So does Letang get suspended for crosschecking the linesman?

[flyercanuck]

@DaGreatGazoo

So, who's side are you on?

Fair enough, I'm done.

[Polaris922]

@flyercanuck

For the record... I like ya. LOL Not in a gay way just sort of hockey fan kind of way if that matters. And I do appreciate it when you've stuck up for me. As for the hypocrite comment, it was more regarding hypocrisy on hating Pens players for getting away with things while not hating Flyers players for similar incidents... NOT in how you live your life or anything I have no way of knowing about. I do appreciate our debates as it makes me look at things from a broader angle, so to speak. And unlike Gaz.. I kind of enjoy when we bring up other stuff into debates because I learn more that way. It's fun for me to read and go through all this stuff. It's the friendlier way to be rivals I suppose, and that works just fine for me. LOL

[B21]

First off all, I agree that anyone calling for a LeWang suspension is pure hatin because it was not a suspension worthy incident. But implying that Berube intended to punch an official in the face while trying to take one last shot at the enemy he was just in a fight with?? Well that is either pure hatin or pure ignorance on your part. Your choice.

Good. I agree, too. Neither should be suspended.

That said - read the first 6 posts. You have to admit that it's kind of ironic that with all the "Pens play under a separate set of rules..." and "Pens are Gary's pets..." and all the other wreaking-of-playoff-envy-no-Cup-in-40-years bitterness that it takes a Pens fan finding a similar incident involving a Flyer before the calls for a suspension for Letang suddenly die down. Of course, can't kill the Pens without a little of the "Rinaldo is a victim" act, too.

All I did was use the same rationale in analyzing the Berube incident that was used in analyzing the Letang incident and watched the excuses come out for Berube.

Frankly, I'm tired of it too. I'm tired of the BS that comes from many here about the Pens. Favorites. League darlings. Can't touch Crosby. Wah Wah Wah.

99% of it is nothing but nitpicking. Can't find anything so just make it up. If I see that, I'll challenge it every single time if it's clearly "hatin'" and especially if it's unfounded (which it usually is).

[B21]

Here's an idea..let's drag out every incident in the last 20 years and compare them. This thread is ridiculous right now. Lock the damn thing and move on....

To be blunt, I am beyond sick and tired of the constant back and forth between Flyers and Pens fans that ultimately ends up in petty bickering. Pens fans think their players do little/no wrong, Flyers fans think the refs favor the Pens, and Flyers fans think the league is out to get the Flyers With a few exceptions, that pretty much covers every argument between Flyers and Pens fans.

Take it up with your fans. You guys usually start it (see: this thread). Go ahead and see if you can find a thread started by a Pens fans calling for a Flyer to be suspended for some trivial BS.

It's not every day that a guy clocks an official (as opposed to say boarding) so I had to go back 20 years.

[DaGreatGazoo]

Hey, I'm a master debater, let me tell you. Polaris and I had a good discussion regarding the 3rd man in non-call as well. I also think the original question in this thread was legit, and discussed pretty thoroughly.

I don't think what Letang did was petty BS..at first glance. Once the story about him talking it over with the linesman came out, it made sense. At the time this thread was started, I don't think that was public knowledge. I also don't think it was suspension worthy, in my opinion. As Polaris and I discussed, I thought the 3rd man in should have been called-again, in my opinion.

I think it should be pointed out that there have been other threads started regarding hits/suspensions etc. Started by Flyers fans, that were NOT about the Pens.

[DaGreatGazoo]

@DaGreatGazoo

So, who's side are you on?

Fair enough, I'm done.

The US, of course! Oh wait, wrong thread! LOL.

[trevluk]

I'm tired of the BS that comes from many here about the Pens. Favorites. League darlings.

I'm fine with everything you say, but it does seem that the Pens are the darlings of the league right now and Crosby is clearly the the NHL's poster child. (With good reason - he is probably the best player in the league.) I'm not saying that the Pens get preferential treatment, though there are some questionable instances, but it does seem that league and the media paints the Pens as the "good guys" of the league, riding in with their white hats on their white horses. I would bet big though that a lot of the BS you get on this forum from Flyers fans is straight up jealousy that your team is quite a bit better than ours right now.

