East vs. West

[brelic]

12 of the 14 teams in the West have more points than 8th place New Jersey in the East.

The craziest stat? Boston leads the East with 29 points. If they were in the West, they would be in 9th place! They wouldn't even make the playoffs.

Is the East just really weak (including Boston, Pittsburgh, Washington), or is something else skewing the numbers?

[fan4ever]

@brelic

 

Interesting you would post this.  I was just looking at the standings and am amazed that so few East teams are in the top 10.  It really does appear that the West is really strong.  I don't know what could/would be skewing the numbers other than the fact that I think that the West has the better teams.  They are winning the bulk of the last few cups too, no?

 

I guess we Flyers fans will find out on our West coast road swing soon.....

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

Hmm...some observations:

 

There is NO question, that as of now, the West has a larger number of teams that can be considered real contenders.

Having said that however, and in looking at overall records and the standings using STRAIGHT UP wins and losses (as opposed to just looking at standings points, which are skewed due to 'loser points'), one can see that the West isn't as head n shoulders above the East as many (especially the media), would have you believe.

 

I went over to ESPN and went to the NHL standings page where they let you toggle them in different ways, and I found some interesting stuff.

 

15 of the 30 NHL teams are .500 or better (again, using straight wins and losses). Out of those 15, 9 are Western teams, 6 are Eastern teams.  9-6.  Doesn't really seem THAT overwhelming a difference, does it? Furthermore, of the teams that are below .500, I can see about 4 teams (NYR, Det, Ott, and Phi) that SHOULD be above .500, whom I believe are underperforming so far. Now those teams may or may not right their respective ships, but given the entire season, I believe those 4 teams could be a factor in any playoff discussions.

 

Western teams below .500 that should be above? Right now, looks to me like only 2.

Definitely Vancouver, possibly Nashville (really this team is an enigma to me since last season....no Pekka Rinne, no playoffs? Could be...).

 

Then you could look at teams overall that ARE above .500 now, and think, which ones would most likely slide below .500 as the season wears on....I'd say perhaps two in Dallas and Montreal...though the Habs have the potential to shoot UP the standings given their speed, skill, and Price stealing games for them in net.

Others like Colorado, Tampa Bay, Washington, and possibly Phoenix, have gotten off to good to great starts, and no doubt well earned, but due to those teams having poor to mediocre seasons previously, must still prove they have the chops to STAY a top team for an entire 82 game schedule.

 

Looking at East / West teams under those scenarios, it just seems to me that the difference in the two Conferences, again, is not really that big.....unless of course, you are looking at straight standings points

Yes, yes, I know...standing points is EXACTLY what will get you, or keep you OUT of the playoffs. That is an inescapable fact. However, I believe, and I think many other fans do too, that the current point system is flawed and should be adjusted. That probably won't happen for quite awhile, if ever, but IMO as long as the NHL continues to reward teams who lose games in extra sessions or shoot outs, the BEST teams won't always be reflected in point standings.

That's all I will say on that particular subject, because that is a whole other topic for an entirely different thread...  ^_^

 

Some other interesting notes in looking at overall standings:

One of East's worst teams, the Panthers, has an ok record against supposedly vastly superior West teams (5-5-2...or 5-7 as I like to look at it..   ), while one of the West's best teams, the Anaheim Ducks has just a .500 record against a supposed vastly inferior East (8-5-3).

 

Anomalies, are of course, to be expected, and again, we are all looking at things from the standpoint of having played only about 25% of the season.

 

While I do NOT dispute the West overall has better teams in terms of being truer contenders, I believe that when all is said and done, we will see that things will seem much more level.

 

One last thing:

To me, there is a difference between just being a playoff contender and being a STANLEY CUP contender.

 

In that regard, I only see Pittsburgh and Boston over in the East as teams that could be legitimately labeled as Cup contenders. They seem to be the most complete at this point in the season, and look to stay that way, or even improve, in teh games to come.

 

Over in the West, there are probably many more that can be labeled Cup contenders:

IMO, those would be Los Angeles, San Jose, Chicago, St. Louis, possibly Anaheim. Those teams have been consistent year in, year out, for the last few seasons...while teams like Phoenix, Colorado, Minnesota still have to prove they belong in the Cup contender categories, despite getting off to very good starts this year.

 

So, in that particular regard, Cup contention, I would say, the West has a significant advantage...though of course, we have LOTS of hockey to play yet....and we will see the men separate themselves from the boys once the schedules settle in where teams are playing and beating on their Conference brothers.

