Flyers 2023-24 Trade deadline moves/predictions

[JR Ewing]

13 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

Fair enough. Flyers’ management avoided some potentially crippling mistakes last summer when rumors were flying about Austin Matthews and Johnny Gaudreau. And AFAIK they weren’t anywhere near the Monahan or Lindholm deals.  Still I can’t deny there were more experienced and likely better choices for Prez and GM. All I can say as a lifelong Flyers’ fan is Jones/Briere “feels” right. That and a couple bucks will buy you a ride on the IRT (!) but it’s all I got for now. Should be some “interesting” discussions after the TD…

 

As ever, the best moves tend to be the ones that don't get made.

 

Auston Matthews - there was no chance in hell of getting him. I'm pretty sure it was either Toronto or he goes home to Arizona, and that's completely fine for the Flyers. He's a great goal scorer but a bad fit for where Philly is in their rebuild, which is the beginning stages. By the time the group around him would be ready to compete, he'll be moving into the decline phase of his career.

 

Johnny Gaudreau - same as Matthews with respect to age, but worse: he's now entering his decline phase. He's the epitome what the Flyers don't need in their lineup. He's tiny and doesn't defend worth a lick... Did the Flyers a favour, signing with Columbus.

 

 

[radoran]

2 hours ago, JR Ewing said:

Auston Matthews - there was no chance in hell of getting him.

 

There wasn't really anything more than the NMC clause activating that made it anything but pure speculation.

 

Obviously Hart couldn't be moved, but the people who wouldn't move him for anything under any circumstances got their wish...

[SCFlyguy]

Here to say I was on the trade Hart bandwagon.  Oh well, another wasted asset.

 

5 hours ago, JR Ewing said:

Auston Matthews - there was no chance in hell of getting him. I'm pretty sure it was either Toronto or he goes home to Arizona, and that's completely fine for the Flyers. He's a great goal scorer but a bad fit for where Philly is in their rebuild, which is the beginning stages. By the time the group around him would be ready to compete, he'll be moving into the decline phase of his career.

Since Konecny is a few months older than Matthews, this is why we should be trading Konecny.

 

People getting duped by the relative success this year are going to look at next year's regression and wonder what happened.  Keeping your eye on the prize is trading assets that won't be able to help when you want to be good for assets that will be able to help then.

[GratefulFlyers]

NHL players are washed up by 26, 27 everybody knows that. Not a single player has ever been productive once he hit 30 - except Jagr he's the only one. The Flyers aren't serious about rebuilding.

[jammer2]

8 hours ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Well, now it's been reported that four teams are looking at trying to deal for Walker AND Seeler. Carolina, Minnesota, Winnipeg and Tampa Bay have made calls. The two combined are just over $3 million. That should be enough to get some great returns.

 

I still think Winnipeg is the best option, especially with the depth of prospects they have. If somehow the Flyers could convince Tampa Bay to give up Isaac Howard in any trade, that would be a great starting point. Not sure what Carolina or Minnesota could offer though....

I'm against giving up Seeler for a 3rd, which does not move the needle for me...but part of a package deal for a nice return? Yeah, sign me up. 

[jammer2]

27 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

NHL players are washed up by 26, 27 everybody knows that. Not a single player has ever been productive once he hit 30 - except Jagr he's the only one. The Flyers aren't serious about rebuilding.

Washed up at 30? No, of course not...but it in and around the sweet spot where stats begin to decline and a long term deal signed 4 years ago starts to swing towards burden and out of the prime years. Every player is different, some kick butt well into 33-34 ish...and unicorns like Pavalski exist...but on average...30-31 is where things go South. 

 

[RonJeremy]

3 minutes ago, jammer2 said:

Washed up at 30? No, of course not...but it in and around the sweet spot where stats begin to decline and a long term deal signed 4 years ago starts to swing towards burden and out of the prime years. Every player is different, some kick butt well into 33-34 ish...and unicorns like Pavalski exist...but on average...30-31 is where things go South. 

 

Coots is a prime example. 

[GratefulFlyers]

I know I was just grumpy after Petersen gave up that softy... Of course you're right over 30 is the beginning of the end. But thinking of Konecny specifically I just don't see a decline in the next 3, 4 even 5 years.

 

Just now, RonJeremy said:

Coots is a prime example. 

 

Not really. Most NHLers don't have back surgery in their careers let alone 2 back-to-back no pun intended. But if you mean the general decline...sure.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

6 minutes ago, jammer2 said:

Washed up at 30? No, of course not...but it in and around the sweet spot where stats begin to decline and a long term deal signed 4 years ago starts to swing towards burden and out of the prime years. Every player is different, some kick butt well into 33-34 ish...and unicorns like Pavalski exist...but on average...30-31 is where things go South. 

 

And that's why I'm more than willing to see Seeler moved for a 3rd - because he'll re-sign to a higher number and he'll fall off a cliff. As well, and I'm sure people are gonna go nuts when I say this, but guys like Seeler are a dime a dozen, especially at the trade deadline. 

 

And as mentioned, Ginning is sitting in Lehigh Valley and he does the same thing that Seeler does. 

[RonJeremy]

2 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

I know I was just grumpy after Petersen gave up that softy... Of course you're right over 30 is the beginning of the end. But thinking of Konecny specifically I just don't see a decline in the next 3, 4 even 5 years.

 

 

Not really. Most NHLers don't have back surgery in their careers let alone 2 back-to-back no pun intended. But if you mean the general decline...sure.

We signed Coots to a big contract and then he started to break down and now he will continue to decline, he played a lot of tough minutes from 18-29..

