Vanflyer Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Who should win the Calder trophy? For me its a toss up between Landeskog and Read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terp Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Who should win the Calder trophy? For me its a toss up between Landeskog and Read.Age is going to enter into it. We can debate whether it should or not but it will. I think Landekog will win pretty easily because he's six years younger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 While I would love to see Read get the Calder, Landeskog should probably win it at this point. Not only is he leading in goals and points, he's come on at the right time (21 of his 48 points in the last two months) and has helped Colorado climb back into the Playoff picture.He is second among rookies in +/- {Interesting note, Flyers have 4 of the top 10 - Couturier (3rd), Gustafsson (t-5th), Wellwood (7th in 17 games!), and Read (t-8th)}, plays in all situations, leads all rookie forwards in ice time, and is fourth among qualified rookies in points per game. The only thing that might propel Nugent-Hopkins over him is that he has one fewer point at this stage over 22 fewer games.Read, unfortunately, just won't get the consideration he deserves, even though he's second in goals and 4th in points. Writers are going to forget that unlike the other three of the top four, Read spent the majority of the season on the third line - yet, despite this, he only has 5 points less than Landeskog in 5 fewer games. Henrique has 4 more points than him, but is playing between Parise and Kovalchuk. If he didn't have more points than Read, it would be surprising. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 i took the homer vote, based upon Read's role on the team, and postition in the draft... oh wait he wasn't drafted, which i think makes for a better story. though i agree with those that say Ladeskog will win it , if Gabriel does win i won't cry foul, he's had a great season. Van is right it is a toss up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 It's bizarre no Flyer has ever won this thing. Considering how well we draft, you'd think we'd have grabbed it at least once. Of all the rookies who've played for the Flyers, Read has been the best (as good as Couturier has been, they don't give awards to defensive players, the Norris generally goes to the highest scoring defenceman, the Selke to the highest scoring defensively responsible forward). But IMO we'll be waiting even longer cause I don't see Read getting this one. Playing on a team with so many rookies is going to cost you for one thing. His age is going to go against him. And considering most of his competition got to play on their teams top lines likely gave them better linemates and more icetime (he plays about 1 1/2 minutes less per game than Landeskog or Henrique) My vote goes to Landeskog. He's younger than Read by 7 years, and Henrique by 4. That's huge when judging a Calder in a close race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I would love for Read to win it, but you have to give it to Landeskog.Without him, the Avs are nowhere near the playoffs.Take Read off the Flyers and they probably don't miss a beat.He is having a great rookie season, though. And he clearly ought to finish ahead of Nugent-Hopkins. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sarsippius Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Can I write in Couturier?Yeah I know the Calder is awarded strictly on point production, but show me another rookie who has been trusted with so much responsibility. And responded. That boy's a hockey player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aziz Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Can I write in Couturier?Yeah I know the Calder is awarded strictly on point production, but show me another rookie who has been trusted with so much responsibility. And responded. That boy's a hockey player.i agree. it's too bad the calder is pretty much all about point totals, and that all around contribution doesn't really play into it. honestly, if the flyers for some reason could only dress one of read or couturier, i'd rather it be couturier...he fills a more important role for the team...of all the flyers rookies, he is "the most proficient in his first year of competition in the National Hockey League."but read is the one getting any attention for the calder. anyway, #14 gets my vote. from the flyers, anyway. he plays a veteran's role like a veteran, which is what the wording of the award seems to be there to honor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHI Flyers10 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 I can't say I've seen Landeskog play at all this year but from what I've heard, I'd likely give him my vote. RNH should have been the winner but his injury cost him. He was almost at a point-per-game production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phillygrump Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 @VanflyerRead, but I'm being completely biased. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted March 25, 2012 Share Posted March 25, 2012 Read did have some early season hype, it could happen, though I think his age will really work against him unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
five6four Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Landeskog deserves this running away. Nothing against Coots or Read (or Nuge, who would probably win it with a full healthy season), but Landeskog has been playing first line minutes in Colorado (#1 rookie forward in ice time/game), killing penalties, and playing a leading role on a team contending for the playoffs. I would rank them:LandeskogNugent-HopkinsHenriqueReadand then tough to pick a 5th out of Couturier, Hagelin, Gardiner, Hodgson, Voynov Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @terp"Age is going to enter into it. We can debate whether it should or not but it will. I think Landekog will win pretty easily because he's six years younger."I agree with your point on the age thing. For me, I think the only thing I would say (and I am reaching here) is that Colorados cupboards are pretty bar. Meaning its pretty easy for Ladeskog to get top minutes and an opportunity to shine- whereas with the Flyers, not nearly as much. The other thing (and again I am grasping here) is that Read more minutes on the PK. Yet, at the end of the day, considering points and +/- and (unfortunately) age, Landeskog should win. I probably should have also included Hagelin from the NYR in the poll. He does not play near the same minutes as Read and Landeskog, but his production and +/- are excellent for the minutes he does play. As an aside, collegiate hockey in the US is starting to really produce some fine players (JVR withstanding :-)). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
