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RonJeremy

Trouba signed for 8million for 7 years..what do we pay Provorov

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21 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

I like Cleveland.

Very cool food scene, gothic architecture from the 20's and 30's but updated on the inside. Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, the area by the Quicken loans arena has great bars and restaurants and is walk-able. 

It gets a bad rap because asshat WC Fields once said something about it and then the ****** lake caught fire because it was so polluted, but that was a long ass time ago.  

There are worse cities than Cleveland- believe me. 

Lol way to ruin a cheap joke. 

 

#CrisisActor 

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@TropicalFruitGirl26

@ruxpin

 

One word guys. Atlanta, it's the "new Cleveland".

Aside from Coca-Cola, Jimmy Carter's park, Sevendust and MLK...it's awful.

 

It's hot as hell there, humid too, traffic is bonkers, even when there's "no traffic" you're still sitting in traffic.

It is huge, and not very walkable, but since it's so hot when it is walkable... you arrive needing a shower. 

Hartsdale-Jackson.

Lots of sports teams, not much winning. 

Did I mention it's hotter than hell there ?  The green spaces (which are nice) are actually voluntary torture pits. So fun for the BDSM crowd I suppose. 

Food's good, Better, if you like traditional southern food- which i'm lukewarm to-  for example sweet tea and grits I find gross, collared greens...? they're a-okay. 

 

Atlanta, it sucks today the way Cleveland did 30 years ago...I submitted it to the Chamber of Commerce- still waiting to hear back.

 

 

 

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59 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

@TropicalFruitGirl26

@ruxpin

 

One word guys. Atlanta, it's the "new Cleveland".

Aside from Coca-Cola, Jimmy Carter's park, Sevendust and MLK...it's awful.

 

It's hot as hell there, humid too, traffic is bonkers, even when there's "no traffic" you're still sitting in traffic.

It is huge, and not very walkable, but since it's so hot when it is walkable... you arrive needing a shower. 

Hartsdale-Jackson.

Lots of sports teams, not much winning. 

Did I mention it's hotter than hell there ?  The green spaces (which are nice) are actually voluntary torture pits. So fun for the BDSM crowd I suppose. 

Food's good, Better, if you like traditional southern food- which i'm lukewarm to-  for example sweet tea and grits I find gross, collared greens...? they're a-okay. 

 

Atlanta, it sucks today the way Cleveland did 30 years ago...I submitted it to the Chamber of Commerce- still waiting to hear back.

 

 

 

 

I wish I could completely agree but I have never been to Cleveland nor do I really want to.

 

So i will have to take your opinion on this because Atlanta sucks just like you said.

 

The only good thing I know about it is that they film the Walking Dead and Stranger Things down there. And I'm sure much more that I am not aware gets filmed there.

 

So that is all I got on those two.

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@mojo1917

 

I'm just messin.
Never visited Cleveland...……...just seemed like the right place to internet bully on... :eyeroll:

 

My apologies for derailing the topic.

Honestly, may take on Provorov?

If he is staying with the Flyers, I don't expect a deal like Trouba's.  Their situations are much too different.
Comparisons between Provy and Serge on the Lightning are more accurate, and some within the TB fanbase figure Serge to get some sort of bridge deal worth about 2-3M per.....but since Provorov has actually been thrust into a more major role on the Flyers than Sergachev has on the Lightning, then I think a fair deal for a defenseman of Provorov's experience would be something in the neighborhood of 4-5M per.

And that is NOT saying Trouba is "better" than Provorov. 
I think we've all been around sports long enough to know that payscale doesn't necessarily equate to greater talent....usually about timing and team desperation...……..and let's face it, although I do believe the Rangers' rebuild is accelerating nicely, they DID seem desperate to get that young defenseman signed long term and didn't blink twice about giving Trouba what they did.

Flyers have been building a bit more steadily, less desperate (at least it appears that way), and I think they and Provorov's camp can come to a reasonable amount that will be fair, yet allow the team cap flexibility moving forward in order to ice a winner year after year.

So, yea...thinking something between 4 and 5 mil....perhaps on a shorter deal...before he sees that big 6M+ contract.

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16 minutes ago, TropicalFruitGirl26 said:

My apologies for derailing the topic.

