Dead last

[brelic]

Ok. Flyers are officially dead last in the NHL.

1-6, 2 pts, 10 GF. That's the 2nd lowest GPG output in the NHL (yup - Buffalo is worse).

You know what that means?

It's PANIC TIME! Gear up for your annual Flyers panic trade!

We've all seen the rumours linking the Flyers to either the Oilers or Sabres.

Couturier, Coburn and a 2nd for Vanek (I'm not kidding, that's what was "reported")

Simmonds, Coburn, and Couturier or Laughton for Yakupov and Hemsky.

Stay tuned for more information as the Flyers go for the trifecta in one single NHL season!

Fire coach - check!

Change goalies - check!

Blockbuster trade - stay tuned!

We won't even mention the possibility of the Trifecta + 1... we wouldn't want to jinx it!

Oh hell, we'll mention it anyway!

Fire the GM - stay tuned!

[SwedeFly]

So true... It will happen.

It's unfortunate that the Flyers culture is always about creating the illusion of wanting to win.... instead of actually stepping back, being patient, and putting an actual plan in place that enables these players and this team to succeed.

[radoran]

So true... It will happen.

It's unfortunate that the Flyers culture is always about creating the illusion of wanting to win.... instead of actually stepping back, being patient, and putting an actual plan in place that enables these players and this team to succeed.

 

But there is no actual plan that can win on a regular basis, so there's no point in following one. You just throw a whole bunch of things together, try to make the playoffs and then "anything can happen."

 

[canoli]

Trade Couturier. Brilliant. Just as he's beginning to figure out the NHL. His FO% has been over 50% every game except last night, the only Flyer except LeCav to be over 50%. Couturier's contribution is overlooked by casual fans and by many dedicated fans too. Who cares. But if it's overlooked or minimized by the Flyers' brass and he gets moved for anything less than a top prospect...

 

Trade Simmonds. Another bright idea. The one guy besides Rinaldo who goes all out every shift. He may never be top-line material but he's no dime-a-dozen player either. He has tremendous value to a struggling team like the Flyers imho, even more than he would on a good team right now.

 

So yes, by all means let's trade our guys who haven't even begun to reach their potential just so we can rent Vanek for a season...because obviously the Flyers are only 1-piece away from being one of the favorites to win the Cup this year.

 

Yeah. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

[brelic]

But there is no actual plan that can win on a regular basis, so there's no point in following one. You just throw a whole bunch of things together, try to make the playoffs and then "anything can happen."

 

But don't forget to flip the switch!

[brelic]

So yes, by all means let's trade our guys who haven't even begun to reach their potential just so we can rent Vanek for a season...because obviously the Flyers are only 1-piece away from being one of the favorites to win the Cup this year.

I agree. Trading for Vanek would be foolish for a number of reasons.

1) He's 29. We need someone younger who can grow with Giroux.

2) He's gonna want $7M+

3) He's rumoured to be favouring Minnesota as a UFA after the season.

It would be a waste of perfectly good resources, IMO.

But... what about Yakupov? This guy is a world class talent. 1st overall pick. Natural sniper. Just turned 20. Has intense passion for the game, kinda like Ovechkin. Has been labeled as a guy who won't backcheck. His agent has floated threats that he could seek to go back to the KHL.

Is he the next Ovechkin / Kovalchuk? Or the next Zherdev / Radulov?

[canoli]

yep exactly - who knows who he'll resemble the most in 5 years? No one. And if he's another Ovechkin is that *really* a good thing for the Flyers? I know it's good for the NHL and for Russia.

 

I just see NO point whatsoever in trading Couturier. He already is a blue-chip prospect who's coming along perfectly well, in some respects better than forecasted. Correct me if I'm wrong but he wasn't supposed to be such a strong defensive forward; originally I thought everyone was projecting big offensive numbers.

 

edit: In any case can we start sticking with our young players more than fkng 2 seasons? It seems so dumb to draft a couple great young guys and then trade them for some other (probably) great young guys.

