from outside but who is that? So you don’t want Tocchet, I’m not hearing any other suggestions from you. Who do you have in mind? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizz Posted January 21, 2022 Share Posted January 21, 2022 We need a proper GM before looking for a HC. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 22, 2022 Author Share Posted January 22, 2022 39 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: So you don’t want Tocchet, I’m not hearing any other suggestions from you. Who do you have in mind? Jim Montgomery (assuming he has gotten his alcohol issues under control) Claude Julien, Mike Babcock, John Tortorella Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 22, 2022 Author Share Posted January 22, 2022 23 minutes ago, Fizz said: We need a proper GM before looking for a HC. I thought AV was the problem ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizz Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 Just now, CoachX said: I thought AV was the problem ? Give it a rest buddy. You know damn well AV was an utter failure as HC. Hey I know you have a man crush on him but he failed as HC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 22, 2022 Author Share Posted January 22, 2022 19 minutes ago, Fizz said: Give it a rest buddy. You know damn well AV was an utter failure as HC. Hey I know you have a man crush on him but he failed as HC. No. I dont know this. If some other coach turns this current roster in to winners, then I will know AV was the problem I'm not addicted to the o/b Kool aid that makes people think every player who steps on the ice is a stud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonJeremy Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 4 minutes ago, CoachX said: No. I dont know this. If some other coach turns this current roster in to winners, then I will know AV was the problem I'm not addicted to the o/b Kool aid that makes people think every player who steps on the ice is a stud I think AV, Fletcher, upper management and the players are the problem. Fletcher drafted a couple of good players especially Foerester but he failed miserably in trades. AV and older coaches like him love to dress a team full of Brassards and Browns and give young skilled guys like Frost 3 minutes with fourth line stiffs. Clarke and Homer are stuck in the past and a lot of our players are underachievers or overrated. So everyone is to blame. The organization needs an enema. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachX Posted January 22, 2022 Author Share Posted January 22, 2022 14 minutes ago, RonJeremy said: I think AV, Fletcher, upper management and the players are the problem. Fletcher drafted a couple of good players especially Foerester but he failed miserably in trades. AV and older coaches like him love to dress a team full of Brassards and Browns and give young skilled guys like Frost 3 minutes with fourth line stiffs. Clarke and Homer are stuck in the past and a lot of our players are underachievers or overrated. So everyone is to blame. The organization needs an enema. I dont disagree However, going into the 2019 playoffs, this was one of the hottest teams in the league. Many of us thought they were legit contenders and I dont recall a lynch mob forming for AVs head. I dont care that he got fired. I care that they blamed another coach for the players failures Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 minute ago, CoachX said: However, going into the 2019 playoffs, this was one of the hottest teams in the league. Many of us thought they were legit contenders Just trowing a dart at the moving target .....could that team massively overachieved??? Just thinking outside the box. Would not be the first time any team in any sport performed well over their collective heads ......just food for thought.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 hour ago, CoachX said: Jim Montgomery (assuming he has gotten his alcohol issues under control) How in the hell do you expect any of us to have our alcohol issues under control when we're affiliated with this **** show? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 53 minutes ago, CoachX said: I dont disagree However, going into the 2019 playoffs, this was one of the hottest teams in the league. Many of us thought they were legit contenders and I dont recall a lynch mob forming for AVs head. I dont care that he got fired. I care that they blamed another coach for the players failures Stellar goaltending can hide a serious number of deficiencies in any team. Fact is, when they got to the playoffs, Montreal exposed them and New York decimated them. After that, the book was out on how to defeat the Flyers and Vigneault never adjusted his game plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fizz Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: Stellar goaltending can hide a serious number of deficiencies in any team. Fact is, when they got to the playoffs, Montreal exposed them and New York decimated them. After that, the book was out on how to defeat the Flyers and Vigneault never adjusted his game plan. You hit the nail on the head with this post. Playing a team over and over exposed AV as I coach that could not make adjustments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 22, 2022 Share Posted January 22, 2022 7 hours ago, FD19372 said: *organization Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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