Actually that was me.

 

Provorov ?

I think he's good enough to warrant a lot of money and a lot of term.

Of all the guys to back the Comcast money truck up to...- he's the guy you do that for.

 

I think a shorter deal for less $ means less Ivan Provorov playing for the Flyers, which I don't like the though of.

So I can totally see 5 years, 5.5 to 7 AAV being bandied about, I don't think I'll sh!t a twinkie thinking about that deal either.

 

In 5 years, I'm pretty sure one of Ginning, York or St Ivanny will be knocking at the door looking for more responsibility and having the ability to accept it. Watching York on team USA, makes me think we might have another really really solid top pairing guy. He's always around the good stuff, always seems to have the puck on his stick on the exit...I think he was a strong pick. Having a pretty decent cadre of young guys in the system eases some of the pressure to lock Ivan up long term. If he wants 11 million on the next contract we'll have a guy to backfill who is nearly as good, maybe even grow to be better.

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Posted (edited)

So are we thinking the Trouba deal is the ceiling for what Provorov would get?  I get that the dynamics are different, e.g., Trouba had leverage in that he was arbitration eligible and one year removed from UFA.  Provorov doesn't have that leverage (and neither do Werenski or McAvoy). 

 

Honestly, but for last year, I think Provorov has better argument stats-wise than Trouba.  Certainly Werenski has better stats.  In any event, I'm not sure Trouba sets the market, per se, but his deal is a data point.  Still need to see what Werenski and McAvoy do.  I think Werenski and CBJ are probably arguing over term, with CBJ wanting a longer deal and Werenski wanting a shorter deal that brings him to UFA.  McAvoy's deal probably gets a bridge, but the $$$ probably depends on what Werenski gets.  Provorov probably slots somewhere between Werenski and McAvoy.  I really think Provorov's deal is a hostage of the other two deals. 

 

All that said, I'd be comfortable giving Provorov Trouba's deal.  The only issue is what does that leave for Konency and how much cap space will they have after signing him?  Rather not see him get a bridge.  I still think a d-man gets moved at some point, which could free up some cash, assuming they don't take back salary.

Edited by vis

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In the words of Teddy "KGB"....

tGf-Oxm.jpg

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1 hour ago, vis said:

Honestly, but for last year, I think Provorov has better argument stats-wise than Trouba. 

 

Yeah, I agree. Honestly that deal for Trouba looks like a nasty overpayment based on just his last year of play. That kind of thing is dangerous.

 

Not that he's bad, I'm just always wary of paying a guy who may possibly be coming off a career year at the value of just that one year, especially when his past history doesn't match up.

 

Provo imo has higher potential than Trouba. But he had a down year, which we may all want to be thankful for. Had he continued to progress closer to his ceiling, we'd be in much worse right now... 

 

Fletch needs to lock him down to some solid term. Period. The complicating factor of course is TK also needs a contract and is in line for a nice bump. It's unfortunate timing.

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2 hours ago, elmatus said:

 

Yeah, I agree. Honestly that deal for Trouba looks like a nasty overpayment based on just his last year of play. That kind of thing is dangerous.

He's also been a "name" for a while.  I agree that it sounds like an overpayment as well.

 

2 hours ago, elmatus said:

Provo imo has higher potential than Trouba.

Agree.

 

2 hours ago, elmatus said:

Fletch needs to lock him down to some solid term. Period. The complicating factor of course is TK also needs a contract and is in line for a nice bump. It's unfortunate timing.

I think they can do both on longer term deals, but they will have to move a least a little bit of money to make TK work and have some flexibility under the cap.  Capfriendly has them with $13.4m in cap space.  Assuming Provorov gets $7.5-$8m max (more money for more term), that leaves $5-$6m for Konecny, which should be enough for a relatively longer team deal (i.e., more than 2 years; not sure if more than 5 years).  But that leaves them with no flexibility this year.  Even trading Hagg would help things.

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2 hours ago, vis said:

Capfriendly has them with $13.4m in cap space.  Assuming Provorov gets $7.5-$8m max (more money for more term), that leaves $5-$6m for Konecny, which should be enough for a relatively longer team deal (i.e., more than 2 years; not sure if more than 5 years).  But that leaves them with no flexibility this year.

