Cousins traded to the Yotes

[ruxpin]

Warren will never see NHL ice. If he does, that's just unexpected bonus (miracle).  Same with the 5th round, really. 

 

The Harvard goalie is who cares. That leaves Cousins. I don't think anyone here will remember him in about 20 minutes other than in some game where the object is to rattle off names of obscure former Flyers.  He's bottom 6 at best and most likely tweener.

 

This smells like it has nothing to do with hockey. This sounds simply like a roster /numbers business move.  So why?  Others have mentioned the most likely.  It's simply that they couldn't protect both Laughton and Cousins and wanted to get SOMETHING for him. 

 

At his salary, it's possible it's a cap move but I think unlikely.  And I don't think it's about acquiring picks for a trade. That's possible, but again I think unlikely. So, my bet is that it's an expansion draft - related thing and that's all. 

[OccamsRazor]

5 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

Same with the 5th round, really. 

 

 

Oskar Lindblom was a 5th round pick so if used wisely he COULD see the NHL.........

[ruxpin]

1 minute ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

Oskar Lindblom was a 5th round pick so if used wisely he COULD see the NHL.........

Sorry, poor writing on my part. The "same as" wasn't going back to "never." It was going back to "unexpected bonus" in my head when I wrote it.  But you read what is actually there and you're right that it's proven to be possible. 

[OccamsRazor]

9 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

Sorry, poor writing on my part. The "same as" wasn't going back to "never." It was going back to "unexpected bonus" in my head when I wrote it.  But you read what is actually there and you're right that it's proven to be possible. 

 

 

You're right the chances of him making are slim to none. It was just a move to get something for Cousins and the kid is almost 4 years younger too. It is a meh move.....

[OccamsRazor]

 

 

Like i said a depth guy at best....he still has two more years at Michigan to play with another Flyer prospect Cooper Marody...so we'll revisit in a another couple years....

[OccamsRazor]

 

 

I wish the kid well...except when they play the Yotes!!!!!!

[OccamsRazor]

Forward Nick Cousins was a victim of the pre-Expansion Draft and 2017-18 roster planning numbers game for the Philadelphia Flyers. The player, who would not have been protected from the Expansion Draft and, even if not taken by the Vegas Knights, faced an uphill struggle to keep his NHL roster space in Philadelphia, was traded by the Flyers to the Arizona Coyotes on Friday. 

The Flyers also sent Harvard University goaltender Merrick Madsen in the trade. In return, the Flyers received University of Michigan left winger Brendan Warren and a 2018 fifth-round pick from the Coyotes.

Warren, a speedy and responsible all-around forward with limited offensive upside, is a product of the US National Team Development Program. He was selected by the Coyotes in the third round of the 2015 NHL Draft. Thus far, Warren has played in a total of 73 games for Michigan over two seasons. He posted eight goals, 19 assists, and 27 points over his freshman and sophomore campaigns.

Cousins will have a good chance to earn a roster spot with the Coyotes next season and will be protected by Arizona in the Expansion Draft. A prolific scorer in junior hockey and well-above average offensive player in the American Hockey League, Cousins has had to carve a different niche at the NHL level because he lacks speed as well as size. Once a below-average defensive player, he has worked hard on his two-way game to not be a liability, and parlayed his improvements as an all-around player into an NHL role with the Flyers over the last two seasons. However, he still lacked a defined role apart from being an agitating forward who brought energy to a bottom-six role. 

Madsen,21, was originally selected by the Flyers in the sixth round of the 2013 Draft. He has emerged as a fine collegiate goalie for Harvard but faced an uphill climb in the Flyers' goaltending prospect depth charts with AHLers Anthony Stolarz and Alex Lyon, WHL goaltender Carter Hart and Swedish netminder Felix Sandström all arguably ahead of him.

 

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-Meltzer/Flyers-Trade-Cousins-Madsen-to-Arizona-for-Warren-and-Draft-Pick/45/85801

 

 

PUSH!!!!!

[elmatus]

3 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

Making room for Vandevelde!!!!!

 

 

We really need a middle finger emoticon.

 

I can't say I like the deal, but I guess it's something. I don't think Cousins was part of the future. This was likely just a move to get something for him rather than lose him. I guess I get that.

