Town Hall

[vis]

Apologies if this was already posted, but apparently the Flyers held a town hall meeting with season ticket holders (as they have done in the past from time to time). Below is a link to one person's summary of the events.  Hakstol's comments are interesting, to say the least.  

 

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2017/2/7/14543784/notes-from-flyers-town-hall-meeting

[AlaskaFlyerFan]

@vis,

 

thanks for posting.  We have a few posters who usually attend the town hall meetings and post a quite in-depth summary. Hopefully they will do that again.

[murraycraven]

Haks responses were indeed interesting....   And delusional.

[DaGreatGazoo]

Here's another article that provides even more quotes.

 

http://sonsofpenn.com/dave-hakstol-attempts-to-clear-the-air-on-shayne-gostisbehere-andrew-macdonald-and-fan-disconnect/

[brelic]

Lol the "journalist" is a self proclaimed Gostisbehere "fanboy". 

 

Not very objective. 

[DaGreatGazoo]

At the risk of insulting someone--he's a blogger, running a website/blog. Not sure that qualifies as a journalist-at least in the traditional definition. 

 

I dont care care about his editorial comments. I do care about Hakstol's comments. I also read somewhere--looking for it--that Hak said 47 brings a better skill set then Ghost. 

 

Someone help me me on this, but doesn't 47 have one of/if not the lowest Corsi ratings of any NHL defensemen?  Hak ignores that and apparently made a negative comment about Corsi numbers last night to the fans. 

When numbers show poor play, when a player fails EVERY eye test, when most/all analysts agree that 47 is not a top minute player and continues to hurts the Flyers-I tend to agree with them.

His continued defense of him is worrying. He either is that poor of a talent evaluator or too stubborn/arrogant to admit 47 has serious flaws. 

[fanaticV3.0]

1. I am completely baffled by the anger coming from the fans about TK and Ghost getting scratched.  They are more bothered by the fact that they are getting scratched than they are that the players themselves are struggling. You play poorly, sometimes you sit. It's not a difficult concept to grasp or outrageous approach to take. It's not a big deal whatsoever.

 

2. I fundamentally disagree their (seemingly extreme) approach. Proclaiming you will not be busy in the off-season is  foolish and shortsighted. Proclaiming that there will be several young defensemen on the team next year is foolish and shortsighted. It's not draft or free agents/trades, it's a mix. Closing the door on any potential opportunities because you think that you have to draft every player on the team is ridiculous.

 

3. MacDonald stinks, we all know that. Hak's comments don't bother me too much, because he's not going to outright trash a guy in public. I am not defending him playing Mac, just saying he isn't gonna be as frank as the fans want him to be (events like this are a waste of time in that sense).

[Poulin20]

3 hours ago, AlaskaFlyerFan said:

@vis,

 

thanks for posting.  We have a few posters who usually attend the town hall meetings and post a quite in-depth summary. Hopefully they will do that again.

Unfortunately I was not able to make it this year and neither was my brother .  I know we have a few other STHs on the board, maybe they can post something.

[King Knut]

4 hours ago, vis said:

Apologies if this was already posted, but apparently the Flyers held a town hall meeting with season ticket holders (as they have done in the past from time to time). Below is a link to one person's summary of the events.  Hakstol's comments are interesting, to say the least.  

 

http://www.broadstreethockey.com/2017/2/7/14543784/notes-from-flyers-town-hall-meeting

 

I never thought Homer seemed to handle tough questions well and it looks like Hak is even worse at it.  To be fair, while I've never met Hak, he always seems a little bit frustrated and eager to get out of the room no matter where he is.  

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, fanaticV3.0 said:

1. I am completely baffled by the anger coming from the fans about TK and Ghost getting scratched.  They are more bothered by the fact that they are getting scratched than they are that the players themselves are struggling. You play poorly, sometimes you sit. It's not a difficult concept to grasp or outrageous approach to take. It's not a big deal whatsoever.

 

2. I fundamentally disagree their (seemingly extreme) approach. Proclaiming you will not be busy in the off-season is  foolish and shortsighted. Proclaiming that there will be several young defensemen on the team next year is foolish and shortsighted. It's not draft or free agents/trades, it's a mix. Closing the door on any potential opportunities because you think that you have to draft every player on the team is ridiculous.

 

3. MacDonald stinks, we all know that. Hak's comments don't bother me too much, because he's not going to outright trash a guy in public. I am not defending him playing Mac, just saying he isn't gonna be as frank as the fans want him to be (events like this are a waste of time in that sense).

 

I admit I was upset at first because it just didn't make sense.  Other players are struggling more and playing more poorly then either one of them.  

 

TK and Ghost are two of the most effective play drivers on the team.  My thoughts on Hak's use of Ghost and his development have been enumerated elsewhere so I won't go into it here.  Suffice to say, I think Hak's missing the point of Ghost and I think it's in danger of ruining the player.  

