mojo1917 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 @B21 your "certainty " about VLC makes me think he's as good as gone.and not just you per say usually anytime i see...this will never happen... guess what. perhaps you need to soft pedal it a little so he stays ...or you know i'd be fine if you keep it. up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegionOfDoom Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 @B21fixed. If your team won a chance to advance to the second round, would you really care about having a player you might not want anymore after he helped you advance to the second round. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If your team won the cup would you really care about two more years of having a player you might not want anymore after he helped you win a cup.Kings waived Richards... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegionOfDoom Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I'd take two cups and a waived contract to go please...Thank you, nice dooing business with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 I'd take two cups and a waived contract to go please...Thank you, nice dooing business with you.And $4m on the cap for several more years.Just shows that teams do sour on Cup heroes.And I just don't see a legit Cup hopeful clamoring for VLC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 And I just don't see a legit Cup hopeful clamoring for VLC. I can't either but since Berube isn't going to play him because he needs the Zac "the game changer" Rinaldo out there can we just trade him for a body we can LTIR like Horton??? I take that........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegionOfDoom Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 @radShoot! I didn't see the Clarkson through my peripheries.Darn! That Horton trade eluded me!We don't always have the luxury of seeing trades out of left field. That is why I brought up Vinny, he can help out a team pushing to win a cup, a team that is bought into the belief of winning it all.We would of been that team.New York, Toronto...it's a slim jim of a chance, but I'd take a bite of that hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If your team won the cup would you really care about two more years of having a player you might not want anymore after he helped you win a cup. If your team is a "VLC" away from winning a Cup then you aren't winning a Cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 If your team is a "VLC" away from winning a Cup then you aren't winning a Cup. Simple. Easy to remember. I like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 @B21 your "certainty " about VLC makes me think he's as good as gone.and not just you per say usually anytime i see...this will never happen... guess what. perhaps you need to soft pedal it a little so he stays ...or you know i'd be fine if you keep it. up. You have me confused with Eddie Mush....but hey, put it all on Kryptonite VLC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegionOfDoom Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 @B21Only injuries can truly answer that predicament...only injuries.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 27, 2015 Share Posted February 27, 2015 . That is why I brought up Vinny, he can help out a team pushing to win a cup, a team that is bought into the belief of winning it all.That is, again, possible. Just not likely. To get rid of Clarkson, they agreed to pick up Horton. The Flyers are dealing with almost $5M dead space on the off season cap. $11m starts to be a real problem.So if you can identify another NONplayoff team that has a tremendously bad contract and wojld give it to the Flyers for VLC the Clarkson comparison makes sense.Then you have to have VLC agree to go there, too.Not a problem in the Clarkson/Horton situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegionOfDoom Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 @B21Like Doom said, some people are confusing VLC the player, with VLC the contract.VLC the contract is horrific. VLC the player as 3rd line centeror now since he's gotten acclimated to the idea can be a scoring 4th line center.This, this is the value he can bring to a team who can use a veteran IN the deep playoffs. A lot of time it's your role players that get you to the cup finals and not your stars alone.Vinny packaged with a Dman and we retain some salary is a possible trade scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 @B21Like Doom said, some people are confusing VLC the player, with VLC the contract.VLC the contract is horrific.VLC the player as 3rd line centeror now since he's gotten acclimated to the idea can be a scoring 4th line center.This, this is the value he can bring to a team who can use a veteran IN the deep playoffs.A lot of time it's your role players that get you to the cup finals and not your stars alone.Vinny packaged with a Dman and we retain some salary is a possible trade scenario. I agree (kinda) but the contract impacts the deal of course. Not sure I'd call VLC a 3rd line center...especially for a contender. This is a guy who has repeatedly been a healthy scratch on a team not making the playoffs. He doesn't just morph into a 3rd line center at the deadline (even if he hasn't been used right by the Flyers). If he were a F/A at seasons end? Maybe. But 3 years left at that price? I guess we find out today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 I agree (kinda) but the contract impacts the deal of course. Not