[AJgoal]

The return is less than I'd have liked, but the Flyers did have a log jam and that might hurt value a little.

 

Cousins is a guy I like, but there's not really much room for him. Regardless of what position, there are at least three players who deserve to be farther up the depth chart. So at best he's on the Flyers' 4th line. And I don't think the Flyers have evolved their thought process enough on what a 4th line can be that keeping Cousins there makes sense to them.

 

Some fans speculating this could be part 1 of a 2 part trade bringing Smith to Philly after the Expansion draft. Not sure how I would feel about that.

[AlaskaFlyerFan]

4 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

I think there is another shoe to drop soon i think the trade deadline is today at 3.

 

Just over an hour till the deadline and it is dead quiet...

[AJgoal]

Well, good. Smith to Calgary.

[Howie58]

9 hours ago, RJ8812 said:

 

I dont understand how trading Cousins, a player that couldnt establish himself in the bottom-6, would lead you to think Couturier is being traded to keep Laughton around 

Specifics aside (and I get this guy may never make it), is the brass beginning to think that Coots is something of an overpriced checking center.  I know others here and elsewhere think otherwise but there may be a point where paying 4.5 million for him is viewed as excessive.  Laughton made progress at the farm this year as a two-way center.  Maybe he is not as good as Coots. But unless Coots brings it up a notch or two on scoring, his salary is high and that may play a role in wanting to keep him instead of Cousins around.  

[OccamsRazor]

45 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

Well, good. Smith to Calgary.

 

Well there goes another suitor for Mason.......well he could go to Arizona now...

[OccamsRazor]

 

 

#sickdpethinflyerspipeline

[RJ8812]

Was never a fan of Cousins. Never took that next step. He just wasn't good enough to play in the top-6, and really didn't have the skill set to play on the bottom-6. Didn't add anything else (face-offs, physicality or PK ability). I expect him to head to the KHL after his contract with Arizona is done. 

[King Knut]

On 6/16/2017 at 10:48 PM, hf101 said:

Flyers adding picks to trade for Fleury?

 

Or planting breadcrumbs for Vegas to pick up from other teams in exchange for drafting Neuvirth.  

POSSIBLY trading Fleury as well.

 

That's the only explanation I've got.  Vegas may very well have said, "We want young responsible NHL forwards, we want Cousins and Laughton from you guys, but we can only draft one.  I could see them NOT wanting to pay $5mill for a goalie in Fleury and McPhee has the history with Neuwirth.  There are a half dozen OTHER reasons I see Neuwirth leaving the Flyers this summer, but I won't get into that here, I've expounded upon that elsewhere.

 

SO they draft Fleury from the Penguins, Neuwirth from us, Cousins from The Coyotes, we trade them Laughton and a couple of picks (we have a ton this year) for Fleury.

 

It all makes sense to me.  The Flyers lineup is a bit too crowded in the next two years at forward.  Losing Cousins and Laughton (who while not amazing, are responsible and most likely fair NHL players if not expected to carry any heavy lifting).  I don't think those two guys were getting much playing time from here on out anyway.  None of us want Neuwirth as the starter (fine for a backup, if we didn't have Stolarz & Lyon (and next year Madsen and Sandstrom and Hart) to start taking looks at.

 

My only hope is that Stolarz isn't involved.  I would like to see him backup a full season before we jettison him.

 

OH... and Fleury would have to waive his NTC twice (he's waived it for Vegas already)... small stumbling block.

 

EDIT:  NEVER MIND.  The Yotes protected Cousins.  They plan to keep him.  I have no idea why this trade was made.  ANY ONE ELSE?

 

[King Knut]

22 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

 

#sickdpethinflyerspipeline

 

The Madsen part of this confuses me a little bit.  That's a legit head scratcher that really makes me think there's more to this situation.

 

It's like the Streit deal... it didn't make a ton of sense until the Penguins traded for him.  I'm guessing Madsen was thrown in so Arizona could get something out of the situation other than being a mule for Vegas (and for Vegas NOT taking one of their players... not that the Coyote have a ton they couldn't live without)

[King Knut]

On 6/17/2017 at 2:52 PM, Howie58 said:

Specifics aside (and I get this guy may never make it), is the brass beginning to think that Coots is something of an overpriced checking center.  I know others here and elsewhere think otherwise but there may be a point where paying 4.5 million for him is viewed as excessive.  Laughton made progress at the farm this year as a two-way center.  Maybe he is not as good as Coots. But unless Coots brings it up a notch or two on scoring, his salary is high and that may play a role in wanting to keep him instead of Cousins around.  

