OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Well the Wayne train is on the move...Ryan Hartman and a conditional pick 4th in 2020 becomes a 3rd if Preds win a playoff round. Simmonds turned down a trade to the Flames...and he didn't help the Flyers playing like doo doo most of the year.... Isn't afraid of the physical stuff. Feel free to add complaints and whines... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 Hartman is much better 5 on 5 than Wayne Simmonds for sure. Flyers have Patrick and JVR to take Simmer's spot on the PP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jam1986 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 So he stuck the Flyers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Another underwhelming deal made by Fletcher. To go along with not trading Elliot, or Raffl, or Gudas. How the F does this guy get another job as a gm? Again, not a huge deal. But selling a dollar for 94 cents just doesn't make...sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trevluk Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 I f#$@ing hate this trade. Flyers got fleeced again. Our organization sucks gentleman. F#$k this team. I grew up in Philly but have lived in NorCal for 15 years and I have just officially switched my loyalty to the Sharks. The Flyers will never win a cup in my lifetime and I am done banging my head against the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barouk Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 every commentator and writer thought simmonds was worth at least a 1 or good young player and a 2. THIS SUUCKS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 42 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: Another underwhelming deal made by Fletcher. To go along with not trading Elliot, or Raffl, or Gudas. How the F does this guy get another job as a gm? Again, not a huge deal. But selling a dollar for 94 cents just doesn't make...sense. How is this so bad?? Did you watch Simmonds play?? Did you want to give him a five year 8 mill per deal?? Ok then that is why they traded him he looked like shat all year hasn't had a goal in 11 games what did you think any GM who could see was going to give them for him??? Can't stay out the box and you don't even see him unless it's headed to the box after some scrum or he is trailing the play coasting pretending he is back checking. He score 27 points all year. Dude is a power forward who skills have eroded and can't stay out the box. Man Flyers fans really do over value their players. Who knows what Chuck could have got from the Flames Wayne shot it down. So yeah this is about as good as you are going to get. A 24 year old winger with some solid skills playing 5 on 5 and can play up on the 2nd if need be. Wayne just didn't have any value and he has lost his touch on the PP. This isn't 2016-17 Wayne Simmonds he is on the down swing. And who knows they could always turn around and move Hartman again for something. I wish him well but his best years are behind him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 50 minutes ago, trevluk said: I f#$@ing hate this trade. Flyers got fleeced again. Our organization sucks gentleman. F#$k this team. I grew up in Philly but have lived in NorCal for 15 years and I have just officially switched my loyalty to the Sharks. The Flyers will never win a cup in my lifetime and I am done banging my head against the wall. I guess you too didn't watch him play this year. See my last comment to flyercanuck i am tired of repeating it. Good lawd the Flyers fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 @OccamsRazor you said it best. Simmonds was a declining asset. People need to understand that. The Flyers weren't getting Fabro, Tolvanen, or any of those high end prospects. They weren't going to get a first or a second for Simmonds, even if the 'experts' think Simmonds should have returned that. What the Flyers got was essentially the perfect checking line player in Ryan Hartman. Speedy, tenacious, plays with a chip on his shoulder and is good for 12 - 15 goals/30 points per year. Think of a more physical Michael Raffl and that's Hartman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: How is this so bad?? Did you watch Simmonds play?? Did you want to give him a five year 8 mill per deal?? Ok then that is why they traded him he looked like shat all year hasn't had a goal in 11 games what did you think any GM who could see was going to give them for him??? Can't stay out the box and you don't even see him unless it's headed to the box after some scrum or he is trailing the play coasting pretending he is back checking. He score 27 points all year. Dude is a power forward who skills have eroded and can't stay out the box. Man Flyers fans really do over value their players. Who knows what Chuck could have got from the Flames Wayne shot it down. So yeah this is about as good as you are going to get. A 24 year old winger with some solid skills playing 5 on 5 and can play up on the 2nd if need be. Wayne just didn't have any value and he has lost his touch on the PP. This isn't 2016-17 Wayne Simmonds he is on the down swing. And who knows they could always turn around and move Hartman again for something. I wish him well but his best years are behind him. Do you think Fletcher got "good value" for Simmonds? That's all I'm asking. I'm not on a tirade over it. I already said it's not a big deal. He just never seems to 'win" a trade. It's either lateral, or he gets taken. His drafting is mediocre at best. His salary cap management is terrible. I just don't get why anyone would hire him as a gm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: The Flyers weren't getting Fabro, Tolvanen, or any of those high end prospects. Especially for a guy who will be 31 next year and wants a 5 year/8 mill per deal....so if you have little chance of resigning him