What is wrong with the Flyers and how do you fix it?

[CoachX]

50 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

So basically nothing new to discuss.

 

nope. wash...rinse...repeat...trust the process

[Cheesesteak]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

So basically nothing new to discuss.

 

[ruxpin]

2 hours ago, tucson83 said:

look at buffalo when they hire their gms with no experience in the nhl, it's a dumpster fire. you got to have a gm that has experience that understands what schemes and identitys work in the nhl, you cant just hire anyone and expect it to work.

 

it's all about a blueprint. 

 

 

True.

 

His blueprint isn't actually his, and it blows.  It did in Minnesota, and I have no reason to expect any different here.

 

Couple nice draft picks, though.  Kaprizov, for example.

[tucson83]

3 hours ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

No, it's about competence in doing the job. You point to Buffalo, but I can point to Bill Zito in Florida or Jim Nill in Dallas.  Or how about Joe Sakic and Steve Yzerman? Or Rob Blake? Or Brian MacLellan? Or Bill Guerin? All of the people I listed had no prior GM experience before becoming GMs. And no, not having experience as a GM doesn't mean one can't be successful.  Buffalo's problem has always been the Pegula family and their insistence that they know lots about hockey operations. 

 

you say gms dont need experience, name one straight from college that has no nhl background that won a championship?

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, tucson83 said:

 

you say gms dont need experience, name one straight from college that has no nhl background that won a championship?

I missed where we were talking about straight from college.  Was it said?  No seriously, I don't remember but am to lazy to go looking on my phone.  I thought the criteria we were talking about was that the hire didn't necessarily have to have GM experience.  Did I miss a post (quite possible)?

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, Cheesesteak said:

 

[FD19372]

5 hours ago, tucson83 said:

look at buffalo when they hire their gms with no experience in the nhl,

Regier had some experience under Al Arbour and Bill Torrey of the Islanders, but as a GM in itself, no.

[tucson83]

11 hours ago, ruxpin said:

I missed where we were talking about straight from college.  Was it said?  No seriously, I don't remember but am to lazy to go looking on my phone.  I thought the criteria we were talking about was that the hire didn't necessarily have to have GM experience.  Did I miss a post (quite possible)?

it's ok i understand, yeah, bobbyclarkefan16 state he wanted a unproven guy from college in Mark Hunter which he had no nhl experience yes that's correct.

Edited June 24, 2021 by tucson83

[flyercanuck]

14 hours ago, ruxpin said:

True.

 

His blueprint isn't actually his, and it blows.  It did in Minnesota, and I have no reason to expect any different here.

 

Couple nice draft picks, though.  Kaprizov, for example.

 

Who's starting to look like he's going back to the richest team in Russia after ONE season. 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

17 minutes ago, tucson83 said:

it's ok i understand, yeah, bobbyclarkefan16 state he wanted a unproven guy from college in Mark Hunter which he had no nhl experience yes that's correct.

Mark Hunter is an owner with the London Knights hockey club of the Ontario Hockey League.  Not only is he owner,  but he was GM and president for 12 years and had 3 years of coaching experience on top of it.  This isn't someone going in with "no experience." This is a man who probably knows more about building clubs than most GMs currently in the NHL. He's also used to turnover every three years and knows how to scout, draft and develop. So yeah, there's tons of experience with Hunter. Schmuck got the job because of connections, certainly not because of record or ability.

[CoachX]

10 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Mark Hunter is an owner with the London Knights hockey club of the Ontario Hockey League.  Not only is he owner,  but he was GM and president for 12 years and had 3 years of coaching experience on top of it.  This isn't someone going in with "no experience." This is a man who probably knows more about building clubs than most GMs currently in the NHL. He's also used to turnover every three years and knows how to scout, draft and develop. So yeah, there's tons of experience with Hunter. Schmuck got the job because of connections, certainly not because of record or ability.

if he's so qualified, why hasn't he been hired as an NHL GM?

 

are all the teams stupid, or just the Flyers?

[ruxpin]

55 minutes ago, tucson83 said:

it's ok i understand, yeah, bobbyclarkefan16 state he wanted a unproven guy from college in Mark Hunter which he had no nhl experience yes that's correct.

 

Gotcha.   For the record, though, Mark Hunter was a player in the NHL and his experience was in juniors (London Knights).   There's quite a bit of proven track record (good, bad, and ugly) for such a resume.