 

It also leaves them with

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* as a top 12 forward. And only 12 forwards.

 

They will need some wiggle room to work in a Frost or Farabee, for example.

 

Would not at all be surprised if Hagg is moved sometime between now and the trade deadline, but perhaps sooner than later.

 

 

 

* yeah, not what I pictured, either...

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1 hour ago, radoran said:

 

It also leaves them with

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* as a top 12 forward. And only 12 forwards.

 

They will need some wiggle room to work in a Frost or Farabee, for example.

 

Would not at all be surprised if Hagg is moved sometime between now and the trade deadline, but perhaps sooner than later.

 

 

 

* yeah, not what I pictured, either...

 

Ahhh…."The Kurtis"..

Another in what is looking like a long line of former Fletcher Wilds.

Well, in his defense (not that he particularly plays any) he will provide ruggedness......usually.....sometimes.
ok, ok...no one will mistake him for Wayne Simmonds, but umm...well, he is a big body, and he is somewhat tough...and hits a bit.

Yea, that's it. 
There ya go.
You NOW know all there is to know about him.  :)

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, radoran said:

 

It also leaves them with

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* as a top 12 forward. And only 12 forwards.

 

They will need some wiggle room to work in a Frost or Farabee, for example.

 

Would not at all be surprised if Hagg is moved sometime between now and the trade deadline, but perhaps sooner than later.

 

 

 

* yeah, not what I pictured, either...

 

 

I wouldn't worry about Gabriel he will be a Phantom before the season starts.

 

Edit: Not that you're losing sleep over Kurtis friggin Gabriel...

Edited by OccamsRazor
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12 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

@TropicalFruitGirl26

@ruxpin

 

One word guys. Atlanta, it's the "new Cleveland".

Aside from Coca-Cola, Jimmy Carter's park, Sevendust and MLK...it's awful.

 

It's hot as hell there, humid too, traffic is bonkers, even when there's "no traffic" you're still sitting in traffic.

It is huge, and not very walkable, but since it's so hot when it is walkable... you arrive needing a shower. 

Hartsdale-Jackson.

Lots of sports teams, not much winning. 

Did I mention it's hotter than hell there ?  The green spaces (which are nice) are actually voluntary torture pits. So fun for the BDSM crowd I suppose. 

Food's good, Better, if you like traditional southern food- which i'm lukewarm to-  for example sweet tea and grits I find gross, collared greens...? they're a-okay. 

 

Atlanta, it sucks today the way Cleveland did 30 years ago...I submitted it to the Chamber of Commerce- still waiting to hear back.

 

If what you say is true, why are people still moving there? It has two of the best Universities in the country, Emory and Georgia Tech, along with a number of other highly regarded colleges and universities. It's a nicely integrated city. It's offered African-Americans a beacon  to escape the oppression  of the "Old" South. 57% of the population of Atlanta were born north of the Mason-Dixon Line, and more people are moving in every day. Its a big city with big city problems, but it's no worse and probably better than many American cities!

 

 

 

 

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4 hours ago, radoran said:

 

It also leaves them with

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* as a top 12 forward. And only 12 forwards.

 

They will need some wiggle room to work in a Frost or Farabee, for example.

 

Would not at all be surprised if Hagg is moved sometime between now and the trade deadline, but perhaps sooner than later.

 

 

 

* yeah, not what I pictured, either...

Ah, ****.  Didn't realize they only have 12 forwards.  That does kind of screw things up, doesn't it?

 

If they trade Hagg, I'm still not sure that leaves them enough flexibility, unless Provorov and Konecny sign for a little less than what I was suggesting above.  

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1 hour ago, vis said:

Ah, ****.  Didn't realize they only have 12 forwards.  That does kind of screw things up, doesn't it?

 

If they trade Hagg, I'm still not sure that leaves them enough flexibility, unless Provorov and Konecny sign for a little less than what I was suggesting above.  

 

It's nitpicking a bit, but when you give an extra $500K here and $250K there sooner or later you're talking about real money...

 

👺

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2 hours ago, vis said:

Ah, ****.  Didn't realize they only have 12 forwards.  That does kind of screw things up, doesn't it?