he is a true rental. Add that to the fact that he has lost his touch on the PP (2 points the last 15 games when that use to be his bread and butter) you get what they got and move on. The 2016-17 Simmonds would have brought you a nice haul not this guy who has 27 points this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyClarkeFan16 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 3 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: Do you think Fletcher got "good value" for Simmonds? That's all I'm asking. I'm not on a tirade over it. I already said it's not a big deal. He just never seems to 'win" a trade. It's either lateral, or he gets taken. His drafting is mediocre at best. His salary cap management is terrible. I just don't get why anyone would hire him as a gm. Fletcher got the best he could get. We're talking about an eroding asset that should have been dealt last year, but the previous GM didn't have to the stones to do it. Instead, Simmonds was hung onto for too long and this is the result. It's not as if Hartman is chopped liver either. He's a speedy player, tenacious on the forecheck and plays with a chip on his shoulder. He's the ideal checking line player capable of 15 goals/30 points per year. As for Fletcher's drafting being mediocre, he also didn't have the scouting staff that's currently in Philadelphia. That's also going to play a big role going forward. As for his cap management, when you've got ownership saying 'win win win' and 'spend spend spend', you're going to sign some bad deals. How much of that was actually Fletcher? Let's see what Fletcher does this off season. Everyone expected him to blow crap up and move top prospects for over the hill veterans and he hasn't done that. Fletcher has also said that he really likes the young players and pipeline here and he doesn't want to do anything to disrupt that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly29 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 hour ago, trevluk said: I f#$@ing hate this trade. Flyers got fleeced again. Our organization sucks gentleman. F#$k this team. I grew up in Philly but have lived in NorCal for 15 years and I have just officially switched my loyalty to the Sharks. The Flyers will never win a cup in my lifetime and I am done banging my head against the wall. See ya enjoy your Sharks lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 5 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: Do you think Fletcher got "good value" for Simmonds? That's all I'm asking. For what i saw and without know what was offered yes....these GMs do their homework...their scouts watch the same game i have been watching and they have forgot more about hockey than i will ever know. So yes once again when i am honest with myself it is about all you are going to get for a power forward who has lost his mojo on the PP. He doesn't put forth the effort 5 on 5 and it's frustrating and when they don't do it when they are fighting for their fellow teammates who are all trying to get to the playoffs and trying to at least stay with the team he loves when is he going to do it?? Never. It is what it is...he ain't alone Jake and JVR get on my last nerves with their shi itty effort back checking and playing a 200 foot game. But at least Jake and JVR have gotten paid....Wayne hasn't so that ain't smart on his part for at least getting his laurels before resting on them. 11 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: He just never seems to 'win" a trade. It's either lateral, or he gets taken. His drafting is mediocre at best. His salary cap management is terrible. I just don't get why anyone would hire him as a gm. I get that part and i am not even going to try and defend that part of it. I get his history and all and i get everyone feeling that way about it. But for myself i am going to judge him on what he has done with the Flyers so far. And so far he hasn't done anything real crazy to piss me off yet except the shat with keeping Elliott around. Only reason i can see him doing this is so he can decide on who really wants to resign next year. It feels like a battle between Elliott and Talbot. Otherwise it seems he would have traded him. But that is a whole nother conversation. He has got rid of Weal, Weise and Lehtera and has given Hart and Myers a shot so so far i am ok with the moves. All he needs to do left to make me happy... #1 get rid of Mcdud #2 get rid of JVR #3 get rid of Jake And if he does the first two i can live with Jake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: Fletcher got the best he could get. He always gets the best deal HE can get. And he usually gets taken. 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: We're talking about an eroding asset that should have been dealt last year, but the previous GM didn't have to the stones to do it. Instead, Simmonds was hung onto for too long and this is the result. It's not as if Hartman is chopped liver either. He's a speedy player, tenacious on the forecheck and plays with a chip on his shoulder. He's the ideal checking line player capable of 15 goals/30 points per year. The previous GM traded an almost 40 year old player who hadn't even played that year for 2-2nds. 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: As for Fletcher's drafting being mediocre, he also didn't have the scouting staff that's currently in Philadelphia. That's also going to play a big role going forward. As for his cap management, when you've got ownership saying 'win win win' and 'spend spend spend', you're going to sign some bad deals. How much of that was actually Fletcher? So Fletchers excuse for sucking as a gm is because he was a puppet? Well that gives me a ton of confidence with Homer calling the shots. 