nossagog Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Okay, I'm still kind of scratching my head on Fleury starting game 5. The "Pundits" on NBC were touting that there's a goalie controversy after game 4 and that Fleury had to start. I thought it was crap, how can you bench the guy who got you to this point for one iffy game, with goals that were not his fault. I didn't really like the move, going with a very cold goalie in a very key game. Could Murray have done better? Who knows. But Sully has now created a problem, had a confident goalie he benched and put in a goalie who has been fragile in the past, and he loses. I wonder what Fleury's mind is like today? Anyway I'm just wondering, in its own thread, what would you have done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I said in the other thread I think Murray may have hit a wall. I'd still trust him over Fleury in a big playoff game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 @nossagog I saw two of the goals against and I had no problem with either. the first was an absolute laser off Kilhorn's stick the second was a nice feed to Kutcherov that he has to finish and Fluery almost got to it... I did not see goals 3 and 4 though. I think Jeremy Roenick is a douche, I wouldn't have put either of those goals on Fluery. Sometimes an NHL player makes a play and that's how i look at the Kilhorn goal, that was a "perfect" shot. Fluery made some pretty nice stops in that period included robbing Johnson on the Powerplay, I don't think Murray makes that save. I also would think that Coach Sullivan knows Murray from Scranton and isn't guessing with him, I think the media needs something to talk about, and this is it... So like I said, i didn't see goals 3 and 4 but 1 and 2 weren't bad goals IMO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I really question why you would start Flower over Murray honestly. One questionable start and he gets yanked in net for the veteran. I would have went with Murray to see if ghe rebounds, and to me, he deserves the benefit of the doubt based on his prior play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 So I can't put any of those goals on Fluery. The 2nd Kutcherov goal was almost as fast as the Kunitz goal, there's really no stopping that, it was good fortune the puck ended up on his stick when it did...and the Johnson goal was unstoppable too...I don't think Fluery played poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nossagog Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 Just saw a replay of the last one, puck going wide, bounce of Johnson's back. jeez, but that's how you win games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nossagog Posted May 23, 2016 Author Share Posted May 23, 2016 55 minutes ago, mojo1917 said: @nossagog I saw two of the goals against and I had no problem with either. the first was an absolute laser off Kilhorn's stick the second was a nice feed to Kutcherov that he has to finish and Fluery almost got to it... I did not see goals 3 and 4 though. I think Jeremy Roenick is a douche, I wouldn't have put either of those goals on Fluery. Sometimes an NHL player makes a play and that's how i look at the Kilhorn goal, that was a "perfect" shot. Fluery made some pretty nice stops in that period included robbing Johnson on the Powerplay, I don't think Murray makes that save. I also would think that Coach Sullivan knows Murray from Scranton and isn't guessing with him, I think the media needs something to talk about, and this is it... So like I said, i didn't see goals 3 and 4 but 1 and 2 weren't bad goals IMO My problem with the first one is the general Fleury/Butterfly goalie problem. Just Stand Up! and you make that save off your chest. Go down in the butterfly, and it goes over the shoulder. Same butterfly issue with the Kucherov goal, already on the ice, can't recover in time for the wraparound. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I agree with everyone. I can't fault Fleury on any of those goals but I still would have gone with Murray. At this point you have to at least worry a little about Fleury's mental state even though you can't pin this loss on him. Perfect example - if Tampe gets a quick fluky goal in Game 6 I trust Murray to respond better than Fleury. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 That OT goal wasn't Fleurys fault. Most of the bad goals in big games aren't.....they just happen to go in when he's in net. Going all the way back to junior. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 So, going back to the other post on the Pens board - does this mean Murray is not the end of Flower? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severide Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Personally, I think Fluery was at fault on the tying goal. I think fatigue was a large factor! It is one of those goals that most goalies would have gotten, once the know the puck is behind the net they are either on the post or making and effort to get to the post. By the time Fluery actually moved and reacted, the puck was already 2cm for going in and he was about 6+ inches from the post. A fresh goalie in net that has play all the games up to that would have made that save. I think the pens made a huge mistake putting Fluery in the net for the start of game 5. Murray has been their rock all playoffs and you yanked him for one bad game. Maybe they should start him in game 6 because he might just steal a win by proving a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 minutes ago, Flyersaremykindofjoke said: Personally, I think Fluery was at fault on the final goal. I think fatigue was a large factor! It is one of those goals that most goalies would have gotten, once the know the puck is behind the net they are either on the post or making and effort to get to the post. By the time Fluery actually moved and reacted, the puck was already 2cm for going in and he was about 6+ inches from the post. A fresh goalie in net that has play all the games up to that would have made that save. I think the pens made a huge mistake putting Fluery in the net for the start of game 5. Murray has been their rock all playoffs and you yanked him for one bad game. Maybe they should start him in game 6 because he might just steal a win by proving a point. What ? the final goal was a deflection off Johnson's back, :59 