[Polaris922]

I'm fine with everything you say, but it does seem that the Pens are the darlings of the league right now and Crosby is clearly the the NHL's poster child. (With good reason - he is probably the best player in the league.) I'm not saying that the Pens get preferential treatment, though there are some questionable instances, but it does seem that league and the media paints the Pens as the "good guys" of the league, riding in with their white hats on their white horses. I would bet big though that a lot of the BS you get on this forum from Flyers fans is straight up jealousy that your team is quite a bit better than ours right now.

Kind of ironic though huh? To a lot of fans the Flyers are the bad guys of the league... You guys get hammered on so many open forums as the dirtiest or the goons. It's no more your team's style than any other team's anymore, but you get a black hat wrap sometimes.

Makes for a great rivalry. We're getting the better of it for now, but that won't last forever...

[DaGreatGazoo]

We're getting the better of it for now, but that won't last forever...

Yes it will, as long as Homer is in town.

[Polaris922]

Yes it will, as long as Homer is in town.

I do agree you need a GM change and a change or philosophy that usually comes with it.

[B21]

Hey, I'm a master debater, let me tell you. Polaris and I had a good discussion regarding the 3rd man in non-call as well. I also think the original question in this thread was legit, and discussed pretty thoroughly.

I don't think what Letang did was petty BS..at first glance. Once the story about him talking it over with the linesman came out, it made sense. At the time this thread was started, I don't think that was public knowledge. I also don't think it was suspension worthy, in my opinion. As Polaris and I discussed, I thought the 3rd man in should have been called-again, in my opinion.

I think it should be pointed out that there have been other threads started regarding hits/suspensions etc. Started by Flyers fans, that were NOT about the Pens.

You're a masterbater? (Sorry - you walked into that one.)

True - there are other threads about other hits/suspensions/non-suspensions but aside from the Kronwall threads, they go something like this...

"That hit did not deserve a suspension. I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Or....

"How can you not suspend that guy! I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Now add the Pens to the equation and you usually get....

"Of course he's not suspended. He plays for the Pens. They are the league's darlings. Buttman blows Cindy. Malkin is ugly. I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Or...

"Of course he gets suspended. You can't touch Cindy! I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

See the difference?

[DaGreatGazoo]

You're a masterbater? (Sorry - you walked into that one.)

True - there are other threads about other hits/suspensions/non-suspensions but aside from the Kronwall threads, they go something like this...

"That hit did not deserve a suspension. I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Or....

"How can you not suspend that guy! I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Now add the Pens to the equation and you usually get....

"Of course he's not suspended. He plays for the Pens. They are the league's darlings. Buttman blows Cindy. Malkin is ugly. I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

Or...

"Of course he gets suspended. You can't touch Cindy! I hate the league's inconsistency. F Shanaban."

See the difference?

No. Not at all.

[B21]

I'm fine with everything you say, but it does seem that the Pens are the darlings of the league right now and Crosby is clearly the the NHL's poster child. (With good reason - he is probably the best player in the league.) I'm not saying that the Pens get preferential treatment, though there are some questionable instances, but it does seem that league and the media paints the Pens as the "good guys" of the league, riding in with their white hats on their white horses. I would bet big though that a lot of the BS you get on this forum from Flyers fans is straight up jealousy that your team is quite a bit better than ours right now.

I'll agree about Crosby being the poster child but to me that's marketing - nothing more. At the end of the day, the ratings are better when he's around. I don't think it means prefential treatment on the ice any more than any other big time star player in any league. That said, you really don't see him featured in ads, commercials, etc.

As for the Pens being "darlings" - I think a lot of that stems from all those top 5 picks they got (especially the Crosby draft) at a time when their future was in doubt. I'd expect the casual fan to not know the circumestances of the Crosby lottery or the events that kept the Pens at or near the bottom of the standings for all those years. Therefore, I'd expect that kind of BS to come from the casual fan. Of course, I don't think anyone here is a casual fan...so I would expect better.