 

I don't think the Flyers would be trading Couturier until they knew what they were getting in the #2 pick.

Especially not with Filppula pretty much being out of town at the end of this season.

 

In three years if #2 pans out and Rubtsov is looking like a keeper and if Vecchione has established himself as the 4th line C (and I think he will if he sticks around) then, I could see Hextall trading off the final two years of Coots' contract.

 

Right now, there are just too many magic beans up in the air for them to go trading off a player they rely on as heavily as they rely on Couturier.  

 

And while I believe in Couturier and what he does for this team more than most people here, one of the reasons I do is because I see how much the team does.  And remember, it's not just Hakstol who leans on Couturier in every situation and in the key moments in his own end.  It's been every coach Coots has played for since becoming a pro.  IT started with Lavvy (remember Coots taking faceoffs against Crosby and Malkin short handed in the playoffs and Laviolette being kind of shocked that A) he had to do it and B) Coots seemed to be handling it just fine?) and continued with Berube (who I think is the real reason we all talk about Coots the way we do by giving him the worst assignments for two seasons).  Now under Hakstol it seems that they've had have almost no choice with Coots.  They just rely on him too much.    Laughton didn't work out.  Maybe Vex can... but in the mean time, much like trading Voracek or Giroux, trading Couturier right now leaves a gaping whole in the lineup as far as roles and responsibilities go and as of this season, there's just no one to fill it.  

 

That might very well change, but I don't see that happening for at least two more years when Filppula goes and God willing #2 works out and Rubstov makes a case for himself.  

 

 

[King Knut]

On 6/17/2017 at 9:20 AM, ruxpin said:

Warren will never see NHL ice. If he does, that's just unexpected bonus (miracle).  Same with the 5th round, really. 

 

The Harvard goalie is who cares. That leaves Cousins. I don't think anyone here will remember him in about 20 minutes other than in some game where the object is to rattle off names of obscure former Flyers.  He's bottom 6 at best and most likely tweener.

 

This smells like it has nothing to do with hockey. This sounds simply like a roster /numbers business move.  So why?  Others have mentioned the most likely.  It's simply that they couldn't protect both Laughton and Cousins and wanted to get SOMETHING for him. 

 

At his salary, it's possible it's a cap move but I think unlikely.  And I don't think it's about acquiring picks for a trade. That's possible, but again I think unlikely. So, my bet is that it's an expansion draft - related thing and that's all. 

 

I would have thought that too, but the coyotes protected Cousins and Madsen can't be drafted by Vegas.  

It's a bit of a favor to Madsen who was staring at a career with the Flyers where he'd be fighting his rump off for AHL minutes the rest of his life.  He may never be an NHL goalie (and he may) but at least in Arizona there's a chance for a more open path to getting in a few games here and there.  

 

Long story short, I really don't get why the Flyers made this trade. Not saying I don't think there was a strategic reason, I just don't know what it was yet.  AT THE MOST it just saved Hextall from having to negotiation a bridge RFA deal for Cousins this off season and leaves nearly a million open to sign Weal.  It all but ensures that the Flyers will also save an additional 2.35million of Raffle or Wiese's deals.

 

It's feasible that Vegas could take PEB for 1.5 if they really can't find any kind of veteran leadership or role players out there... but I kind of doubt it based on his age and the fact that he's only signed for two years (and he plays about 7 minutes a night).

 

That's the best theory I've got. 

 

 

 

 

 

[mojo1917]

20 minutes ago, King Knut said:

It's a bit of a favor to Madsen who was staring at a career with the Flyers where he'd be fighting his rump off for AHL minutes the rest of his life.  He may never be an NHL goalie (and he may) but at least in Arizona there's a chance for a more open path to getting in a few games here and there.  

 

Long story short, I really don't get why the Flyers made this trade. Not saying I don't think there was a strategic reason, I just don't know what it was yet.

