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OccamsRazor

Flyers 2020-21 season

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Look i'm turning the page on this past season even if the NHL won't.

 

I just need something new to talk about.

 

2016-17 Flyers season review: Claude Giroux failed to bounce back ...

 

We already have a draft thread so i made this mostly to discuss the offseason moves and camp/preseason for 2020-21 season.

 

Of course if there even is one. So i am in my mind going to plan on there being a season or a start to one at least.

 

So with that said my first question to whomever is even here anymore:

 

Who is resigned and brought back and who is left to let walk or even traded away maybe???

 

I will go out on a limb and say i think everyone will be brought back who is one the roster now except Braun.

 

I'm more on the fence with Elliott who will be 36 come April of next year but i have to say he played much better than i expected in a backup roll once the whole team got rolling.

 

So anyone else feel free to chime in and i would like to ask if there is any draft talk let's leave that on the Flyer's draft thread.

 

So my team:

 

FLYERS

28 Claude Giroux - 14 Sean Couturier - 93 Jakub Voracek
25 James van Riemsdyk - 13 Kevin Hayes - 11 Travis Konecny
21 Scott Laughton - 38 Derek Grant - 18 Tyler Pitlick
49 Joel Farabee - 44 Nate Thompson - 62 Nicolas Aube-Kubel

12 Michael Raffl
 

9 Ivan Provorov - 15 Matt Niskanen
6 Travis Sanheim -5 Phil Myers
53 Shayne Gostisbehere - 59 Mark Friedman

55 Sam Morin 8 Robert Hägg

 

79 Carter Hart
37 Brian Elliott

Power Play 1: Giroux, Couturier, Konecny, Voracek, Provorov.
Power Play 2: Grant, Hayes, Aube-Kubel, Gostisbehere, Niskanen.

23 Oskar Lindblom (Ewing sarcoma), 19 Nolan Patrick (migraines).

 

Now before anyone chimes in this is just how i have the season starting and of course it's subject to change with guys like Frost or a Morin or Hagg beating someone out and maybe forcing a trade.

 

Even Lindblom could be ready maybe and then you have another good problem and it forces someone else out the lineup. So will they prefer to bring a younger backup goalie or go with Moose??

 

Any way i hope everyone is staying safe and i look forward to getting back to some kind of new normal life.

 

Life without sports sucks....i miss it so bad i would maybe even watch a baseball game....

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3 hours ago, intheslot said:

101019663_105499037853112_3939349179326791680_o.jpg

 

Is that a hoodie sewn right into a perfectly good leather jacket? The only way I'm wearing that is if I can get a pair of droopy pants with boxers sewn into the muffin top!  Oh, and a toque to wear in the summer...with the hoodie. :bigteeth:

 

Get off my lawn!

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17 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

Get off my lawn!

 

ROTFLMAO

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So who gets protected for the expansion draft??

 

Giroux

Couturier 

Hayes 

Konecny

Lindblom

Laughton

Patrick

 

Provorov

Sanheim

Myers

 

Hart

 

This is my group.

 

Anyone prefer something else.

 

Something else to ponder during the slow times.

 

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Looks like 2020-21's flat cap season is going to put a lot of teams in a bind. Not sure how that gets prorated for a shortened season it is supposed to be 81.5mill.

 

However i can see Braun not being brought back and maybe Pitlick, Thompson and Grant as well. Not sure. Bored just looking ahead.

 

Myers, NAK and Hagg are up for new deals to RFA ones of course and let's not forget the hardest one of what to do with Nolan Patrick.

 

I would imagine Ghost will be moved as soon as they get a chance can't see them keeping a 7th D man (which he has become) can take his 4.5 mill price tag and spread it among the kids and vets they want to bring back.

 

They have 65.5 mill committed to 14 guys right now Elliott and Lyon both UFA's.

 

That gives them about 11.9 mill to spend and say 16.4 mill if they move Ghost contract.

 

Am i forgetting something??? Seems like i am.

 

Anyways something new to think about instead of the new normal stuff all over the TV and internet.

 

It could be worse teams like Tampa, St. Louis, Leafs Isles and Yotes have a lot of tough decisions to make and possible cuts.

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Occ:

 

I think Patrick is an interesting case.  I suspect a one-year deal.  I hope things pan out for us and him.  

 

Take care,

 

Howie

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7 hours ago, Howie58 said:

Occ:

 

I think Patrick is an interesting case.  I suspect a one-year deal.  I hope things pan out for us and him.  