five6four Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 ...and even JVR isnt a 'procuct' of the US collegiate system. He is a product of the US Development system, who wanted to party in college for a couple years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @flyercanuck"It's bizarre no Flyer has ever won this thing. Considering how well we draft, you'd think we'd have grabbed it at least once."Would have liked to have seen Pelle Eklund get it. Lindros maybe, but Selanne had one of the most incredible rookie campaigns ever for a rookie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @aziz- The only thing with #14 is he does not have the minutes like the others. Its not his fault- as he certainly could easily play them. Thats kind of my argument about Landeskog- you put him on the Flyers and how many minutes do you think he gets? On a thin Colorado team, he gets the big minutes (same with Nugent-Hopkins). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 Landeskog currently has 4 more points than Read. He has his 22 goals on 253 shots where as Matt Read has his 21g on 146 shots including a shortie. Both players have 5gwg. Even though the playoffs are not supposed to factor in, I wouldn't be surprised if the player who contributes the most in the first round of the playoffs wins the Calder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @five6fourIt probably would have been better for JVR to play in Juniors (perhaps OHL), I don't think I would say Hockey East is a slouch "party" league. There are some pretty good teams. As an aside JVR's younger brother was rookie of the year in the Hockey East league (playing for UNH). Supposedly his 3rd brother is suppose to be the cream of the crop of the 4 Van Riemsdyks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanflyer Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @hf101"Even though the playoffs are not supposed to factor in, I wouldn't be surprised if the player who contributes the most in the first round of the playoffs wins the Calder."Votes are submitted prior to the playoffs- aren't they?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @Vanflyeryeah, they are........I'm stretching here. I just think it is a bit shady behind the scenes especially with close votes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
five6four Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 It probably would have been better for JVR to play in Juniors (perhaps OHL), I don't think I would say Hockey East is a slouch "party" league. There are some pretty good teams.By no means was I taking a shot at UNH or Hockey East, and the 'party' comment was exaggeration. Since he was a US player, he could have gone straight to the AHL after being drafted, where he would have played superior competition (physically and skill wise). Going to UNH for two years was an easier route for him, but definitely hindered his development. Pretty sure Homer echoed those sentiments when JVR was deciding to go to college (and then after deciding to return for a 2nd year) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terp Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @VanflyerI don't think your points are reaching though still, Landeskog is having a better season even if he's doing it with more ice time. More points, better +/- as you point out. That and his age make it a no brainer really. And truthfully, given his size, he'll probably have a better career than Read. As much as I like Read, I'd trade him for Landeskog in a nonosecond. Trading Couturier for Landeskog is a much more challenging hypothetical. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
five6four Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 interestingly enough....in point production (TOI/pt) among rookies with over 50 games, Read does come out ahead of Landeskog, maybe because of Landeskog generally getting matched against other teams shutdown lines. Nugent-Hopkins is way ahead of everyone, though. I wonder how much playing a full season matters to the voters. PLAYER GP PROD Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, C 55 20:38 Carl Hagelin, LW 57 23:16 Adam Henrique, C 67 26:09 Cody Hodgson, C 77 26:36 Matt Read, RW 72 28:32 Gabriel Landeskog, LW 77 29:48 Craig Smith, C 70 30:20 Luke Adam, C 52 32:14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 (edited) interestingly enough....in point production (TOI/pt) among rookies with over 50 games, Read does come out ahead of Landeskog, maybe because of Landeskog generally getting matched against other teams shutdown lines. Nugent-Hopkins is way ahead of everyone, though. I wonder how much playing a full season matters to the voters. No "maybe" about it.I like Read a lot. I think he has 30+ goal scorer written all over him. I've always liked the idea of signing college players. (Doing that helped Anaheim win the Cup back in '07.)That being said, is there a single person on this forum who would not trade Read for Landeskog straight up (and do it so fast that your head would spin)? I highly doubt it. That kid is a beast. I thought he was the best player in the entire draft (and was relieved that the Rangers didn't get him). Edited March 26, 2012 by AndyS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyS Posted March 26, 2012 Share Posted March 26, 2012 @VanflyerI don't think your points are reaching though still, Landeskog is having a better season even if he's doing it with more ice time. More points, better +/- as you point out. That and his age make it a no brainer really. And truthfully, given his size, he'll probably have a better career than Read. As much as I like Read, I'd trade him for Landeskog in a nonosecond. Trading Couturier for Landeskog is a much more challenging hypothetical.Love Cooter, but I would trade him for Landeskog in a heartbeat. No question.And I think that Cooter is going to be a very good NHL player. Hopefully a future all-star for the Flyers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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