The Pens have been afterthougths the last few seasons. If they win the Cup then yeah - they will get a lot more publicity...like any other Cup winner.

[Polaris922]

@B21

The Pens having the best TV ratings in the league (Forbes Magazine) proves the marketing comment.

[B21]

@B21

The Pens having the best TV ratings in the league (Forbes Magazine) proves the marketing comment.

Highest local ratings of any NHL, NBA or MLB team, too.

[canoli]

you don't really believe all the "League Darling" clichés come outta nowhere do you? Or they're out of jealousy? Nah nobody could believe that. The fact that they are clichés is proof enough...the endless parade of penalties called/not called in favor of the Pens, the Whiplash Kid who can't stay on his skates whenever somebody lays a glove on him...

"Surprise surprise, another Pens' game ends with them on the PP." - just one of many. How often do they happen? Often enough they're clichés. I don't know about anyone else but for me there's no jealousy in it at all, I just get disgusted when the rink tilts too much one way or the other that's all.

Awhile back it was the Wings. Before them for a long time it was the Habs and the Leafs. And it still is the Habs whenever they play at home (and that is every game). But since the Crosby/Malkin era you guys are without a doubt "the ones." Maybe because it's never been the Flyers we're a little more sensitive to it...I don't know, could be.

Sid's cut down on the whining and complaining; he's better now. Of course considering where he started - the sheer tonnage of whine and tears (!) - he could only get better. ha!

[Polaris922]

2011-2012 Flyers had more power play (1st) opportunities than the Pens (4th). Despite your miserable season this year you still had fourth highest, Pens rose to second.

So how exactly are we more darlings than you?? The problem is its always opinion. Base it on facts.

[TedZep]

Base it on facts.

We can use this first game against the Senators. Orpik crosschecks a guy to the ice, whistle blows, he crosschecks him to the face with the ref 5' away and no penalty. Kennedy trips a guy and is ready to skate to the sin bin automatically, no call. Orpik puts his stick in Neal's crotch and won't let him go, no call. A hook to the waist that slid down to the ankles and completed a trip, no call. All that happened. Facts is facts. The Senators did get away with a trip that seemed fairly obvious, so I guess that evens it up.

[Polaris922]

We can use this first game against the Senators. Orpik crosschecks a guy to the ice, whistle blows, he crosschecks him to the face with the ref 5' away and no penalty. Kennedy trips a guy and is ready to skate to the sin bin automatically, no call. Orpik puts his stick in Neal's crotch and won't let him go, no call. A hook to the waist that slid down to the ankles and completed a trip, no call. All that happened. Facts is facts. The Senators did get away with a trip that seemed fairly obvious, so I guess that evens it up.

The Orpik's non-call appeared to be a makeup for putting Neal in the box and not Turis for dumping Malkin. It's the playoffs... Call Orpik for the stick on Neil? Then call Neil for trying to dry hump him for 30 seconds prompting the stick. The Pens went to the box plenty. All the non-calls you're moaning about I can match. Cross check in Crosby's back? Neil skating through and "bumping" Vokoun after the whistle? Methot interfering with Malkin in the corner as the puck is in the other corner...

I think Kleenex should design a box with a Flyers logo on it. Theyd make a fortune. At least @nossagog, @B21 and I all accept that the calls go both ways most of the time. Tonight I thought they did a good job of filtering impact calls from nonsense. They blew a couple both ways... Whaa whaa whaaa..... Good grief.

No rebuttal for the darling Flyers power play disparity? So this is the best you could come up with?

It's a conspiracy! Might as well start engraving the Pens' names on it now!

Edited May 15, 2013 by Polaris922

[nossagog]

We can use this first game against the Senators. Orpik crosschecks a guy to the ice, whistle blows, he crosschecks him to the face with the ref 5' away and no penalty. Kennedy trips a guy and is ready to skate to the sin bin automatically, no call. Orpik puts his stick in Neal's crotch and won't let him go, no call. A hook to the waist that slid down to the ankles and completed a trip, no call. All that happened. Facts is facts. The Senators did get away with a trip that seemed fairly obvious, so I guess that evens it up.