 

Take care,

 

Howie

 

Yeah Patrick is a interesting case not sure what they do there with him.

 

At this point it would only be a guess.

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On 6/19/2020 at 10:15 AM, OccamsRazor said:

So who gets protected for the expansion draft??

 

Giroux

Couturier 

Hayes 

Konecny

Lindblom

Laughton

Patrick

 

Provorov

Sanheim

Myers

 

Hart

 

This is my group.

 

Anyone prefer something else.

 

Something else to ponder during the slow times.

 

 

I think that the Flyers will expose Laughton (pending UFA) and protect Voracek, but otherwise think you're spot on. 

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1 hour ago, AJgoal said:

 

I think that the Flyers will expose Laughton (pending UFA) and protect Voracek, but otherwise think you're spot on. 

 

I think I would rather have Laughton over Jake.

 

What if they dangle Patrick?

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

 

I think I would rather have Laughton over Jake.

 

What if they dangle Patrick?

 

I went with what I thought they would do. Leaving Voracek exposed depends primarily on what's available in FA or trade.  Frustrating as he is as a player, Jake's a top-6 right wing in the league. Letting him go leaves a huge hole that I don't risk without a plan for filling it.

 

Laughton's a nice player, but he's a 4th liner on a good team (who can move up, true), which, as it happens, the Flyers are. He's also a pending UFA, so if you want to keep him, you just talk contract with him right up until the expansion draft so he knows where he stands with you, and can re-sign if selected. 

 

I doubt they put Patrick out there. He's started slow, but you can definitely see the skill. And he doesn't seem to have a work ethic issue like most high-pick busts seem to have. He's going to be a good player, I think, and giving up several years of low-cost Patrick would seem a bad idea given the stagnant cap situation over the next few years. Plus, even if the Flyers sour on him, as long as he comes out of this with his headaches under control, there's bound to be a team willing to take a chance that he's just a slow developer that you can make a hockey trade with.

Edited by AJgoal

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Just because we can....

 

Johnny Gaudreau to the Philadelphia Flyers: Possible Trade Offer

 

Hidden Content

 

The offer...

 

With the trade value that has been established, to acquire Johnny Gaudreau, the Flyers would have to give up 

Hidden Content

, prospect Cam York, and a 2nd round pick in 2020.

 

...i don't want to give up York but I would make a offer say for this year's #1 in it's place.

 

Or say Brink and another 3rd.

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However York could always Kalnyuk them and not even sign with the Flyers so now that is something to ponder that I wasn't thinking about.

 

I mean it's basically why Kalnyuk wanted to be elsewhere now.

 

They have Provy, Sanheim, Myers and Zamula as future top four material right now.

 

So it would suck for a 1st pick like York to just walk and sign wherever he wants and get nothing in return...again.

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On 7/27/2020 at 9:46 PM, OccamsRazor said:

However York could always Kalnyuk them and not even sign with the Flyers so now that is something to ponder that I wasn't thinking about.

 

I think this speculation is unrealistic. 

yes, it could happen,but  Kalnyuk wasn't a first round pick.

 

I think the Flyers management will entice York to leave school early. If he's progressing they way they want to see, he won't be around to play his senior year in college. If he is, then maybe we won't miss the kid.  Kalnyuk wasn't the same type of prospect as York. Wyatt's ability blossomed to where York's is starting. 

The comparison of the two prospects is not apple to oranges, but it is honey crisp to red delicious. With honey crisp, of course, being the superior apple, I will fight you about this. 

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11 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

I think this speculation is unrealistic. 

yes, it could happen,but  Kalnyuk wasn't a first round pick.

 

I think where he was picked is irrelevant. Bottom line through hard work he has raised his game and put himself on the map and well got snatched up by the Blackhawks good for him.

 

The biggest issues is the prospect will look at the lineup and try to invision where he can fit in and where he may have a chance to win a spot. 

 

And him being a first round pick even works more in his favor when drawing interest from other teams.

 

It has been done before Jimmy Vesey did it, Kevin Hayes did it.

 

Will Butcher and Alexander Kerfoot as well and those are just the ones i know off the top of my head.

 

Point being is that York could do it to the Flyers if there is something he doesn't like (as well as still not signing with the team that would trade for him).

 

However it was just a trade option i had seen mentioned and not even sure it would/could go down. I would not want to include York in it though.

