BluPuk Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I find it curious that with all the talk about defensemen and centres that no one has mentioned our lack of a genuine first-line, reliable NHL calibre goaltender. IMHO, neither Reimer nor Bernier fill the bill. Both are OK as a back-up. It will be interesting to see if management does anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 @BluPuk It might be interesting to see what Berniers like with a team that actually comes back in front of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I just posted a topic in the Flyers forum summarizing the leagues goalie needs. I didn't have Toronto on that list. But I guess if you trade off Reimer somewhere you could go after one of the Free Agents. But realistically I think your tandem just needs a better defensive effort in front of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J0e Th0rnton Posted July 1, 2015 Share Posted July 1, 2015 I find it curious that with all the talk about defensemen and centres that no one has mentioned our lack of a genuine first-line, reliable NHL calibre goaltender. IMHO, neither Reimer nor Bernier fill the bill. Both are OK as a back-up. It will be interesting to see if management does anything.Honestly, if you are rebuilding, having a pair of 26-27 year old goalies who at one point had a good starter season is not the worst thing in the world. Play them both and hope their value increases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 I find it curious that with all the talk about defensemen and centres that no one has mentioned our lack of a genuine first-line, reliable NHL calibre goaltender. IMHO, neither Reimer nor Bernier fill the bill. Both are OK as a back-up. It will be interesting to see if management does anything. Bernier is the #1 guy for now. Reimer is sort of at the end of his rope in Toronto. Chances are, the team releases or trades Reimer this off-season, promotes up their top goalie prospect from the minors, and has Bernier as the #1 guy this season. The Leafs aren't looking to win anything right now. This will be a year for prospects to show what they've got. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Bernier is the real thing, you guys should hang on to him. And maybe help him out a bit, keep the shot counts to this side of 50. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 Bernier is the real thing, you guys should hang on to him. And maybe help him out a bit, keep the shot counts to this side of 50. Not this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TropicalFruitGirl26 Posted July 2, 2015 Share Posted July 2, 2015 @BluPuk I agree with @flyercanuck , I'd like to see what Bernier can do with an actual responsible defense in front of him. He did well in LA in limited time and the Kings having a stout defense I am sure was very helpful. That said, if the Leafs are anticipating going through two or three seasons "taking their lumps" while the GM molds the team (including defense), it likely means the defense WON'T be particularly good in the immediate future, and thus, some of Bernier's prime years may be wasted backstopping a porous defense. Maybe it WOULD be a good idea to see what kind of return Toronto can get for him, and simply use 'stop gap' type goalies while the defense is shaped, matures, and is ready to compete with the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 @TropicalFruitGirl26That said, if the Leafs are anticipating going through two or three seasons "taking their lumps" while the GM molds the team (including defense), it likely means the defense WON'T be particularly good in the immediate future, and thus, some of Bernier's prime years may be wasted backstopping a porous defense.Yeah but isn't that always the way in Toronto? Being a Toronto goalie comes with hazard pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
92WickedHockey Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I don't think goaltending is a very big priority right now for Leafs management, we're in a rebuild and not expected to compete. I'm sure they would prefer a few consecutive bottom 5 finishes to add to the Rielly's, Nylander's, Marner's etc. Bernier and Reimer are both capable NHL goalies, first priority is to build up a respectable stable of prospects/picks and then worry about future goaltending, Leafs can even draft a top ranked goalie in the coming years with one of our 1st rounders if management chooses. Leafs have two 1st rounders in 2016, if that Penguins pick is in the 15-20 range why not take a goalie? its just further proof of the incredible value of draft picks, the more you have the more chances of building a great team you have. I was originally hoping the Leafs would have traded either Bernier or Reimer to the Sharks before they got Martin Jones. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J0e Th0rnton Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 @TropicalFruitGirl26That said, if the Leafs are anticipating going through two or three seasons "taking their lumps" while the GM molds the team (including defense), it likely means the defense WON'T be particularly good in the immediate future, and thus, some of Bernier's prime years may be wasted backstopping a porous defense.Yeah but isn't that always the way in Toronto? Being a Toronto goalie comes with hazard pay. Kinda true.The goalie in Toronto needs to be a cocky SOB who can handle the pressure. Belfour was booed like mad for the first bit of his tenure there. But he was too good a goalie and stole many games, so he became a hero! Toskala on the other hand.....I felt sooooo bad for him. The Sharks can generally make any goalie look good. Even Niemi. but Toskala was murdered in Toronto. I remember a time Toskala looked invincible. Then the triple OT loss to the Oilers in the playoffs and he never achieved that level again. He was a good goalie when we sent him over with Bell for the Couture pick parts though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPuk Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 I don't think the Leafs will be "taking any lumps" this season. I think any team that beats us this season will have earned it - at least that's my hope. I believe we will be entertaining to watch and we will fight for every point. Not sayin' we'll make the play-offs. The Leafs' problem over the last ten years has been a lack of effort, not a lack of talent. It is my hope that our new management will make a huge difference to this team and bring back the pride and work ethic this team once had. I realise that may be my opinion only. As far as goalies go, you need to have a goalie that can win you games - steal one or two. IMHO, neither Bernier nor Reimer can do that. Seems to me that they both have blue-and-white disease. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J0e Th0rnton Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 I don't think the Leafs will be "taking any lumps" this season. I think any team that beats us this season will have earned it - at least that's my hope. I believe we will be entertaining to watch and we will fight for every point. Not sayin' we'll make the play-offs. The Leafs' problem over the last ten years has been a lack of effort, not a lack of talent. It is my hope that our new management will make a huge difference to this team and bring back the pride and work ethic this team once had. I realise that may be my opinion only. As far as goalies go, you need to have a goalie that can win you games - steal one or two. IMHO, neither Bernier nor Reimer can do that. Seems to me that they both have blue-and-white disease. I dunno dude. I have seen both those goalies steal some games for you or give you a chance when the team did not deserve it in the past 3 years Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TropicalFruitGirl26 Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 @BluPuk Well, anything and everything is possible on any given year, but even by your own post, I'd say the Leafs will certainly be "taking their lumps". While I agree there is a difference between being competitive and simply skating on the ice and being a collection of bodies on game day, unless the Leafs make a massive turnaround, they are GONNA lose a lot of games this coming season....thus taking their lumps. I think everyone can also agree the Leafs never really lacked talent...they still don't....but the way that talent worked together (or didn't work together) is why the team needs a rebuild.The Atlantic division alone will be tough for Toronto for them to even think of getting anywhere without some real deal changes. Lightning, Canadiens, Red Wings, and Senators...all of last season's playoff teams from the division...will look to remain competitive and challenge for playoff spots, while the Panthers, if they can find some more scoring will always be a problem for teams due to THEIR competitive attitudes and drive. Sabres should be improved and the Bruins, while not the same championship team still have some good pieces along with some savvy vets on the team....not to mention good goaltending in Tuuka Rask. And that's not even counting teams such as the Islanders, Rangers, Capitals and maybe the Pens too as competition from the Metro division for possible WC spots.So yea, the Leafs will have all they can handle just to be in any kind of playoff mix, and may find themselves still losing many games (taking their lumps), while they figure out what they really have, who still needs to get moved out, and who they can get to make them a more complete team. Whether Bernier is still the future number one of the team will largely depend on how quickly the rest of the team can shape up.Reimer, I believe, has had his chance and probably isn't in the long term plans of the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 I agree that work ethic and compete level will be higher this season (at least until around January when they're eliminated from playoff contention). But this will be a Leafs team devoid of any immediate talent. We're going to be watching an AHL/OHL team this coming fall in Toronto and it's going to be ugly. I've gone on record predicting a 30th place finish. 2015-16 is going to be the darkness before the dawn in Toronto. On the plus side, at least their won't be any expectations or pressure from fans or media. There is also a lot more roster turnover to come this summer... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BluPuk Posted July 7, 2015 Author Share Posted July 7, 2015 Losing games does not necessarily mean "taking your lumps". It's all about the effort IMHO. After watching the 'sad sack' Leafs for the last 10 years, I think this team might actually contest the outcome of most games - not sayin' they won't lose lots of games, I'm sure you're right there, but I believe they will play hard for 60 minutes. That's a big deal to me. I think this Leafs team will be better than last years' Leafs team, but they will lose lots of games, yes. Yah, each of our current goaltenders have stolen games from time to time, but neither have sustained good play for any length of time. The challenge is not in attaining, it's in maintaining (stolen from somebody ). Anyway, there's LOTS of time yet before training camp opens, and we are talking about a roster that is not even complete yet.... Hockey is fun, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 Hockey is fun, eh? Right now I practically need to pop anti-depressants to watch the Leafs. Between the Leafs and the Jays, I might have to take up a new sport just to cheer for a winner. Go Toronto FC! Oh wait lol..... I'd like to see the Leafs be creative. Maybe they could become the "Bay street bullies" and just goon it up. Try to break NHL records for most penalty minutes, most suspensions, etc. Win games by crippling the star players on opposing teams. That would be immensely satisfying in an odd sort of way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted July 11, 2015 Share Posted July 11, 2015 @WordsOfWisdom I honestly don't mind watching my team do what Toronto (and Philly in a lesser way) are doing. I'd much rather watch a struggling young team with lots of great prospects develop and grow than watch a bunch of high-priced bums decide whether they're going to show up that night. At least this way there's hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted July 16, 2015 Share Posted July 16, 2015 We will trade you Phil Kessel for a dozen of chocolate chip cookies? You have a Canadian football team,are they doing any good? In all honesty I'm hoping for a good team in Toronto! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 We will trade you Phil Kessel for a dozen of chocolate chip cookies? You have a Canadian football team,are they doing any good? In all honesty I'm hoping for a good team in Toronto! As a rule of thumb, nothing in Toronto is doing good... ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 @WordsOfWisdom Argos won the Grey Cup two years ago. Toronto Rock has won 6 championships since 99. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted July 17, 2015 Share Posted July 17, 2015 @WordsOfWisdom Argos won the Grey Cup two years ago. Toronto Rock has won 6 championships since 99. The Argos are a minor league football team, because the best players are in the NFL. If we start counting the Argos, then we have to start counting OHL, AHL, WHL teams, college football, NCAA, and so on... But I appreciate that you tried to cheer me up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScottM Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 I think the Leafs should either bring Johnny Bower out of retirement or dig up Turk Broda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 The Argos are a minor league football team, because the best players are in the NFL. If we start counting the Argos, then we have to start counting OHL, AHL, WHL teams, college football, NCAA, and so on... But I appreciate that you tried to cheer me up. The C.F.L. has more class than N.F.L. Hey the N.F.L. has rapist still playing quarterback! The Maple Leafs could take Fleury if they want! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 @notfondajane Pretty sure they have rapists at every position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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