seconds into overtime. Not one bit of what your saying matches up with what happened. Now if you're talking the goal with around 3 minutes left, I still disagree. Watch that play in real time and tell me he was slow and be honest. He blocked the puck into what should have been the corner but...bad luck, it winds up right on Kucherov's blade....there isn't a human alive that could get to the far post in time to stop that, especially after pushing out to block the puck to corner where he had support. It was not as much of a bang bang play that Kunitz goal was, but it was close. I saw that goal differently from you for sure. I don't know how I feel about starting Fluery though, I can really see both sides of the conversation. I voted to start him but could have just as easily went with Murray. I keep going back to the thought that Sullivan had Murray in Wilkes-Barre and he know's when the kid needs a break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Severide Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 1 minute ago, mojo1917 said: What ? the final goal was a deflection off Johnson's back, :59 seconds into overtime. Not one bit of what your saying matches up with what happened. Now if you're talking the goal with around 3 minutes left, I still disagree. Watch that play in real time and tell me he was slow and be honest. He blocked the puck into what should have been the corner but...bad luck, it winds up right on Kucherov's blade....there isn't a human alive that could get to the far post in time to stop that, especially after pushing out to block the puck to corner where he had support. It was not as much of a bang bang play that Kunitz goal was, but it was close. I saw that goal differently from you for sure. I don't know how I feel about starting Fluery though, I can really see both sides of the conversation. I voted to start him but could have just as easily went with Murray. I keep going back to the thought that Sullivan had Murray in Wilkes-Barre and he know's when the kid needs a break. Meant the tying goal. I watched the entire game, he was slow. I have seen NHL goalies including MAF get to that post in closer situations and make that save time and time again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 3 hours ago, nossagog said: I didn't really like the move, going with a very cold goalie in a very key game Very odd indeed. I was shocked the Pens went with MAF. Totally agree with your assessment. Though you can't fault MAF for the OT goal deflected off the Tampa players back. The BIGGER question is who do you start for game #6??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notfondajane Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 He may wanted to rest Murray and to see what Fleury would do! Now go back to Murray or start Zatkoff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 30 minutes ago, notfondajane said: start Zatkoff! that would be the wrong thing to do....starting a very cold goalie. Especially in a must win situation....there is no way the Pens coaching staff is that stupid. I cannot think of a valid reason why Zatkoff would be in net instead of Murray or MAF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 Just now, pilldoc said: that would be the wrong thing to do....starting a very cold goalie. Especially in a must win situation....there is no way the Pens coaching staff is that stupid. I cannot think of a valid reason why Zatkoff would be in net instead of Murray or MAF. Primarily because @notfondajane would probably start you over Fleury Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 24 minutes ago, pilldoc said: that would be the wrong thing to do....starting a very cold goalie. Especially in a must win situation....there is no way the Pens coaching staff is that stupid. I cannot think of a valid reason why Zatkoff would be in net instead of Murray or MAF. I would certainly start Zatkoff if I was coaching the Pens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaGreatGazoo Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 38 minutes ago, AJgoal said: I would certainly start Zatkoff if I was coaching the Pens. I would just play with 6 skaters the entire game if I were the Pens coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pilldoc Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 58 minutes ago, AJgoal said: I would certainly start Zatkoff if I was coaching the Pens. So would I (insert evil grin here) However I was at least "trying" to look at it through the Pens perspective... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruxpin Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 I would have gone with Murray but could argue this either way. I'm glad I'm not the one had to make that call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B21 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 2 hours ago, radoran said: Primarily because @notfondajane would probably start you over Fleury I think he would start Jane Fonda over Fleury and we know he's "not fonda" her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Polaris922 Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 6 hours ago, Flyersaremykindofjoke said: Meant the tying goal. I watched the entire game, he was slow. I have seen NHL goalies including MAF get to that post in closer situations and make that save time and time again. May the speed that play happened? Not a single goalie in the league stops that puck. Your average wrap around sure, but that puck is on Kucherov's stick the second he stops the first shot. That's just the bounce he got. No goalie stops that puck. It's already two feet around the net before Fleury is even upright again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyercanuck Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 4 hours ago, AJgoal said: I would certainly start Zatkoff if I was coaching the Pens. Come on, there's only one team in Pennsylvania the world who would start THREE goalies in one playoff! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted May 23, 2016 Share Posted May 23, 2016 29 minutes ago, flyercanuck said: Come on, there's only one team in Pennsylvania the world who would start THREE goalies in one playoff! Right, it's not like they haven't already done it this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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