 

I would imagine Johnny would love to be reunited with his old linemate and wonder how good could they be again for the Flyers??

 

Sure likely to never happen but something else to discuss.

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But him being a first round pick makes it more important for the Flyers to concentrate on him. Losing Kalnyuk sucks, because he was progressing nicely and he definitely might have a decent NHL career, but the Flyers hadn't invested a ton of asset value into him. Losing York would be monumental. The Flyers will work much harder to ensure that doesn't happen than they likely did for Kalnyuk. They also have three more years, which would put Ghost in his 30s and likely gone, even if he isn't an offseason casualty this year or at the expansion draft, the old vets will be gone, so there's a much more plausible route to the NHL for York in a couple years than there was for Kalnyuk this year.

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1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

think where he was picked is irrelevant

okay, but your opinion is wrong about this.

Think of it in terms of asset investment and development. Kalnyuk was a bit of a surprise, he was not picked first and thought of as part of the future. He was a "okay maybe this guy plays in the NHL but he'd be nice in LVH for sure.

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

It has been done before Jimmy Vesey

Jimmy Vesey is a middling asshole. 

 

The point you are choosing not to see is the Flyers won't let it get to that point, York will sign a contract before his senior year. He will not get the opportunity to douche out. Also, I don't see much douche in him now. 

 

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25 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

but your opinion is wrong about this

 

Cheers you have to love it when a post start out like this...

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  • Haha 1

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Posted (edited)

Gaudreau was a player who I once thought could help Philly take the step into a playoff position .The Flyers have obviously made that step themselves, so they really don't need that. Now they should be looking for players to help them go deeper in those playoffs. Gaudreau really hasn't looked like that player for a few years now. He's only 26, but he's also really small. I know the NHL has changed but 4 rounds of 7 game series are a grind. 

 

 Now trading JVR for him does make it interesting. A big marshmallow for a small one. Gaudreau unbelievably makes less (by a smidgen). The 2nd round pick I'm fine with. But Cam York? No... No way. 

 

 We're likely to lose a dman in the expansion draft. York can help us replace that on the fly. And have a solid D for a long time that should only get better with experience. I'm pretty confident he signs with Philly. Kalnyuk likely looked at the Flyers depth at that position, with York AND Zamula in the wings and figured he didn't have much of a shot. I don't blame him.

Edited by flyercanuck
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On 7/30/2020 at 1:29 PM, flyercanuck said:

Gaudreau really hasn't looked like that player for a few years now.

 

He look good the other day.

 

He is our Danny Briere type they are missing.

 

 

I like this lineup.

 

 

 

Claude GirouxSean CouturierJakub Voracek

 

Johnny GaudreauKevin HayesTravis Konecny

 

 

Oskar LindblomMorgan FrostNicolas Aube-Kubel

 

Joel FarabeeScott LaughtonMichael Raffl

 

 

Not sure if Pitlick and Grant want to come back and be a 13th forward. So maybe it is bunny time.

 

 

 

Connor Bunnaman

 

He has the size now he needs to play vs some bigger competition. 

 

And if we can ever get Nolan back he is going to push Raffl out the lineup. I would like to see that.

 

 

 

Nolan Patrick

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With about 8.9 mill in cap space i think one of JVR or Jake gets moved, more than likely JVR.

 

Myers

Hagg

NAK

Elliott

 

Unless someone is moved Braun, Grant, Pitlick and Thompson won't be back.

 

Not sure what Chuckles has up his sleeve but i know he knows he can't afford a 7 million dollar 3rd line LW.

 

The following year Hart, Niskanen, Sanheim and Laughton will need new deals. More youth will be supplemented next year i think in the bottom 6. Frost and Bunnaman will more than likely find a spot.

 

Elliott will be 36 next year do they look for a younger cheaper option??

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You forgot Patrick, who also needs a new deal.

 

I think the more likely option is they move on from either Hagg or Gostisbehere. With Friedman signing a new deal, and Morin healthy as your #7, they only need one of the other two. Either is probably easier to move than JVR, who would probably require some salary coming back.

 

That said, I don't really know that they need to move anyone out. Myers is probably going to be the most expensive of the bunch, and I can't see him costing more than 2 million unless they go after a long term deal, which I would support. I imagine Patrick and the Flyers will go for a low cost short term deal. NAK will come in under 1 million. If they bring back Moose he should be low cost, and they have Ustimenko, Sandstrom, etc waiting in the wings. Sandin is probably going to have a strong shot at the team, and Frost and Farabee are other guys on ELCs that should probably make full time contributions.