Edited November 21, 2013 by TropicalFruitGirl26

[yave1964]

Well the West looks amazing right now, The Sharks and Hawks, Kings perhaps the Blues as the class of the game. Add teams like the Ducks, Canucks, Wild, Avalanche, Coyotes who are all difficult to play against and the West is just hands down over the east.

  I argued with Polaris before the season that outside of Pittsburgh no team in that division stuck out. The Flyers, Capitals and Rangers are the three teams that stand out as the next best and sadly they are terribly flawed. Just a bad division. These things are cyclical and they will bounce back but just really bad hockey from the metrosexual division.

  In my division we have the Panthers and Buffalo, wretched clubs but the other six are all roughly the same all are capable but flawed and will beat each other up all year and it will be a tight race between them all year. Parity between Boston, Montreal, Toronto, Detroit Tampa and Ottawa none really better or worse than the others. I said then and still feel the division will produce five playoff teams but none stand out.

  So who in the East as currently assembled has a chance against any of the Hawks, Kings, Blues or Sharks? None really IMHO. Long time to go between now and then but I do not see anyone in the East who can win a seven game series against any of at least the top four teams in the West. I think Colorado is a nice story but don't see them as a cup contender, same with the Wild or Yotes. I would put the best of the east, The Penguins and Bruins in the same class as Western teams like the Ducks and Canucks in the class below the big four.

 

  Nobody in the East, absolutely nobody can compete with the Kings, Hawks, Blues or Sharks. Nobody.

 

  Nobody in the Metropolitan save Pittsburgh can compete with the top six clubs on a nightly basis from the Atlantic.

Edited November 21, 2013 by yave1964

[Chicago Hawkie]

@TropicalFruitGirl26
 

Great post, and very interesting insights! 

[Chicago Hawkie]

Here are my 2 cents ...

 

I think many teams in the East, since they are so geograpically close to one another, tend to all play the same style of game.  This seemed partucularly evident in the last two decades when the dreaded neutral-zone trap was en vogue and almost every team in the East, as well as a few in the West, were using it.

[Rink Rat]

I wouldn't be surprised if all 8 playoffs teams from the West score over 100 points. That is how good the West has been this season.

[PenaltyMinuteChampion]

I'm new here so I'll thank you in advance for being cordial and welcoming. This is a great topic because the numbers are so lopsided conference-wise. However, this is nothing new. The West has been considerably better than the East for some time now. Granted, the Sharks and Blues wear the dunce cap of the West until they can win when it matters, but their path during the playoffs is significantly harder. On the flip side, the Capitals have the same problem, despite playing in the East and touting one of the best players in the world on their roster.

 

To say that NOBODY can compete with the West outside of Pittsburgh may be putting the carriage ahead of the horse though. Chicago is the kid on the block to beat, but nobody is playing better hockey as of this very second than the Montreal Canadiens. Furthermore, look at what the Penguins did to the Sharks tonight. It's a long season and that's nothing all of you don't know already. I'm picking a Montreal - St. Louis Cup Final.

 

I'd really appreciate some approvals, even if you disagree with my assessment. I'd love to join the discussions on a more consistent basis. Thanks, guys.

[hf101]

@PenaltyMinuteChampion

 

Welcome.  Nice post.  

 

To be honest I haven't watched the Canadiens play against Western Conference teams this year. While I'll agree the Canadiens are on a hot streak right now it's tough to say they are built to survive the playoffs in the East.  

[flyercanuck]

@PenaltyMinuteChampion

 

 Welcome to the board. The Habs forwards will again get eaten alive come the grind of the playoffs.

 

 

 @TropicalFruitGirl26

 

 Very nice post. I still think the west is best but it is a lot closer than some might think.

[DaGreatGazoo]

I didn't watch the whole game, but the Pens flat out spanked the Sharks last night.  Granted it's one game, I get that.  And I'm not sure if SJ has players missing/hurt, but I know Pitt has several guys out with injuries.  Makes for some interesting comparisions, however.

 

I kinda wonder if the West will kick the living crap outta each other coming playoff time, and someone from the East gets an easier draw-in a weaker conference-and gives the Western Champ hell in the Finals?

[Chicago Hawkie]

@Rink Rat

 

That's very possible!  I have a boss ... actually more of my bosses' boss, who is a Canucks fan and this is exactly what he noticed, that the West is a very tough conference this year.  We were talking about it today, in fact ...