I think this might be the answer regarding Madsen.

There are times when people do the "right" or helpful thing regarding a young guy's career. 

this may be one of those moments.

 

[King Knut]

1 hour ago, King Knut said:

 

The Madsen part of this confuses me a little bit.  That's a legit head scratcher that really makes me think there's more to this situation.

 

It's like the Streit deal... it didn't make a ton of sense until the Penguins traded for him.  I'm guessing Madsen was thrown in so Arizona could get something out of the situation other than being a mule for Vegas (and for Vegas NOT taking one of their players... not that the Coyote have a ton they couldn't live without)

 

EDIT:  I'm changing this because I see now that Cousins has been protected by Arizona.  Madsen might have been thrown in just to help the kid out.

 

Still don't know why the Flyers traded Cousins though.  Not that they needed him, but what's the difference between making this trade and letting Vegas have him?

[King Knut]

On 6/17/2017 at 3:01 PM, OccamsRazor said:

 

Well there goes another suitor for Mason.......well he could go to Arizona now...

 

I'm still playing Catch Up after Father's Day, but I'm just seeing now that Mrazek was exposed by the Redwings.

 

I expect now that Vegas could draft Mrazek and Fleury and Neuvrith with the intention of trading either Mrazek or Fleury to the Flyers and keeping the other two to be starter and backup/tandem.

 

I expect they'd be wanting to dish Fleury as he makes more, but he also has an NTC to waive in order to come to the Flyers.  

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, King Knut said:

I would have thought that too, but the coyotes protected Cousins and Madsen can't be drafted by Vegas

 

It's an expansion draft move from the Flyers side.  From the Coyotes' side, they're getting a cheap player who could produce (not likely, from where I sit, but possible).  

 

But yeah, I'm not sure why Madsen was involved from the Flyers' side.  I agree that he wasn't going anywhere here and could be a favor to him.  It may be that was the Flyers "payment" for them taking Cousins?  Like, it was clear the Flyers were trying to get something, anything, for Cousins and the Yotes said, "Sure, but you also have to give us..."

 

I don't know otherwise.

[King Knut]

14 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

 

It's an expansion draft move from the Flyers side.  From the Coyotes' side, they're getting a cheap player who could produce (not likely, from where I sit, but possible).  

 

But yeah, I'm not sure why Madsen was involved from the Flyers' side.  I agree that he wasn't going anywhere here and could be a favor to him.  It may be that was the Flyers "payment" for them taking Cousins?  Like, it was clear the Flyers were trying to get something, anything, for Cousins and the Yotes said, "Sure, but you also have to give us..."

 

I don't know otherwise.

 

I don't see the advantage from the Flyers perspective.  I think it actually helps the Yotes out a lot.  Cousins will play there and be a helpful addition to the team in all likelihood.  He's not going to be a star, but he'll get minutes that he probably wouldn't in Philly at this point.  

 

Getting a prospect that no one thinks will ever make the NHL and a 5th round pick just doesn't seem like "Getting something" for Cousins.    Granted, Cousins was himself a throw in from another deal, but nevertheless...  I'm just not sure I see the advantage to trading two players for this yield rather than just letting Vegas take Cousins.   Especially if you were going to protect Laughton anyway.  

 

And let me be clear, I actually DO assume that there was a point to this deal.  I just don't see it yet.  I find it curious and am eager to see what unfolds.  That's all I mean.

 

Streit for Filppula made no sense to me until the Penguins acquired Streit and the Bolts got cap space.  

 

Different but along those lines.

[murraycraven]

13 minutes ago, ruxpin said:

 

It's an expansion draft move from the Flyers side.  From the Coyotes' side, they're getting a cheap player who could produce (not likely, from where I sit, but possible).  

 

But yeah, I'm not sure why Madsen was involved from the Flyers' side.  I agree that he wasn't going anywhere here and could be a favor to him.  It may be that was the Flyers "payment" for them taking Cousins?  Like, it was clear the Flyers were trying to get something, anything, for Cousins and the Yotes said, "Sure, but you also have to give us..."

 

I don't know otherwise.

 

 

I am still in shock that AZ protected Luke Schenn - yes, that Luke Schenn.