Edited October 16, 2013 by canoli

[brelic]

I just see NO point whatsoever in trading Couturier.

I see it from the perspective that Homer has committed to Lecavalier for 5 years, and if we keep Schenn (and want him to develop as a center), then it would make sense to move Couturier, especially when we have Laughton who could come in and do a similar job on the 3rd line. If you don't move COuturier, you probably have to look at moving Laughton at some point.

Looking at it purely from a Couturier vs. Yakupov equation, I would take Yakupov. He offers more of what we need (top young talent, sniper, winger) than Couturier.

I would not trade Couturier (or any young player, really) for Vanek. He's not what we need (older, very expensive).

[Mad Dog]

The team looks lost.  But trading Couturier or just about anybody else for Vanek will hardly resolve the issue.  The troubling part is, this is *exactly* the type of deal Snider and Homer will pull.  They are hopeless. 

[canoli]

I am afraid you are right MD. Especially if we win a few games - or maybe just beating Pitt tomorrow night will be enough. Homer/Snider will see that as major improvement and they'll want Vanek so bad - with Vinny out we "need" a scoring forward - (never mind he's only out for a handful of games) - that they'll trade Couturier or Laughton or whoever, some young guy who's got potential.

[fanaticV3.0]

Trade Couturier. Brilliant. Just as he's beginning to figure out the NHL. His FO% has been over 50% every game except last night, the only Flyer except LeCav to be over 50%. Couturier's contribution is overlooked by casual fans and by many dedicated fans too. Who cares. But if it's overlooked or minimized by the Flyers' brass and he gets moved for anything less than a top prospect...

 

Trade Simmonds. Another bright idea. The one guy besides Rinaldo who goes all out every shift. He may never be top-line material but he's no dime-a-dozen player either. He has tremendous value to a struggling team like the Flyers imho, even more than he would on a good team right now.

 

So yes, by all means let's trade our guys who haven't even begun to reach their potential just so we can rent Vanek for a season...because obviously the Flyers are only 1-piece away from being one of the favorites to win the Cup this year.

 

Yeah. Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

 

If it was for someone young or picks, I wouldn't have a problem with it. He's young enough that you could still trade him based on potential and he might actually net you a nice return. If the goal is to build the team around Giroux, maybe they should get someone who could actually play with him; which Couturier ain't doing as a third line center. Of all the young guys on the team right now, he's actually the one I'd be willing to part with. I wouldn't trade Schenn - who looks like he's growing a bit - Giroux, Voracek, or Simmonds.

[TimKerrFan12]

Let's not panic.  Just play out the season and take our well deserved 1st overall lottery pick.   Then get ready for our 1st pick the following season where we will get stud McDavid. <_<  

[radoran]

Let's not panic.  Just play out the season and take our well deserved 1st overall lottery pick.   Then get ready for our 1st pick the following season where we will get stud McDavid. <_<  

 

Patrick Kane says "hello"

 

No guarantee of 1st overall.

[Poulin20]

Well at least if we finish dead last, at the draft we will safely be able to say that we are the team with the most balls!

 

 

Speaking of the draft next year it is in Philly at least it should be exciting as we will be gunning for good players who will not be traded for 3 years or so....

Edited October 16, 2013 by Poulin20

[Lindbergh31]

Ok. Flyers are officially dead last in the NHL.

1-6, 2 pts, 10 GF. That's the 2nd lowest GPG output in the NHL (yup - Buffalo is worse).

You know what that means?

It's PANIC TIME! Gear up for your annual Flyers panic trade!

We've all seen the rumours linking the Flyers to either the Oilers or Sabres.

Couturier, Coburn and a 2nd for Vanek (I'm not kidding, that's what was "reported")

Simmonds, Coburn, and Couturier or Laughton for Yakupov and Hemsky.

Stay tuned for more information as the Flyers go for the trifecta in one single NHL season!

Fire coach - check!