 

If they trade Hagg, I'm still not sure that leaves them enough flexibility, unless Provorov and Konecny sign for a little less than what I was suggesting above.  

 

All they have to do is waive Gabriel and Lyon to the Phantoms and they free up 1.4 mill and either NAK or a kid can plug the 12th forward 3rd line RW spot.

 

I think Ivan gets a 3 year deal 5mill 6mill 7 mill with a 6mill AAV.

 

TK get a 3 year 14 deal 4.6 AAV.

 

That would leave them wih 4.2 mill left.

 

 

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8 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

All they have to do is waive Gabriel and Lyon to the Phantoms

 

Lyon isn't on the

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.

 

8 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

either NAK or a kid can plug the 12th forward 3rd line RW spot. 

 

NAK's cap hit is that same as Gabriel's.

 

8 hours ago, OccamsRazor said:

I think Ivan gets a 3 year deal 5mill 6mill 7 mill with a 6mill AAV.

 

TK get a 3 year 14 deal 4.6 AAV.

 

That would leave them wih 4.2 mill left.

 

capfriendly has them at $13.4, so they would have $2.8M left after those deals which is a nice pad for adding a Frost or Farabee, for example, and still having some wiggle room.

 

Provie gets $7M and KNX gets $5M and it starts to tighten up a bit - but still doable.

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1 hour ago, radoran said:

NAK's cap hit is that same as Gabriel's.

 

Yeah I'm not worried about their salaries I'm worried about one not surviving waivers to be sent down and NAK won't and Gabriel will.

 

NAK will be claimed put on someone's active roster I know it.

 

Because if the player is claimed they can't be sent down for 30 days and they will have to go through waivers again.

 

Ain't noone going to claim Gabriel.

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13 hours ago, Lunatic said:

 

 

I don't know what this whole conversation is about at all, but I do know that Atlanta is kind of thriving right now.

 

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Posted (edited)

@Lunatic

 That's a good question. What you typed is true.  Like I said there are some nice things in Atl the MLK trail is very cool  and I've been to the part of town where Emory and the CDC are and it is nice. I've been to the suburbs and the downtown and they were as you said just like any other city- The Emory section of town is spread out though and not very walk-able with the heat. 

I just got back from San Antonio, I'd move there in a heart beat, I would never think to move to Atlanta. Way better experience for me. Maybe every time I've been to the Atl it was a "bad" time to be there. 

 

Edited by mojo1917

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    • 2
      Post
      Not saying Trouba is better, he has just been in the league longer, so I figured if he got that amount , Provy would get a bit less since he has hasn’t been around as long . If last season,   Provy had a similar season to his second year , we would be looking at 8 million.
    • 2
      Post
      I would prefer the 8 year deal but the short 6.5mill deal will be the easiest to hammer out.
    • 2
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      Not sure how you can say that Provorov even with a down year put up 97 points in his first three years....and 17 goals his 2nd year.   Trouba put up 72 and hasn't even sniffed double digit goals since his rookie year which was just 10.   Sorry call me a homer if you like but Provorov is the better overall defenseman when talking about the two....and I think his has a higher offensive upside than Trouba.   And I know he is better at defense.   The Rangers a
    • 2
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      Lol way to ruin a cheap joke.    #CrisisActor 
    • 2
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      @TropicalFruitGirl26 @ruxpin   One word guys. Atlanta, it's the "new Cleveland". Aside from Coca-Cola, Jimmy Carter's park, Sevendust and MLK...it's awful.   It's hot as hell there, humid too, traffic is bonkers, even when there's "no traffic" you're still sitting in traffic. It is huge, and not very walkable, but since it's so hot when it is walkable... you arrive needing a shower.  Hartsdale-Jackson. Lots of sports teams, not much winning.  Did
    • 2
      Post
      All they have to do is waive Gabriel and Lyon to the Phantoms and they free up 1.4 mill and either NAK or a kid can plug the 12th forward 3rd line RW spot.   I think Ivan gets a 3 year deal 5mill 6mill 7 mill with a 6mill AAV.   TK get a 3 year 14 deal 4.6 AAV.   That would leave them wih 4.2 mill left.    

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