 

But I'm with you on not from college. I wouldn't have someone come straight from college, either.   I'm not sure I even want that as a coach, but at least in the case of coach there is at least some transferrable skills & approaches (limited, though).  As an executive?   I don't think even AD gets you the necessary skills or experience needed to jump into an NHL general manager role.    Maybe an assistant GM.  I'm thinking someone like Dave Poulin who would come from such a direction but has been around hockey his whole life.  I'd hire him as coach or assistant GM as heir apparent, but not direct to GM.

[ruxpin]

5 minutes ago, CoachX said:

if he's so qualified, why hasn't he been hired as an NHL GM?

 

are all the teams stupid, or just the Flyers?

 

We've already established that 30 teams passed on Brayden Point.  Some several times.

They approved the shootout, the cap, Gary Bettman, etc.

 

Yes, they're all stupid.

 

But I'm not sure not hiring Mark Hunter qualifies as an example of that.   I was entertaining that idea back then myself.  But there has to be a reason you don't commonly hear his name even as a candidate.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Hunter worked as an assistant GM for the Toronto Maple Leafs when Lou Lamorielo was the GM.  He quit when Lou joined the Islanders and Kyle Dubas was named GM. They was talk that he was going to join the Islanders in a similar capacity,  but quietly walked away and was interested in GM roles only. 

[CoachX]

51 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

They was talk that he was going to join the Islanders in a similar capacity,  but quietly walked away and was interested in GM roles only. 

and 3 years later, he's still looking

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

12 minutes ago, CoachX said:

and 3 years later, he's still looking

I guess when you aren't blowing or giving up your ass to the old boys club, you're gonna sit for awhile

[CoachX]

Just now, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

I guess when you aren't blowing or giving up your ass to the old boys club, you're gonna sit for awhile

I assume you are referring to the Flyers. I don't see anyone else hiring the guy either

[OccamsRazor]

2 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

 

Who's starting to look like he's going back to the richest team in Russia after ONE season. 

 

That damn Chuck Fletcher why I aughta punch him right in the kisser....it's what he gets for not drafting a Swede transplant from Minnesota!!!!

 

 

 

Edited June 24, 2021 by OccamsRazor
bourbon isn't working

[FD19372]

1 minute ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

That damn Chuck Fletcher why I aughta punch him in right in the kisser....it's what he gets for not drafting a Swede transplant from Minnesota!!!!

 

Especially since he works under one!

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, ruxpin said:

 I wouldn't have someone come straight from college, either. 

 

Only guy I would consider at this moment in Matt Carle's brother David Carle from Denver but I doubt he is even ready to leave a program he is building into a power house at the moment.

 

It would take a huge over pay to get him to leave in fact he is the first guy I could see replacing Bednar once Sakic has had enough underachieving.

[OccamsRazor]

1 hour ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Mark Hunter is an owner with the London Knights hockey club of the Ontario Hockey League.  Not only is he owner,  but he was GM and president for 12 years and had 3 years of coaching experience on top of it.  This isn't someone going in with "no experience." This is a man who probably knows more about building clubs than most GMs currently in the NHL. He's also used to turnover every three years and knows how to scout, draft and develop. So yeah, there's tons of experience with Hunter. Schmuck got the job because of connections, certainly not because of record or ability.

 

At the point of searching I too was interested in seeing what type of team he could transform from the current country club group they have now.

 

He and his brother may too old school for this current group of coddlers.

[FD19372]

Well, Dave Hakstol can't solve it! Ohhh man! He's been hired as head coach of the Seattle Kraken.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

1 minute ago, FD19372 said:

Well, Dave Hakstol can't solve it! Ohhh man! He's been hired as head coach of the Seattle Kraken.

 

Wouldn't want to be a defenseman going there. You get caught leading a rush and carrying the puck and Haktard will bench you. 

[flyercanuck]

5 hours ago, CoachX said:

I assume you are referring to the Flyers. I don't see anyone else hiring the guy either

 

I think if you took a team of present London Knights alumni (players Hunter drafted and developed and currently playing in the NHL) and they played the Flyers, they'd kick their ass. Hunter is a very smart hockey man.

 

I'm not sure you could make a team out of any other junior club.

Edited June 24, 2021 by flyercanuck

[CoachX]

1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

 

I think if you took a team of present London Knights alumni (players Hunter drafted and developed and currently playing in the NHL) and they played the Flyers, they'd kick their ass. Hunter is a very smart hockey man.

 

I'm not sure you could make a team out of any other junior club.

I'll take your word for it. You're way smarter than I, on matters such as these. I don't know the guy from the next. I just think if he was that good, he would have been hired as a GM by someone before now. And, can you imagine the fallout if the Flyers hired some guy with no GM experience, and he subsequently laid an egg?

 

Yeah, that would go over like a fart in church