Change goalies - check!

Blockbuster trade - stay tuned!

We won't even mention the possibility of the Trifecta + 1... we wouldn't want to jinx it!

Oh hell, we'll mention it anyway!

Fire the GM - stay tuned!

Memories of the 2006/07 season when Hitchcock got replaced and Clarke stepped down. Now that Lavi got replaced hopefully this means that Holmgren will follow what Clarke did back then and step down. Let's see what Hexie can do as a GM because he can't be any worse than Holmgren. I would rather see that before Holmgren starts making panic moves and the Flyers give away young players for some more quick fixes.

[brelic]

Let's see what Homer can do as a GM because he can't be any worse than Clarke.

I fixed it for you

[Lindbergh31]

I fixed it for you

Thanks

[fan4ever]

Well at least if we finish dead last, at the draft we will safely be able to say that we are the team with the most balls!

 

 

Speaking of the draft next year it is in Philly at least it should be exciting as we will be gunning for good players who will not be traded for 3 years or so....

 

Nice balls comment!!!

[TimKerrFan12]

C'mon folks. I think we all secretly enjoy losing to a certain extent. Part of us, or me, loves to pick things apart, analyze things, rip a new arse in Flyers Management or just complain in general. Its kind of a bonding experience for all of us. I love you guys! :0)

Edited October 16, 2013 by TimKerrFan12

[canoli]

If it was for someone young or picks, I wouldn't have a problem with it. He's young enough that you could still trade him based on potential and he might actually net you a nice return. If the goal is to build the team around Giroux, maybe they should get someone who could actually play with him; which Couturier ain't doing as a third line center. Of all the young guys on the team right now, he's actually the one I'd be willing to part with. I wouldn't trade Schenn - who looks like he's growing a bit - Giroux, Voracek, or Simmonds.

 

 

If the goal is to build the team around Giroux then Giroux had better start playing like he's a guy that can carry an NHL team. Awesome, epic, "historic" shifts aside he's not shown much since that Pitt series. I understand a lot of stuff has happened in between, things he couldn't control so I'm not "down on him" or anything, I know he's got the potential to get back into form...but I hope it happens soon. Otherwise maybe we should give up the idea of building around a forward once and for all and let's concentrate on what actually wins championships: goaltending and defense.

 

As far as Couturier I'd encourage you to read this article from Meltzer. He wrote it just after last season. It'll likely be an eye-opener because Meltzer uses some rarely-quoted (and under-appreciated) stats, specifically the stats about Couturier's shifts  - where he starts them, where he finishes, what happened, etc. - to make his points.

 

I hope you read it; I'd be interested to hear what you think.

 

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=52052#.Ul_kHRCIR8E

[mojo1917]

@canoli

 

I read that article over the summer. Pete repeatedly dumped 14  into some seriously shitty situations and he held his own more often than not.

patience is not a virtue of this fanbase... we come by it honestly though since the team's owner has the patience  of a 3 year old girl.

Soon we'll have Thomas Vanek though and Couterier won't be our problem until the playoffs.

Edited October 17, 2013 by mojo1917

[brelic]

If the goal is to build the team around Giroux then Giroux had better start playing like he's a guy that can carry an NHL team. Awesome, epic, "historic" shifts aside he's not shown much since that Pitt series.

Well, he *did* put up 47 pts in 48 games last year. He had a slow start, but picked it up the rest of the way. He can tighten up other parts of his game, sure, but he's doing what a first line center is supposed to do - create offense. Now, this year is slow (to be generous, haha), but the whole team is slow, and as the leader, it's on him to try and get his team going. I'm sure he'll bounce back (even if it's an off year). He's 25 and we know what he can do.

As far as Couturier I'd encourage you to read this article from Meltzer. He wrote it just after last season. It'll likely be an eye-opener because Meltzer uses some rarely-quoted (and under-appreciated) stats, specifically the stats about Couturier's shifts  - where he starts them, where he finishes, what happened, etc. - to make his points.