 

Homer always lies about his plans.  Probably because Clarke always lied.  Homer would probably have said they weren't going to be very busy in the off season no matter what his actual plans are.  That said, I don't see much of a need to be very busy.  I'd love to see two players acquired before the start of next season, but I don't really believe either will happen.  I'll settle for one to help the maturing youth movement on D.  Not a big name even or a big contract.  Just someone who's been there and can play in his own end well.  Anyway point is, I don't think Homer saying they have no big plans means they won't do anything.  He lies all the time and frankly, i wouldn't put it beyond Hexy to have a few pots on the stove that Homer doesn't necessarily know all about just yet (especially since most pots on the stove amount to zilch). 

 

I know why Mac is playing.  

I'm not the Mac hater everyone else here is.  I can divorce his play from his salary and I can acknowledge that he's really not that bad.  He's more responsible in his own end than Ghost or MDZ.   he's probably not a 3/4 D man in the NHL, but he certainly is on the Flyers. 

 

The problem I have is that wasn't the question Hak was asked.  He was asked essentially why is he a #2 D man on the Flyers?

 

The answer is I think more complicated, but I think there is a legit answer to that question that Hak could have provided.  essentially it's about pairings and skill sets.  All year the team's pairings have been woefully unbalanced with too much offensive mindedness and not enough defensive skill.  Mac is there with Provo because putting Streit or MDZ with provo doesn't make sense and because putting Gudas with Provo would make the other pairings to weak defensively.  

Mac's getting the minutes he's getting because it's the least of all the possible evils.  

 

If I'm in that room I ask him why Schultz hasn't been playing more before now, not why Mac has.  

 

 

 

 

 

[flyerrod]

1 hour ago, fanaticV3.0 said:

 

3. MacDonald stinks, we all know that. Hak's comments don't bother me too much, because he's not going to outright trash a guy in public. I am not defending him playing Mac, just saying he isn't gonna be as frank as the fans want him to be (events like this are a waste of time in that sense)

MacDud is the **** sandwich that Homer forced onto Hakstol. Anyone who has ever watched a game of Hockey and seen the baffling boneheaded plays made by MacDud night in and out knows the only reason he is on the ice is Hakstol has no choice. That said, Hakstol outright lying about MacDud's performance speaks of him walking the company line more so than doing his job. I have a bigger issue with that than his benching of TK or Ghost.

[vis]

5 hours ago, King Knut said:

I know why Mac is playing.  

I'm not the Mac hater everyone else here is.  I can divorce his play from his salary and I can acknowledge that he's really not that bad.  He's more responsible in his own end than Ghost or MDZ.   he's probably not a 3/4 D man in the NHL, but he certainly is on the Flyers. 

 

I agree with this.  McDonald, for his shortcomings, is still more reliable than Ghost or MDZ in his own zone.  And agree that, on this team, he is a 3/4 d-man.  I think McDonald garners more disdain among the fanbase than he deserves.  At least more than others deserve for similar failings. 

[flyerrod]

25 minutes ago, vis said:

 

I agree with this.  McDonald, for his shortcomings, is still more reliable than Ghost or MDZ in his own zone.  And agree that, on this team, he is a 3/4 d-man.  I think McDonald garners more disdain among the fanbase than he deserves.  At least more than others deserve for similar failings. 

It is not MacDud's fault that he is overpaid. That I much I will give him. He is even capable of making decent plays occasionally too. Operative word there is OCCASIONALLY. I have lost count of how many times I have seen him handcuff a forward going out of the zone with a stupid/careless/lazy/dumb pass or dump the puck slowly back around to his partner setting him up to be crunched by anyone who has watched MacDud play more than one game and causing yet more turnovers. It is like watching BEHOLD RANDY!! all over again. I think most people here see him for what he is, an overpaid 6th d-man on one of his good days.

[ratskull]

Hakstol is probably frustrated because he HAS to play MacDonald. No matter how infinitely small the chance is that they will be able to trade him or that the Knights grab him, they have to try to move him. So, the directive from above is to play the hell out of him with the hopes that someone will be crazy enough to take him. If true, that would be a tough pill to swallow as a coach and adding insult to injury is having to defend the move when questioned by the public.

He probably love to have said. "You think I don't know that he plays terrible? We are trying to move him as soon as possible. I want him gone more than you do!" This is all speculation, but I find it hard to believe that he truly sees MacDonald as a 3rd or 4th defenceman. They are all doing what they can to make this team better in the long run and moving MacDonald would be like winning the lottery. In the meantime, they are probably improving their draft position.

 

[vis]

3 hours ago, flyerrod said:

BEHOLD RANDY!!

Lol.  One of my favorite philly.com memes.

 

I feel like all of the d-men, with the exception of Provorov and Gudas, routinely make boneheaded plays.  But it seems like McDonald's tend to get magnified.  

 

I am most bothered by how passive he is.  How swiftly he backs into his own zone.  How reluctant he is to challenge an opposing player.  Guy doesn't hit, either.

 

Why am I defending him again?

[flyerrod]

Just now, vis said:

Lol.  One of my favorite philly.com memes.

 

I feel like all of the d-men, with the exception and Gudas, routinely make boneheaded plays.  But it seems like McDonald's tend to get magnified.  