And Iginla gets checked from behind into the boards with no call, Dupuis gets his legs taken out going into the boards after a shot but not call, Neil takes Murray into the boards on and icing call, yep no call. Conaker takes Malkins feet out from him with his stick after the whistle in a scrum, no call. What's your point, that the ref's left things go? Yep they did, BOTH WAYS. The problem is that you can only see what one team does, and completely ignore what the other does. Hey, you complain about Sid diving, but you fail to mention Karlson flopping to the ice as Neal is going to blow right by him. Watch the whole game.

Edited May 15, 2013 by nossagog

[trevluk]

but you fail to mention Karlson flopping to the ice as Neal is going to blow right by him.

That is a bit of an exaggeration if it is the play I am thinking about. When Neal skated past Karlson and grabbed him with his free hand as he went by? Karlson defintely sold the call but he hardly flopped to the ice (he didnt even go down at all, just made sure the ref saw that he was pulled back off balance by Neal) and regardless it was a penalty if you go by the book. A dumb penalty at that as it appeared Neal had him beat anyhow and didnt need to grab him with his free hand.

[nossagog]

That is a bit of an exaggeration if it is the play I am thinking about. When Neal skated past Karlson and grabbed him with his free hand as he went by? Karlson defintely sold the call but he hardly flopped to the ice (he didnt even go down at all, just made sure the ref saw that he was pulled back off balance by Neal) and regardless it was a penalty if you go by the book. A dumb penalty at that as it appeared Neal had him beat anyhow and didnt need to grab him with his free hand.

Trap activated. Ah, see, its not an exageration at all, if that's what you're looking for. For the record, I thought it should have been a noncall based on the rest of the game, but yes, Karlson sold it. Did I like the call, no, do I see why it was called, sure.

But let's insert Crosby in Karlson's place, imagine the uproar. The haters would create threads and keep them going for, well how long has THIS thread been going for a non issue. Here's a secret, ALL players sell calls.

And I could sit here and try to justify Orpik's stick in Neil's crotch because Neil was holding Orpik's head down and wouldn't let him up. Or Orpik's "crosscheck"(really a punch with the glove hand on the stick) because the guy's slashing at his legs. See I can justify all those thing, but wait, let me take off my black/gold colored glasses. If I want to sit here and watch the next playoff game just to prove that a team benefits from calls/noncalls, I could do it for either of the teams? But what would be the true point? I'd probably miss a heck of a hockey game.

Edited May 15, 2013 by nossagog

[B21]

Trap activated. Ah, see, its not an exageration at all, if that's what you're looking for. For the record, I thought it should have been a noncall based on the rest of the game, but yes, Karlson sold it. Did I like the call, no, do I see why it was called, sure.

But let's insert Crosby in Karlson's place, imagine the uproar. The haters would create threads and keep them going for, well how long has THIS thread been going for a non issue. Here's a secret, ALL players sell calls.

And I could sit here and try to justify Orpik's stick in Neil's crotch because Neil was holding Orpik's head down and wouldn't let him up. Or Orpik's "crosscheck"(really a punch with the glove hand on the stick) because the guy's slashing at his legs. See I can justify all those thing, but wait, let me take off my black/gold colored glasses. If I want to sit here and watch the next playoff game just to prove that a team benefits from calls/noncalls, I could do it for either of the teams? But what would be the true point? I'd probably miss a heck of a hockey game.

Is there an "Extra Agree" button?

I swear - some of these guys have never seen a Pens game. Too busy scouring the play for any perceived call/non-call that goes our way. Just relax and play some golf already. Maybe see the Flyers while your out there.

Your point about Crosby instead of Karlsson is spot on.

[Polaris922]

Two minutes for embellishment evens up the call. How many times do we see both?

[mojo1917]

@polariss922

didn't conachar go to the box for embellishment last night ?

i thought i heard that, i could be wrong i was not fully engaged in with the tv as it was around my daughters bed time, which has lots of trips to the bathroom with extended stays in the door way asking me about the game, the weather, did that person write back to her. etc etc. so i might have just overheard someone saying he should go for diving...