Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 One of six goals on the PP last year.Good point!Check his overall point production... It was over 75% not long ago... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Bah, I've never seen you say anything but negative things about Timo on this board. A 2nd rounder is great for us because we gave ours away in an even dumber trade. But really, the success rate of 2nd round picks is not great. Maybe 2-6 guys in any given year will be impact NHLers. The rest either play a handful of games and fade or never play at all.It's a low-risk trade for Chicago. I respect Timonen's good years but those are well behind him. I also appreciate your loyalty to him, but this trade makes little sense. You say low risk, and I say your draft puck has a higher potential of making an impact than Timonen does with the Hawks. Second PP and maybe a 5/6 d-man at this stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStraw Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 You say low risk, and I say your draft puck has a higher potential of making an impact than Timonen does with the Hawks. Second PP and maybe a 5/6 d-man at this stage. That 2nd round pick will have exactly zero impact for the Hawks chances to win the Cup this year, which is what they're after. Timonen will help out on the PP and PK, and will help in puck possession/transition in 5 on 5 play. For a team like Chicago that's in win-now mode that's worth a late 2nd+. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZeZel25 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 they got more than what I thought...Glad Hexy got back into the 2nd round of the upcoming draft Kimmo...We the Flyer fans thank you for your service to this team. Best of Luck and stay healthy my friend!Got a 2nd back and a 3rd that they lost in trade. Shocked they got that much back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I respect Timonen's good years but those are well behind him. I also appreciate your loyalty to him, but this trade makes little sense. You say low risk, and I say your draft puck has a higher potential of making an impact than Timonen does with the Hawks. Second PP and maybe a 5/6 d-man at this stage. I'm with you on this. The trade makes perfect sense if Timmo had been playing all season. But for a guy who hasn't played in a year? To just throw him into the fire in the midst of a playoff chase in that division? Win: Flyers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 That's a lot of trade for a now slow moving defenseman who only scores on the power play. Especially when you already have such a solid power play. Hextall just fleeced Chicago. Not that you are flat out wrong in your assessment, but I just have to wonder what your position were if he was playing for Pittsburgh. I am not sure why, but I can see you singing a totally different tune and telling people how much value Timonen has to the team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Good trade for both teams. Chicago is going for the Cup, obviously. If........... IF....... Timonen manages to regain his shape and stay healthy, they got a great weapon to an already outstanding roster. And the Flyers got a 2nd rounder in one of the deepest drafts in the NHL recent history. Good luck to Timo! He will always has a speciual place in Flyers fans' hearts. I agree with what may here said. If an aging player who hasn't played a game all season is worth a second, there is no way I am trading Coburn for anything less than a 1st. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Not that you are flat out wrong in your assessment, but I just have to wonder what your position were if he was playing for Pittsburgh. I am not sure why, but I can see you singing a totally different tune and telling people how much value Timonen has to the team... Wrong in my assessment? What has Timonen done this season to prove he's going to have an impact for the Hawks? Timonen had 14 even strength points in 77 games. He's not going to have an impact for Chicago even strength with the defensive corps they already have. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson and Rundblad all have respectable numbers this season. That points Timo towards a 5/6 d-man. Can he handle more ice time than that? Injuries and not skating for how long? Your kidding yourself saying I'm wrong. This isn't Timonen of four years ago, this is here and now.@B21I can't even say their GM did good without getting criticized for it. I even put orange tinted glasses on looking at this one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 That 2nd round pick will have exactly zero impact for the Hawks chances to win the Cup this year, which is what they're after. Timonen will help out on the PP and PK, and will help in puck possession/transition in 5 on 5 play. For a team like Chicago that's in win-now mode that's worth a late 2nd+. Yes i agree. The core will be... Seabrook/KeithHjalmarsson/Kimmo??Rundblad/Erixon I think as a #4 maybe not sure....he'll be fine to start with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Wrong in my assessment? What has Timonen done this season to prove he's going to have an impact for the Hawks? Timonen had 14 even strength points in 77 games. He's not going to have an impact for Chicago even strength with the defensive corps they already have. Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson and Rundblad all have respectable numbers this season. That points Timo towards a 5/6 d-man. Can he handle more ice time than that? Injuries and not skating for how long? Your kidding yourself saying I'm wrong. This isn't Timonen of four years ago, this is here and now. I said you are NOT wrong in your assessment. But you have to understand that he was playing with utter garbage here. As a result, he had to overcommit on many plays - both even-strength and on PP. Both Laviolette and Berube overused him, but that's because there was nobody else on the Flyers D who could even remotely be expected to take over and shoulder responsibilities. If he is so useless, why do you think he WAS logging close to 24 minutes before he was diagnozed with this blood condition? Exactly *because* he will be playing with Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson and Rundblad, instead of Coburn or Luke Schenn, he won't need to be logging ridiculous ice time or be asked to do just about everything. If I am Chicago, for me the bigger concern is his health, not so much his game. But if he regains his form *and* stays healthy, I just can't see how this is not a good return for Chicago. Yes, it's a risk, but so what.... A lot what you do at a trade deadline will be a risk. They wouldn't be getting a quality player - rental or not - and not expect to give up something more tsubstantial than a 2nd round pick. I am sure that factored in their decision a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I'm with you on this. The trade makes perfect sense if Timmo had been playing all season. But for a guy who hasn't played in a year? To just throw him into the fire in the midst of a playoff chase in that division? Win: Flyers. the other way to look at this is as a 40 year old (gulp) the fact that he hasn't been playing means he's not worn down from 50 + games in the NHL.70 % of Timonen is still better than all of Runblad, if Timonen is in fact able to play without dying from his blood clots. I do and would share your apprehension about his not playing this year, he is a wildcard, unknown ... I will be interested in seeing where and how he fits in in that d corps, they are dynamic 1-4 so if he slots in in that bottom pairing i think the hawks lose nothing from this deal, he gives them 10+ a night and allows Quennville some options on the powerplay... the curious part for me is why they are not looking for some scoring unless they think they have that on the farm. in win now mode i don't think this is a horrible trade, provided Timonen has something left in the tank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Can he handle more ice time than that? Yes without doubt. But not off the bat he needs time to work into game shape but by the time the playoffs come around he'll be getting top 4 minutes for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I said you are NOT wrong in your assessment. But you have to understand that he was playing with utter garbage here. As a result, he had to overcommit on many plays - both even-strength and on PP. Both Laviolette and Berube overused him, but that's because there was nobody else on the Flyers D who could even remotely be expected to take over and shoulder responsibilities. If he is so useless, why do you think he WAS logging close to 24 minutes before he was diagnozed with this blood condition?Exactly *because* he will be playing with Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson and Rundblad, instead of Coburn or Luke Schenn, he won't need to be logging ridiculous ice time or be asked to do just about everything. If I am Chicago, for me the bigger concern is his health, not so much his game. But if he regains his form *and* stays healthy, I just can't see how this is not a good return for Chicago. Yes, it's a risk, but so what.... A lot what you do at a trade deadline will be a risk. They wouldn't be getting a quality player - rental or not - and not expect to give up something more tsubstantial than a 2nd round pick. I am sure that factored in their decision a lot.Sorry read it as NOW that you are wrong not, NOT that you are wrong. My bad.I just think Philly got much more in this than Chicago should've given for him. To your question about the Pens, I'd be pissed at Rutherford if he'd made this trade. I really see Timonen as a nobody on the ice these days. I put all six Pens defensemen ahead of him right now if for no other reason than I want my youth getting the 5/6 time. He wouldn't replace Letang, Martin, or Erhoff for sure. And I'd rather see Pouliot out there for his outstanding offensive skill set. Scuderi has been real good defensively again, and I'd rather have Depres and Bortuzzo getting the ice time. I know Timonen is a fan favorite. I get it. But I don't want him. Not even for free. And NOT because he was a Flyer. Just because his day is done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Check his overall point production... It was over 75% not long ago...Be sure to change your statement to fit what you meant to say :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 @Polaris922 we're not talking about taking regular season minutes from developing youngsters with the deal the hawks just made. we're talking about a team with a finite championship window trying to make the most of their time as a top team in the league. So answer this question, would you rather give bottom pairing minutes to a kid in the system or win a championship ? because the 'hawks are thinking about winning as much as they can with the core of keith , seabrook , towes, hossa and kane...that group like all groups has a limited shelf life . i won't fault a team for trying to get as much winning as they can from their stars. this is the mode your team has been in for a couple of years now, can you not see this for what it is... ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGreatGazoo Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 At the risk of hi-jacking the thread, I'm not sure how much this trade truly helps the Hawks. Kimmo is 39 and hasn't played for almost a year. I've read he's slotted as a 3rd pairing guy for them and possiblly 2nd PP unit. Not to mention that pesky broken clavicle for Kane. He can't be replaced and the Hawks are gonna have to win 3 rounds in a brutal conference without him. It's sacrilege to say as a flyers fan, but 44 coming back the the Flyers does little for this year. I'm glad they traded him and happy with the return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 At the risk of hi-jacking the thread, I'm not sure how much this trade truly helps the Hawks. Kimmo is 39 and hasn't played for almost a year. I've read he'sslotted as a 3rd pairing guy for them and possiblly 2nd PP unit.Not to mention that pesky broken clavicle for Kane. He can't be replaced and the Hawks are gonna have to win 3 rounds in a brutal conference without him.It's sacrilege to say as a flyers fan, but 44 coming back the the Flyers does little for this year. I'm glad they traded him and happy with the return. Kimmo isn't there to replace Kane he is there to help with the injuries to Oduya and Rozsival which is where he can help. And he can help with the young kid as well if they pair them together Rundblad who is only 24. I think it's a good trade....will it guarantee the Cup no but it will help their chances...certainly more than a 2nd round pick can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Pens fans are just griping bc LeTang is one of the most overrated players in the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Be sure to change your statement to fit what you meant to say :-)I said score right? Points are scoring. Maybe to you that just means goals? Different perceptions of the word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 @Polaris922we're not talking about taking regular season minutes from developing youngsters with the deal the hawks just made.we're talking about a team with a finite championship window trying to make the most of their time as a top team in the league. So answer this question, would you rather give bottom pairing minutes to a kid in the system or win a championship ? because the 'hawks are thinking about winning as much as they can with the core of keith , seabrook , towes, hossa and kane...that group like all groups has a limited shelf life . i won't fault a team for trying to get as much winning as they can from their stars.this is the mode your team has been in for a couple of years now, can you not see this for what it is... ? I don't really see a guy who hasn't played in forever and at 40 coming back from injuries when he couldn't produce 5 on 5 before injury as going for it. As an opponent I LIKE when Timonen is on the ice. He's positionally solid as a vet should be, but he's slow. He's a liability. I don't want a liability going for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 Pens fans are just griping bc LeTang is one of the most overrated players in the league.Because 10 goals, 37 assists and plus 11 in 55 games... 1 point from leading all defensemen in 6 less games... Overrated by whom? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 @Polaris922 at the top of this page i voiced that same concern about this not playing . so provided he has something left, it's not a horrible move. He's not going to play top or even 2nd pairing minutes unless things go horribly wrong in chicago, he's a fine guy to fill out the bottom pair , he won't hurt that team in his limited role. He was playing top pairing minutes here with mutt and jeff as his partner and was still a plus player with the benefit of being a calming influence. the second round pick does nothing to help the now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 I will NEVER say the Flyers GM did a good job again. You guys are all right. Hextall is an idiot. Timonen's past makes him an instant Norris candidate this year. He has twenty games left this year, and he's sure to win the hardware by season's end. He's the holy grail of defensemen. My children and I will pray to him at supper tonight. Amen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 @Polaris922at the top of this page i voiced that same concern about this not playing .so provided he has something left, it's not a horrible move. He's not going to play top or even 2nd pairing minutes unless things go horribly wrong in chicago, he's a fine guy to fill out the bottom pair , he won't hurt that team in his limited role. He was playing top pairing minutes here with mutt and jeff as his partner and was still a plus player with the benefit of being a calming influence. the second round pick does nothing to help the now. You're allowed to say that. Apparently I'm not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted February 28, 2015 Share Posted February 28, 2015 @Polaris922 I don't think anyone is disputing Hextall made a good trade. Most are just saying Timonen can help Chicago, while you're saying he's done. Maybe he is...none of us know at this point because he's been out all year. He's got 20 games to get back into shape before playoffs, and if he can play at the level he did last year, this is a win-win trade. Did Chicago overpay? Most do at this time of year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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