I read the article when it came out. I like Couturier. He's only 20 and we've just scratched the surface with him in terms of his development. That being said, center is a position of strength for the Flyers, and wing is a position of weakness system-wide. So if you can get a young winger for your young center, and both are high draft picks, why not do it? Every team needs guys like Couturier, but every team also needs guys like Yakupov, which we don't have. Voracek is more of a playmaker... we need a pure goal scoring sniper on the top line. Not Hartnell and Simmonds. You know, Leclair and Lindros, Gagne and Forsberg, Backstrom and Ovechkin, Crosby and Kunitz, Kane and Toews, Giroux and ?

If Vanek were 3-4 years younger, I guess it would make more sense.

[fanaticV3.0]

If the goal is to build the team around Giroux then Giroux had better start playing like he's a guy that can carry an NHL team. Awesome, epic, "historic" shifts aside he's not shown much since that Pitt series. I understand a lot of stuff has happened in between, things he couldn't control so I'm not "down on him" or anything, I know he's got the potential to get back into form...but I hope it happens soon. Otherwise maybe we should give up the idea of building around a forward once and for all and let's concentrate on what actually wins championships: goaltending and defense.

 

As far as Couturier I'd encourage you to read this article from Meltzer. He wrote it just after last season. It'll likely be an eye-opener because Meltzer uses some rarely-quoted (and under-appreciated) stats, specifically the stats about Couturier's shifts  - where he starts them, where he finishes, what happened, etc. - to make his points.

 

I hope you read it; I'd be interested to hear what you think.

 

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=52052#.Ul_kHRCIR8E

 

Oh I'm down on Giroux. I can openly admit that. The dude is not delivering. I have no idea what's wrong with him. I'm actually hoping he's hurt.

 

If they were to trade Couturier and there was a purpose to it, I would be 100% ok with that. I'm not in a rush to get rid of him and I'm not trading him for a bag of pucks. If he turns into a 45-50 point guy who was a Selke candidate, I would be just fine with that. I realize he is very young, but a 27 game goalless streak? That's terrible for a kid drafted where he was. Guys drafted that high have to show something.

[JackStraw]

But don't forget to flip the switch!

 

Time to push the little red button...

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ldTjXFlWtkM#t=15

Edited October 17, 2013 by JackStraw

[fanaticV3.0]

Well, he *did* put up 47 pts in 48 games last year. He had a slow start, but picked it up the rest of the way. He can tighten up other parts of his game, sure, but he's doing what a first line center is supposed to do - create offense. Now, this year is slow (to be generous, haha), but the whole team is slow, and as the leader, it's on him to try and get his team going. I'm sure he'll bounce back (even if it's an off year). He's 25 and we know what he can do.

I read the article when it came out. I like Couturier. He's only 20 and we've just scratched the surface with him in terms of his development. That being said, center is a position of strength for the Flyers, and wing is a position of weakness system-wide. So if you can get a young winger for your young center, and both are high draft picks, why not do it? Every team needs guys like Couturier, but every team also needs guys like Yakupov, which we don't have. Voracek is more of a playmaker... we need a pure goal scoring sniper on the top line. Not Hartnell and Simmonds. You know, Leclair and Lindros, Gagne and Forsberg, Backstrom and Ovechkin, Crosby and Kunitz, Kane and Toews, Giroux and ?

If Vanek were 3-4 years younger, I guess it would make more sense.

 

I didn't pay a ton of attention last year. I hate shortened seasons. They just feel tainted to me. I would flick games off and on in between watching stuff, rather than watch the whole thing. I still paid attention via talk radio a lot too. One thing I noticed is a few people saying how much he has dropped off. How he is still good, but not as good as before. The same radio hosts still stay the same thing today. So I go and look at his stats for last year (literally, just did it right now), and I'm like WTF? I agree he started off pretty badly last year and looks like ass again now, but how much he's "dropped off" has been a little overstated lately.