[PenaltyMinuteChampion]

For what it's worth, the trend continued for San Jose on Friday. Granted, Carolina is playing good hockey right now, but for a team with the 2nd most points in the league, they should've at least won 1 of the 2 (Pittsburgh or Carolina). What's even more surprising is the Blackhawks. They've lost 3 straight now while Edmonton scored 8 goals. Did I mention the Florida Panthers won on Thursday too? The NHL is being turned upside down!

[flyercanuck]

For what it's worth, the trend continued for San Jose on Friday. Granted, Carolina is playing good hockey right now, but for a team with the 2nd most points in the league, they should've at least won 1 of the 2 (Pittsburgh or Carolina). What's even more surprising is the Blackhawks. They've lost 3 straight now while Edmonton scored 8 goals. Did I mention the Florida Panthers won on Thursday too? The NHL is being turned upside down!

 

Pretty sure that happened when Philly acquired Mason.

[B21]

I didn't watch the whole game, but the Pens flat out spanked the Sharks last night.  Granted it's one game, I get that.  And I'm not sure if SJ has players missing/hurt, but I know Pitt has several guys out with injuries.  Makes for some interesting comparisions, however.

 

I kinda wonder if the West will kick the living crap outta each other coming playoff time, and someone from the East gets an easier draw-in a weaker conference-and gives the Western Champ hell in the Finals?

 

They were missing Malkin, Scuderi, Martin and Bennett. Among those suited up were Kobasew, Megna, Conner and Ebbett.

[nossagog]

They were missing Malkin, Scuderi, Martin and Bennett. Among those suited up were Kobasew, Megna, Conner and Ebbett.

And they lost Dupuis early in the second which messed up their lines.

[Polaris922]

Until this past year or so I've felt the East was the better conference. The games were tougher and you paid for your shots and anything else you wanted to do.

Recently though the west is the dominant conference. Seems the normal EC powerhouses are struggling.

[hf101]

The trend seems to be changing.  January, (thanks to the Flyers  )  had the East winning more of conference play.  This whole thing could be even come April.

source

 

 

 

 

[Polaris922]

The trend seems to be changing. January, (thanks to the Flyers ) had the East winning more of conference play. This whole thing could be even come April.

source

Pens took 5 of 6 points out West just this week.

[brelic]

Pens took 5 of 6 points out West just this week.

 

Oh yeah? Well we took 6 of 6.

 

Neener neener neener.

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

Just goes to show, that this whole "Eastern teams can't touch Western teams" thing is so overblown.

 

Not taking anything away from the Western Conference, as they for SURE feature some very good, legitimate Stanley Cup contenders, but to discount the Eastern teams as I've seen some do is just plain near sighted.

 

We all know the trends. There was a time when ppl joked about the 'no touch, run n gun West that couldn't stand up to the grinding East powers'.

Just all goes in cycles.

 

If we were to match up team for team in both Conferences, I am sure at this point in time we could find more SC contenders out West than East...yet even given that, there is no reason to think the Stanley Cup winner couldn't come out of the East just as likely.

Overall Eastern teams have squads that feature many still-developing, yet very talented, young players. So who knows...perhaps in about 4 or 5 years, ppl will once again talk about the East as the dominant Conference..and perhaps we will even hear a reference to the 'Beast or Beasts of the East' as was often heard back when the West wasn't viewed as so dominant.

 

Right now, the Boston Bruins best fit that description, and as much as I don't care for the Bruins, one has to consider them the team to beat in the Conference, with arguably Pittsburgh close behind...some might say the Pens would be the tougher team.

But that doesn't mean a team like Washington, Philly, the Rangers, Lightning, Canadiens or even the Maple Leafs can't cause  havoc for any team in the Conference, and even vs. Western teams.

 

And it's been mentioned here and on other sites:  If the West truly is as bruising as everyone says, then there is merit to the idea that they will beat the &^%$# hell out of each other and come the Finals, they just might be ripe for the pickings by an Eastern team that "had it easy" en route.....

[Polaris922]

Oh yeah? Well we took 6 of 6.

Neener neener neener.

Actually.. You took 10 of 12 since just before Christmas. So we tie in winning percentage. Lol

[brelic]

Actually.. You took 10 of 12 since just before Christmas. So we tie in winning percentage. Lol

 

Damn you and your math skills! 

 

[Polaris922]

Damn you and your math skills!

I'm known to over analyze things. Lol