radoran Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 i was replying to radoran. he equated Ovie's numbers to them missing the playoffs. i made the comparison to coot's numbers putting the flyers in the basement.is this his third or 4th season?No, I said DESPITE ovies goals they missed the playoffs.Saying that a third line center not scoring is the reason for the Flyers problems is beyo d ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 No, I said DESPITE ovies goals they missed the playoffs.Saying that a third line center not scoring is the reason for the Flyers problems is beyo d ludicrous. I said the same thing. Ovie and Coots are 2 different players. Can't compare them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 I said the same thing. Ovie and Coots are 2 different players. Can't compare them.Many people would prefer to have a Lambourgagne but if you want to tow something a pickup will do the job better.You have to have the right tools for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Can we talk about Couturier like adults so topics dont get removed or is this the Couturier fan club? I'm disappointed in you guys. You know what....who cares...I'll let you guys get back to the gushing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom88 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Can we talk about Couturier like adults so topics dont get removed or is this the Couturier fan club? I'm disappointed in you guys. You know what....who cares...I'll let you guys get back to the gushing.A topic was removed? Mods here are pretty chill all things considered. Did it get toxic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hf101 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I still cant believe they dont want their #8 pick forward to produce offensively. You are dead wrong about that. I do think the Flyers want Couturier to contribute more offensively. But I think the summer plans all kinda fell apart when B Schenn didn't click on the top line with Giroux and Jake and Vinny and Umberger failed on the 3rd line with Read. Couturier didn't mesh with Simmonds and Simmonds didn't play so well on the off wing. Since then the puzzle pieces have been rearranged and Couturier has found himself on the third line with Umberger and Read we may see some more scoring but it wasn't according to the summer plans of a second line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Did it get toxic? Couch cushions who knew............. .......the mind plays tricks no???? http://buzzyn.org/tell-dirty-mind/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I do think the Flyers want Couturier to contribute more offensively. But I think the summer plans all kinda fell apart when B Schenn didn't click on the top line with Giroux and Jake and Vinny and Umberger failed on the 3rd line with Read. Couturier didn't mesh with Simmonds and Simmonds didn't play so well on the off wing. Since then the puzzle pieces have been rearranged and Couturier has found himself on the third line with Umberger and Read we may see some more scoring but it wasn't according to the summer plans of a second line.I'm not a big fan of his linemates either. I knew Umberger would be a drop off from Hartnell but I didnt know he would be this bad. Read goes from being a Calder runner up to non existant. It seems like these guys get blasted though while Coots gets a pass because we're told how smart he is and how he is the master at covering the star opposition. It's almost like when you have a group of kids doing something and one kid feels sad because he isnt as good as the others. An adult sometimes steps in and gives him an obscure job to do to make him feel important. "We're going to give you a special assignment little buddy". There's others that could do that job but we'll give it to little Seany Couturier because it gives him a purpose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 And although I said Id take a 2nd round pick for him, that was not what I meant to say....that was bad wording on my part. I just dont believe you can pull off a Couturier for Webber type deal. I was thinking more of a Couturier for 2nd round prospect sort of deal. Pick up a 21 year old Simmonds type or Subban type that isnt working out on another team. I dont want anymore long deals to superstars anymore anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I'm not a big fan of his linemates either. I knew Umberger would be a drop off from Hartnell but I didnt know he would be this bad. Read goes from being a Calder runner up to non existant. It seems like these guys get blasted though while Coots gets a pass because we're told how smart he is and how he is the master at covering the star opposition. It's almost like when you have a group of kids doing something and one kid feels sad because he isnt as good as the others. An adult sometimes steps in and gives him an obscure job to do to make him feel important. "We're going to give you a special assignment little buddy". There's others that could do that job but we'll give it to little Seany Couturier because it gives him a purpose. Umberger is 32. Read is 28. Couturier is 21. Which one do you think can potentially improve on his game over the next 5 or 6 years? Umberger and read were both years away from playing in the NHL when they were Couturiers age. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 And although I said Id take a 2nd round pick for him, that was not what I meant to say....that was bad wording on my part. I just dont believe you can pull off a Couturier for Webber type deal. I was thinking more of a Couturier for 2nd round prospect sort of deal. Pick up a 21 year old Simmonds type or Subban type that isnt working out on another team. I dont want anymore long deals to superstars anymore anyway. A Simmonds or Subban type that isn't working out? Find us some of those....we'll take a dozen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 A Simmonds or Subban type that isn't working out? Find us some of those....we'll take a dozen. Cooter and a 2nd is not going to net you a Weber or Subban type player - no way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 If you remember, just two or three years ago, Subban was in hot water in Montreal. He may have been a piece that could have been moved for them. They decided to sign him and it turned out well. What did we give up for Simmonds? I know Richards went to LA but the feeling I got from that was Schenn was the main piece...Simmonds was a throw in. Richards ends up on the 4th line in LA and Simmonds is one of our top players.These are just examples that we can see because they are turning out well right in front of our eyes. I don't know what's out there because it's not my job to scout these guys out. I have to trust Hextall can find these guys though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Would Coots and a 2nd get you Subban three years ago? A good GM can find these guys before they make a name for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Would Coots and a 2nd get you Subban three years ago? A good GM can find these guys before they make a name for themselves. Everyone knew that Subban was going to be an incredibly good player so I dont think so... The Habs knew he could be a special player and a good GM finds ways of holding onto a franchise defensman. Plus, 3 years ago Cooter was just drafted... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Okay, so let's work with the premise that we are rough on Coots' linemates but give Coots himself a pass. Fair enough. We give him some rope because he's doing what he's asked to do, starts a ridiculous percentage of his shifts in the defensive end and a conversely small percentage in the offensive zone. The argument goes that when you start well over 50% of your shifts in your defensive zone against top-tier talent, and 4-5 minutes/game on the PK, you're not going to see a lot of offense. I subscribe to this. But if Read is his typical winger, then why do we not give him the same benefit of the doubt? Because he's slightly older and wasn't drafted at all (let alone at #8)? Probably because he has scored 20/season in previous seasons and it isn't happening this year. He looks befuddled. So, but here's the question no one (myself until just now) is asking: are Couturier's wingers holding him back (offensively) or are his wingers being held back by their center? Don't kill the messenger. I'm a Coots' supporter, but just throwing that out there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Maybe Montreal knew they would hold onto him no matter what but I think there was a time when they weren't happy with him. I remember his name being thrown out there.I'm not saying the flyers should have offered Coots for Subban three years ago...I'm just suggesting there could be a Subban out there right now that could be had with the offer of a Couturier. I think that's what Hextall should be looking for...not Coots and Schenn and 3 first rounders for a Webber and sign him for 7 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I'm the biggest critic of Couturier but I don't know if he's holding back Umberger. Read might be a little better with another center though. Maybe Read can be a wing for Laughton with Schenn on the other side? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I don't know if he's holding back Umberger Yeah, that's kind of like holding a corpse back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Maybe Montreal knew they would hold onto him no matter what but I think there was a time when they weren't happy with him. I remember his name being thrown out there.I'm not saying the flyers should have offered Coots for Subban three years ago...I'm just suggesting there could be a Subban out there right now that could be had with the offer of a Couturier. I think that's what Hextall should be looking for...not Coots and Schenn and 3 first rounders for a Webber and sign him for 7 years. Maybe it is Couturier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Maybe Read can be a wing for Laughton with Schenn on the other side? I'm liking the Schenn-Laughton-Simmonds line. Not sure I'd change that up just "to get Read going." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I'm liking the Schenn-Laughton-Simmonds line. Not sure I'd change that up just "to get Read going." I don't think i'm moving heaven and earth to get Matt Read going, agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Maybe what is Couturier...the one to hold onto? It's a possibility but I (only my opinion) see Couturier as being skinny, slow, and missing offensive skills. I see Subban (even three years ago) as being tough, fast, and having a cannon for a shot. Subban has more skills that I want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I like that line too. That doesn't leave many options for Read. Umberger should move to the 4th line and bring Bellemare to the third? I know it won't be popular, and you don't want to put the "4th liner" tag on a possible trade piece, but could you move both Couturier and Umberger to the 4th line? I guess if you believe that Couturier needs to be out there against the best, he needs more than 4th line minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Montreal was going to take this guy and a pick for Subban 3 years ago? Maybe when the series was in its prime in the early 1980's but not now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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