3 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said: Let's see what Fletcher does this off season. Everyone expected him to blow crap up and move top prospects for over the hill veterans and he hasn't done that. Fletcher has also said that he really likes the young players and pipeline here and he doesn't want to do anything to disrupt that. I guess we'll see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly29 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 I am sorry for those who are disappointed by this trade. I for one like it somewhat and can understand the anger against it. Simmonds hasn't been right for a while now and is getting up there in age for "hockey anyway". What I can't stand about this trade is that we got a 4th in 2020 which is horrible instead of a 2nd this year in addition to a 4th in 2020 along with Hartman. Time will tell obviously if this trade turns out to be a shitter or not and if turns out to be bad than I will guarantee you Fletcher will not be here long. Where I like it is really the player aspect of it, I feel Hartman will be "hopefully" better 5 on 5 and is only 24 yrs old. I have to be honest I feel there was more going on with Simmonds that we do not know and that could be a reason why the trade was not as good as it could of been, anyone else think there is something else going on? Also did Simmer have a NTC/NMC? Finally what I don't understand is why everyone is so mad at Fletch for not trading Elliot? Correct me if I am wrong havn't we been suffering with goalie problems mainly injuries this season? Weren't we on our 37th goalie when Hart finally arrived? I for one would rather have Elliot alongside Talbot and Hart especially Hart being injured right now. I am sure that was a reason why Elliot wasn't traded and I am glade he wasn't. we need all the healthy netminders we can get? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 2 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: I guess we'll see. It's all we can do really. All 20 of Hartman's point come 5 on 5 and in my opinion the Flyers can use some more guys who are solid 5 on 5. Sure they need a lot of help on the PP too but they have JVR and Patrick who have taken over Wayne's office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 minute ago, Philly29 said: What I can't stand about this trade is that we got a 4th in 2020 which is horrible instead of a 2nd this year in addition to a 4th in 2020 along with Hartman. You're not going to get that for a guy who you want have a shot to resign. Do you think the Preds are going to give a 31 year old power forward who has 27 points in a season and has lost his mojo on the power play a five year deal for around 8 mill per season??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 So, we were told Hextall was fired because he refused to make moves to make the team better THIS YEAR. All Fletcher has done is jettison some chaff for other chaff, and trade Simmonds in a move that Hextall would have at the very least matched in quality. What was the point again? He fired Hakstol and brought up Hart, two moves which have actually put the Flyers in worse position than they were under Hextall, and probably would have happened in the offseason anyway. But now they're in the 10-14 pick range in a weak draft, instead of 1-5. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 31 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Did you want to give him a five year 8 mill per deal?? Where are these numbers coming from? Anyone who gives him that is an idiot. He's not getting that in Nashville for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly29 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said: Do you think the Preds are going to give a 31 year old power forward who has 27 points in a season and has lost his mojo on the power play a five year deal for around 8 mill per season??? Easy boy calm down.... I am one of the few here so far in agreement with you on the liking of this trade, I was merely pointing out that I think we could of gotten a little bit more. He was seriously asking for 8 mil per? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 hour ago, trevluk said: I f#$@ing hate this trade. Flyers got fleeced again. Our organization sucks gentleman. F#$k this team. I grew up in Philly but have lived in NorCal for 15 years and I have just officially switched my loyalty to the Sharks. The Flyers will never win a cup in my lifetime and I am done banging my head against the wall. Should have at least waited for the effects from the last head banging to subside before posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 minute ago, radoran said: Where are these numbers coming from? Anyone who gives him that is an idiot. He's not getting that in Nashville for sure. It is what EJ Hradek and Brian Lawton were saying were rumored he was looking for was discussed on NHL network today. Hey Stone just got 8 years 9 mill per season and he has never score even 29 goals in a season. This stuff has gotten out of hand. Simmonds will never get that amount from a team not named Arizona Coyotes. Maybe after Wayne sees this offseason he comes back and signs the 3 year deal they offered him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JR Ewing Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Wishing I was wrong, but knew I wouldn't be, when I told people to be ready to be underwhelmed by the return. There was talk of 1st round picks AND a good prospect. That's just not the return for UFA power forwards playing on the back nine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Philly29 Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 All I know is that Simmonds was a helluva Flyer and I / we will all miss him and thank him for his time on this team and being a true heart and soul Flyer. I Pray he has success and who knows maybe a rental player and comes back next year... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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