JR Ewing Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 minute ago, AJgoal said: I know what you mean, and I disagree. I think teams gelled over months and sometimes years of playing together are better and more entertaining than a bunch of all-stars thrown together for a couple weeks. I love both the Stanley Cup every Spring and Olympic hockey every four years. One doesn't have to exist to the exclusion of the other, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted April 4, 2017 Author Share Posted April 4, 2017 12 hours ago, ruxpin said: That's okay. I know some of you like it. That's cool. I'm happy, so stay out of my sunshine. Now, now guys! We are all suppose to be friends on this site! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 23 minutes ago, JR Ewing said: I love both the Stanley Cup every Spring and Olympic hockey every four years. One doesn't have to exist to the exclusion of the other, imo. Olympic Hockey will still exist. And I'll actually watch now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JR Ewing Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, AJgoal said: Olympic Hockey will still exist. And I'll actually watch now. Have fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elmatus Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 hour ago, JR Ewing said: How much interest? United States - Apparently, to judge by our membership here, there's not very much at all. Canada - There is a Kobayashi-like appetite for best-on-best hockey, and the Olympics have been that for 20 years. I'm utterly disappointed, because we're left solely with the World Cup now. Since that's the case, the NHL had best drop the Team North America, Europe, and Young Stars crap, and create a true best-on-best tourney. The players absolutely want this, and that's a bullet in their chamber the next time they sit down for their lockout, err, I mean CBA talks. I'll definitely say that I'm very disappointed. It's obviously not surprising, given what the line coming out of the Bettman office has been over the last while, but I am disappointed. I love watching Olympic hockey with the pros involved. Without them, I imagine I will still watch it, but it'll be unfortunate to see the skill gap. I find it hard to compare the Olympics with the SCP. Someone mentioned the SCP being a best-on-best, which I don't think is true at all. I think parity is clearly much greater in the NHL, so you really don't have teams with zero chance. This is definitely a thing at the Olympic level where the same 6 or so teams make up almost the entirety of the medal count over the past forever. That said, for the top Olympic teams, the rosters are far superior to all but a very select few NHL rosters. I think this is very obvious when watching them play as well. In recent years, Team Canada is the obvious example, but the same could easily be said of USA, Sweden, Finland, and Russia. Sure, that's only a handful of teams, but the level of hockey those teams play is higher than in the SCP, and I personally find it super fun to watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 I like it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 41 minutes ago, elmatus said: I find it hard to compare the Olympics with the SCP. Someone mentioned the SCP being a best-on-best, which I don't think is true at all. I think parity is clearly much greater in the NHL, so you really don't have teams with zero chance. This is definitely a thing at the Olympic level where the same 6 or so teams make up almost the entirety of the medal count over the past forever. This is one of the things I hate. I don't want to see teams with zero chance. I don't want to see the US beat Latvia 24-0. Watching teams blow out other teams isn't exciting to me. It's boring and not terribly fun while playing, doubly so while watching. I prefer there to be intrigue at all levels of a tournament, not just a question of how the top three teams are going to finally end up on the medal podium. It's not compelling. I also want to see players I don't see all the time. I want to see the best guys not in the NHL, because I get to see those other guys all the time. I'll take it a step further and say I would love to see the World Championships without the NHL as well. Historically, the All Stars were 9-5-5 vs the defending Stanley Cup champs and I think you could expect that trend to continue (Though if they kept with the shootout the AS team would probably have a larger win total). Interestingly though, only one of the nine wins was by more than 2 goals, while the wins by the championship teams were all by two or more, with all but one by 3+. I'd kill to go back to that all star format, with the ASG held after the season. I do think an AS team would have had a difficult time beating the Chicago and LA teams of the past decade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 3 hours ago, Puck_Pun said: So what sort of interest is there in the Winter Olympics in general in the states and Canada, and the hockey event in particular? It barely gets a mention over here because people don't really give a crap about the sort of sports the winter Olympics has. But I know that's not the case in other countries. I'd say there's a fair amount of interest in the Winter Olympics in general in the US or the network wouldn't shell out the money it does. But I'd be willing to bet the Summer Olympics are more widely watched. Of the two, I personally watch the winter more, but that's 30 minutes vs. 15 minutes. As for hockey, I don't know, but I suspect figure skating gets better TV ratings than hockey. That's all different for Canada, and I think some of our Canadian friends have already answered. The "best vs. best" is not really a selling point for me at all. I like my team and even a few others and like rooting for those teams and against those I don't like. I like the season and I like the playoffs. I think part of my problem is I've always had an aversion to artificial patriotism and I think the Olympics bask in it. But I'll never like shutting down what is marketed as the best league in the world for a tournament that people want to market as better. It does not promote the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yave1964 Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 just as long as I still have my curling I am a happy guy...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2017/04/04/after-getting-back-into-olympics-german-players-irate-about-not-going/ German Players "Irate" About Not Going Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted April 4, 2017 Author Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 hour ago, AJgoal said: This is one of the things I hate. I don't want to see teams with zero chance. I don't want to see the US beat Latvia 24-0. Watching teams blow out other teams isn't exciting to me. It's boring and not terribly fun while playing, doubly so while watching. I prefer there to be intrigue at all levels of a tournament, not just a question of how the top three teams are going to finally end up on the medal podium. It's not compelling. I also want to see players I don't see all the time. I want to see the best guys not in the NHL, because I get to see those other guys all the time. I'll take it a step further and say I would love to see the World Championships without the NHL as well. Historically, the All Stars were 9-5-5 vs the defending Stanley Cup champs and I think you could expect that trend to continue (Though if they kept with the shootout the AS team would probably have a larger win total). Interestingly though, only one of the nine wins was by more than 2 goals, while the wins by the championship teams were all by two or more, with all but one by 3+. I'd kill to go back to that all star format, with the ASG held after the season. I do think an AS team would have had a difficult time beating the Chicago and LA teams of the past decade. Didn't the nhl have this in the '40s? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 hour ago, AJgoal said: Historically, the All Stars were 9-5-5 vs the defending Stanley Cup champs and I think you could expect that trend to continue (Though if they kept with the shootout the AS team would probably have a larger win total). Interestingly though, only one of the nine wins was by more than 2 goals, while the wins by the championship teams were all by two or more, with all but one by 3+. I'd kill to go back to that all star format, with the ASG held after the season. I do think an AS team would have had a difficult time beating the Chicago and LA teams of the past decade. I tend to agree because of the nature of the sport - hockey is for me the ultimate "team" game. That said, it's hard to compare a one-off game with the tournament. I would think that - assuming there was no duplication of players - a tournament-tested team from Canada, USA, Sweden, Czech or Finland, for example, would have a much better chance than a bunch of guys thrown together in a one-off "All Star" format. (The Russians would still blow it ). For one, a lot of those guys have been playing with each other (*ahem*) for years. For another, they would be put together over the course of the competition. I don't know that they would take a seven game series (the Stanley Cup Playoffs are without a doubt more intense and crazy than the Olympics). But whether Gary Bettman wants it or we want it, it seems obvious that the players want to play in the Olympics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 7 minutes ago, radoran said: But whether Gary Bettman wants it or we want it, it seems obvious that the players want to play in the Olympics. They can trade guaranteed contracts for participating during the next lockout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 17 minutes ago, AJgoal said: They can trade guaranteed contracts for participating during the next lockout. It would be Very Interesting to see how they felt about the Olympics if there was some potential penalty for getting injured there... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 52 minutes ago, radoran said: It would be Very Interesting to see how they felt about the Olympics if there was some potential penalty for getting injured there... I have wondered about this situation before: The Olympics are not governed by the NHL. Say Gudas was to slew foot Crosby during the Olympics and blow out his knee. The IOC/IIHF would suspend him, but I don't see how the NHL could. There are lower tier NHL players that make squads each year, what's to prevent them from cheap-shotting a rival NHLer in the hopes of knocking them out of NHL play for the rest of the season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 minute ago, AJgoal said: I have wondered about this situation before: The Olympics are not governed by the NHL. Say Gudas was to slew foot Crosby during the Olympics and blow out his knee. The IOC/IIHF would suspend him, but I don't see how the NHL could. There are lower tier NHL players that make squads each year, what's to prevent them from cheap-shotting a rival NHLer in the hopes of knocking them out of NHL play for the rest of the season? "sportsmanship" Which is kind of a joke answer, but at the same time it hasn't really happened... I don't know the chapter and verse on suspensions or whether the NHL has the ability to enforce things like that. Maybe @AJgoal does? He's usually good with those things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 1 minute ago, radoran said: "sportsmanship" Which is kind of a joke answer, but at the same time it hasn't really happened... I don't know the chapter and verse on suspensions or whether the NHL has the ability to enforce things like that. Maybe @AJgoal does? He's usually good with those things. Ha. Sportsmanship is the answer I would go with, and the larger ice generally makes it more difficult. But then you do have guys that exist like Shaw, Cooke, Neal, Malkin, etc... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDevil Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 I'm kind of hoping both Canada and the US hockey teams do poorly at the Olympics, just to see how quickly the NHL changes it's tune for the next Olympics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samifan Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 Any other dinosaurs like me remember Olympic competition before pro athletes were allowed to participate? I guess I am in the minority when I say who cares if the NHL doesn't allow their players to participate. Sure the U.S.A. will probably get killed but that's what they said in 1980. Do you believe in miracles? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 4 minutes ago, Samifan said: Any other dinosaurs like me remember Olympic competition before pro athletes were allowed to participate? I guess I am in the minority when I say who cares if the NHL doesn't allow their players to participate. Sure the U.S.A. will probably get killed but that's what they said in 1980. Do you believe in miracles? I watched in the 80s, though I was young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yave1964 Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/19076145 Ovie and Kuznetsov already saying that they are going to represent their country regardless of what Bettman says. That did not take long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted April 4, 2017 Share Posted April 4, 2017 2 hours ago, MadDevil said: I'm kind of hoping both Canada and the US hockey teams do poorly at the Olympics, just to see how quickly the NHL changes it's tune for the next Olympics. I'm actually hoping they do poorly at the Worlds in 2020, so they don't even make the Olympics. 12 minutes ago, yave1964 said: http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/19076145 Ovie and Kuznetsov already saying that they are going to represent their country regardless of what Bettman says. That did not take long. I hope the NHL suspends any player that does so for multiple games and penalizes teams that permit it with draft pick forfeiture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 1 hour ago, yave1964 said: http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/19076145 Ovie and Kuznetsov already saying that they are going to represent their country regardless of what Bettman says. That did not take long. Ovechkin sat on the bench when it matters in Socchi. Do you think even the Russians want him to play? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaskaFlyerFan Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 1 hour ago, yave1964 said: http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/19076145 Ovie and Kuznetsov already saying that they are going to represent their country regardless of what Bettman says. That did not take long. And the Caps owner is supporting them in their decision. As I said way back in post #9, the players are going whether the NHL wants them to or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WordsOfWisdom Posted April 5, 2017 Share Posted April 5, 2017 On 4/3/2017 at 4:23 PM, notfondajane said: I heard the N.H.L will not participate in the 2018 Winter Olympics in South Korea? That is a fantastic thing if it's true! Korea sucks. Zero interest in hockey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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