sure I'd call VLC a 3rd line center...especially for a contender. This is a guy who has repeatedly been a healthy scratch on a team not making the playoffs. He doesn't just morph into a 3rd line center at the deadline (even if he hasn't been used right by the Flyers). If he were a F/A at seasons end? Maybe. But 3 years left at that price? I guess we find out today. @ B and LOD, I agree to an extent as well... Vinny the player might help a team but in an economics based league vis a vis the salary cap the contract certainly plays a very large part. I really dont see a Team taking on that contract and if he were to be moved the Flyers will most likely need to eat a few million per year. I just dont see it happening and I dont see VLC as a viable 3rd line center on a contender. As B noted... this is a guy who has been a healthy scratch and has been relegated to the 4th line on a bad team. I guess we will find out in the next few hours but I am not really holding my breath here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 I dunno about him not being a "Viable third line center on a contending team." VLC has missed a few games to injury this season, but more to being a scratch, at least in part due to The Flyers pushing him down the lineup to give their young players a bigger role. Still and all, he projects to 32 points for a full 82 games on the fourth line of a miserable team. Over a full 82 games he would be producing almost as many points per dollar as Pittsburgh's third line center. On the fourth line on a crappy team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 VLC has missed a few games to injury this season, but more to being a scratch, at least in part due to The Flyers pushing him down the lineup to give their young players a bigger role. Younger players like Zac Rinaldo? Over a full 82 games he would be producing almost as many points per dollar as Pittsburgh's third line center. On the fourth line on a crappy team. We're comparing VLC to Brandon Sutter now? Sure - the points are close. Sutter is also a top PK guy averaging over 2:30 per game this year. Vinny has all off :11 seconds total. And last but not least - you said it yourself. Vinny is injury prone. Sutter has missed 3 games in the last 5 years. Vinny hasn't played anything close to a full season in the last 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 VLC: Very Large Catastrophe! (for the flyers) see what I did there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 @B21 I don't think "producing points per dollar" means VLC = Sutter on a PK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 @B21 I don't think "producing points per dollar" means VLC = Sutter on a PK. English only... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 Not sure I'd call VLC a 3rd line center...especially for a contender. All I'm pointing out is that he easily projects pointwise to a 3rd line center. I used Sutter since you're a Pens fan. But if you compare his average production to third line centers on playoff teams around the league, it's on par with all but a few (in fact, 32 is the projected number for most, including Sutter and VLC, strangely enough), and again, this is on the fourth line. Now there are variations between teams on who plays PP and PK and the role of various lines (Sutter, the Pens' third line center kills penalties, Schenn, the Flyers', does not, that's done by their 1st and second line centers. Detroit will often match top line vs top line, other teams match a checking line, etc.). Take back salary and his contract is also suddenly also in line with third line centers around the league who are not on entry level contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 All I'm pointing out is that he easily projects pointwise to a 3rd line center. I used Sutter since you're a Pens fan. But if you compare his average production to third line centers on playoff teams around the league, it's on par with all but a few (in fact, 32 is the projected number for most, including Sutter and VLC, strangely enough), and again, this is on the fourth line. Now there are variations between teams on who plays PP and PK and the role of various lines (Sutter, the Pens' third line center kills penalties, Schenn, the Flyers', does not, that's done by their 1st and second line centers. Detroit will often match top line vs top line, other teams match a checking line, etc.). Take back salary and his contract is also suddenly also in line with third line centers around the league who are not on entry level contracts. I get all that - and don't disagree with the point you are trying to make. But, as you noted, if he's the 4th line center on the Flyers I just can't see trying to "sell" him as a 3rd line center to a contender. You'd be hard pressed to find anything said about VLC that has been positive but now all of a sudden he's useful to a contender? Like I said...F/A at the end of the season? Maybe. But no contender (likely a team close to the cap) is taking on even a part of that contract to add what little VLC can offer at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 Aaaaaaaaaannnnnnnnndddd.....VLC is still a Flyer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 @B21 We're saving him for a draft day trade???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samifan Posted March 2, 2015 Share Posted March 2, 2015 The only GM that would have taken VLC was Paul Holmgren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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