 

I am most bothered by how passive he is.  How swiftly he backs into his own zone.  How reluctant he is to challenge an opposing player.  Guy doesn't hit, either.

 

Why am I defending him again?

Yes but not anywhere close to MacDud's gaffes. Why not pair Ghost with Provorov even if that reduces Ivan's minutes? It gives Ghost a fast, responsible d-man. 2nd pairing Gudas/Manning and then Streit/ MacDud as the 3rd pairing. Less Ice time for an aging Streit  whose teeth are almost long enough to trip over now and less for MacDud just because of he is MacDud. Aside from the age of Provy and Ghost, those pairings make more sense than the ones we are currently seeing.

[vis]

18 minutes ago, flyerrod said:

Yes but not anywhere close to MacDud's gaffes. Why not pair Ghost with Provorov even if that reduces Ivan's minutes? It gives Ghost a fast, responsible d-man. 2nd pairing Gudas/Manning and then Streit/ MacDud as the 3rd pairing. Less Ice time for an aging Streit  whose teeth are almost long enough to trip over now and less for MacDud just because of he is MacDud. Aside from the age of Provy and Ghost, those pairings make more sense than the ones we are currently seeing.

Provorov plays harder minutes that I am not sure you want Ghost playing.  Provorov normally matches up against the opposition's top line and also gets a lot of defensive zone starts.  Ghost is totally sheltered.  So, I'm not sure you'd be doing either player a service by pairing them up.

 

Gudas/Manning is redundant.  Think you need a puckmover with both.

 

McDonald/Streit is just...weird.

[flyerrod]

1 hour ago, vis said:

Gudas/Manning is redundant.  Think you need a puckmover with both.

Manning has been much more of a puck mover this season. His play from last year has improved at least five fold and I am ok with weird if it reduces the minutes that both Streit and MacD  play.

 

1 hour ago, vis said:

 Provorov normally matches up against the opposition's top line and also gets a lot of defensive zone starts

I would still be willing to give them a few games together to see if they have any chemistry. What would it hurt. With the speed they both possess it would certainly be interesting.

[murraycraven]

22 hours ago, King Knut said:

 

I never thought Homer seemed to handle tough questions well and it looks like Hak is even worse at it.  To be fair, while I've never met Hak, he always seems a little bit frustrated and eager to get out of the room no matter where he is.  

 

 

In all fairness I would be the same way considering the roster...   

[OccamsRazor]

In fairness i wouldn't put a lot of weight in Hak's comments in regards to Mcdud. Plain and simple he isn't going to put him on blast in the media.

 

He basically had to play hi to get to his 40 games which he has met and why he is still playing i guess is part of a plan going forward.

 

As far as Ghost being a healthy scratch i think it is two fold. For him to sit and watch and two for them to be able to showcase others. Like Streit and Schultz. MDZ would be inserted to i think if he was healthy and may be available soon.

 

I hope all 3 mentioned above are moved by the deadline. Fingers crossed.....

[vis]

10 hours ago, flyerrod said:

Manning has been much more of a puck mover this season. His play from last year has improved at least five fold and I am ok with weird if it reduces the minutes that both Streit and MacD  play.

 

I would still be willing to give them a few games together to see if they have any chemistry. What would it hurt. With the speed they both possess it would certainly be interesting.

Manning has been better.  Still makes bad plays, but he has improved.  Wouldn't be getting second pairing minutes, and may not crack the roster, on other teams.

 

If you're trying to build Ghost's confidence and development, not sure giving him tougher defensive assignments is the way to go.

[murraycraven]

I know this is going to be unpopular but I believe a vaild argument could be made that McDud is not as bad as we all envision.  He is a by no means a top pairing guy and I think a decent 4/5 type on a good defensive unit.   The problem is he is eating up minutes as our top pairing which makes everything that much worse... he should not be seeing the minutes he is getting and suppose those minutes will decrease when we have an actual functioning NHL-type d out there...    

[OccamsRazor]

3 minutes ago, murraycraven said:

I know this is going to be unpopular but I believe a vaild argument could be made that McDud is not as bad as we all envision.

 

 

Really he's not...just close your eyes when he is on the ice....see he isn't that bad after all..

[OccamsRazor]

@murraycraven

 

See this is Ivan's fault...

 

[brelic]

2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

In fairness i wouldn't put a lot of weight in Hak's comments in regards to Mcdud. Plain and simple he isn't going to put him on blast in the media.

 

He basically had to play hi to get to his 40 games which he has met and why he is still playing i guess is part of a plan going forward.

 

As far as Ghost being a healthy scratch i think it is two fold. For him to sit and watch and two for them to be able to showcase others. Like Streit and Schultz. MDZ would be inserted to i think if he was healthy and may be available soon.

 

I hope all 3 mentioned above are moved by the deadline. Fingers crossed.....

 

Exactly. Plus, you can't just sit him after game 41 if you have any hope of Vegas picking him up. After all, you don't want to highlight that a nice, shiny player is a turd after you've spent so long polishing it.