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I think Fletcher might do a retool this upcoming offseason. Laughton will stay this offseason, but I can't be sure if he'll be around after that. I fully expect that Van Useless, Gostisbehere and Braun will be gone. Grant and Thompson are probably walking as well, maybe even Elliott and a player like Lyon. So, we know we're probably looking at:

 

Giroux - Couturier - Voracek

Laughton - Hayes - Konecny

Lindblom - Frost - Farabee

Raffl - Patrick - NAK

 

In terms of defense:

 

Provorov - Niskanen

Sanheim - Myers

Zamula - Friedman

 

As for the goaltending:

 

Hart

UFA or Trade Acquisition

 

What should be crazy is to see what we're looking at for the end of 2021. Not only do I think Laughton is going to go, but it won't surprise me if they try shedding Voracek as well, especially if Allison, Laczynski and Brink are ready to compete for spots.

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31 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

UFA or Trade Acquisition

 

I think if i'm Elliott turning 36 and not wanting to move he could offer the Flyers a helluva deal for one more year or plan B go after Thomas Greiss after NYI let him walk.

 

Otherwise i agree with everything except Ghost....i'm trying to hold onto him every way i can and not move him unless it is for a nice return. 

 

Hagg is a RFA so i would try and flip him to LA for Tobias Bjornfot.

 

Hagg could give them some experience and upgrade from their two UFAs Ben Hutton and Joakim Ryan.

 

Flyers could get a Bjornfot back to add to the Phantoms and his contract would slide another year.

 

And i guess fingers crossed on Patrick coming back.

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54 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

fingers crossed on Patrick coming back.

 

I've had the chronic migraine symptoms that Patrick has and it's a problem that will be conquered. The good news is that the migraines aren't a result of post concussion syndrome or concussion issues. It's a legitimate medical problem. The fact he's been skating, working out and has been travelling with the team is very encouraging. Once the proper medical, diet and prescription treatment is reached, there's no reason why he can't come back. The issue is time and its going to take time. I think he plays on the 2020-2021 season and fourth line duty and special teams will be the best place for him to put it together. The other thing that could also be considered is a position change. Maybe he goes to the wing instead and takes less abuse there. It could also mean using him in various spots throughout the lineup. 

 

I get that in the eternal optimist but I believe this is something he will conquer. 

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    • 6
      Post
      What's considered blowing up though? IF we're talking about moving Voracek and van Riemsdyk, there are numerous players who can fill their roles. For instance, if JVR is moved, there's still Giroux on the top left side, Lindblom can move along side Hayes and then Farabee fits in on the third line. That leaves the fourth line open, where Raffl remains. As for the right side, if Voracek is moved, Konecny slides into the top role, NAK moves into the 2nd line spot with Hayes, and then third line, yo
    • 2
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      I think this speculation is unrealistic.  yes, it could happen,but  Kalnyuk wasn't a first round pick.   I think the Flyers management will entice York to leave school early. If he's progressing they way they want to see, he won't be around to play his senior year in college. If he is, then maybe we won't miss the kid.  Kalnyuk wasn't the same type of prospect as York. Wyatt's ability blossomed to where York's is starting.  The comparison of the two prospects is not apple to
    • 2
      Post
      Cheers you have to love it when a post start out like this...
    • 2
      Post
      After watching this team in the playoffs, not only do I believe that JVR, Braun, Gostisbehere, Thompson and Grant are gone, but I think you can add Voracek and possibly Laughton to the list. I was hesitant on Fletcher doing a full house cleaning, but I think this core has shown they can't get the job done when it matters most. Too many mistakes and there's no sense of urgency from this group until it's too late. There's a sense of complacency in the room in that some guys have long term deals, s
    • 2
      Post
      I'm in the same boat as @mojo1917 and @BobbyClarkeFan16.   I don't think there needs to be a major overhaul. Moving JVR is a must in my mind.   Regardless of the return.  It was a stupid move from the 2nd beginning. Moving Voracek for the right deal would be good also. Thompson & Grant need to go also obviously. Remember that having Patrick (who I believe will be back and is a top 6 player) and Lindblom back drastically changes this lineup without losing anybody.   
    • 2
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      why sure. 'merica ! There's room for everyone.  Despite the fact I think your political views are garbage. I still enjoy talking hockey with you. This current interaction highlights this.  

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