[GratefulFlyers]

5 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

guys like Seeler are a dime a dozen,

 

The guy who leads the league in shot-blocking - and has all year - is hardly a "dime a dozen" player. Giving him away for a 3R would prove incompetence. Thankfully Jones and Briere aren't incompetent.

[jammer2]

2 minutes ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

And that's why I'm more than willing to see Seeler moved for a 3rd - because he'll re-sign to a higher number and he'll fall off a cliff. As well, and I'm sure people are gonna go nuts when I say this, but guys like Seeler are a dime a dozen, especially at the trade deadline. 

 

And as mentioned, Ginning is sitting in Lehigh Valley and he does the same thing that Seeler does. 

You and I see Seeler differently. The guy only knows one way to play...balls to the wall 100% effort. If he survives the trade deadline, Seeler on the 2nd or 3rd pairing for a few years at 2 mill a year does nothing to harm the rebuild, but immensely helps the on ice product at a dirt cheap cap hit. 

 Ginning at 1 mill less and totally unproven does not provide 3rd in the NHL in shot blocking. If Ginning is that good, he'll get his shot as soon as someone gets hurt...without taking Seelers moxie out of the line up. Surely, in a physical team like Philly, there is room for both Seeler and Ginning. 

[jammer2]

47 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

 

The guy who leads the league in shot-blocking - and has all year - is hardly a "dime a dozen" player. Giving him away for a 3R would prove incompetence. Thankfully Jones and Briere aren't incompetent.

We have not even discussed how Seeler is THE best short handed defenseman on the Flyers. The pk is ranked 2nd in the League. What does that unit look like without his effort and hustle...answer...not as good.

[mojo1917]

I think this weekend should be instrumental toward taking advantage of the available assets. 

I shut Drysdale down. Let him heal, start fresh in 2024/25. I trade all the UFA defensemen. 

I healthy scratch Cam Atkinson for the rest of the season. 

I give extended looks to Ginning, for you @BobbyClarkeFan16 Attard and Andrae.

If someone wants to get crazy to acquire Scott Laughton, then okay. I know Jonesy in particular loves him and stated it would need to be an overpay because he feels indebted to Scott's leadership the last two years. 

Should the Kuch-show come to town and light the boys up then it's time to Sell Mortimer, SELL! 

[RonJeremy]

56 minutes ago, GratefulFlyers said:

 

The guy who leads the league in shot-blocking - and has all year - is hardly a "dime a dozen" player. Giving him away for a 3R would prove incompetence. Thankfully Jones and Briere aren't incompetent.

The thing that worries me is, it took him until 30 to become this defenseman we see. I’m not sold, I can easily see him returning back from a second pair guy to a #7. I would trade him if we can get a second rounder or good prospect. If they only offer third, then keep him for a playoff run I would only re-sign him for a reasonable deal, but he’s thirty he had a career year and will be looking for that big pay day with long term security. 

[RonJeremy]

4 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

I think this weekend should be instrumental toward taking advantage of the available assets. 

I shut Drysdale down. Let him heal, start fresh in 2024/25. I trade all the UFA defensemen. 

I healthy scratch Cam Atkinson for the rest of the season. 

I give extended looks to Ginning, for you @BobbyClarkeFan16 Attard and Andrae.

If someone wants to get crazy to acquire Scott Laughton, then okay. I know Jonesy in particular loves him and stated it would need to be an overpay because he feels indebted to Scott's leadership the last two years. 

Should the Kuch-show come to town and light the boys up then it's time to Sell Mortimer, SELL! 

For God Sakes, where in the hell is Beaks!!

[mojo1917]

6 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

I can easily see him returning back from a second pair guy to a #7. I

I hope he gets pushed to a #7.  I think there's a difference. 

I thought Cam York played pretty well offensively today.  I thought he was pretty good in his zone too. If some of these young guys with upside can break into the lineup because they're better and this version of Seeler becomes your #7... **** I'll take that all day.  I do like what he brings to the table and I do respect his determination.  There are worse things than having that guy in the organization. 

 

like I said in the Pens game thread, this group has made me feel some pride about being a Flyers fan again and I'm good with it. Nick Seeler and his **** all do whatever is asked attitude is part of the reason. He's exhibit A for fighting for every inch of everything. 

Edited February 26 by mojo1917

[AlaskaFlyerFan]

I think the system the Flyers are using really benefits Seeler’s game.  Put him in a different system and his game will drop off.

[radoran]

2 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

The guy who leads the league in shot-blocking - and has all year - is hardly a "dime a dozen" player.

 

One of Andy MacDonald's primary values was expressed in his shot blocking prowess.

 

I'll just leave that here.

 

[OccamsRazor]

5 hours ago, SCFlyguy said:

Here to say I was on the trade Hart bandwagon.  Oh well, another wasted asset.

 

Since Konecny is a few months older than Matthews, this is why we should be trading Konecny.

 

People getting duped by the relative success this year are going to look at next year's regression and wonder what happened.  Keeping your eye on the prize is trading assets that won't be able to help when you want to be good for assets that will be able to help then.

 

 

 

 

 

[SCFlyguy]

Should have traded Coots when we had the chance.

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

2 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

I think this weekend should be instrumental toward taking advantage of the available assets. 

I shut Drysdale down. Let him heal, start fresh in 2024/25. I trade all the UFA defensemen. 

I healthy scratch Cam Atkinson for the rest of the season. 

I give extended looks to Ginning, for you @BobbyClarkeFan16 Attard and Andrae.

If someone wants to get crazy to acquire Scott Laughton, then okay. I know Jonesy in particular loves him and stated it would need to be an overpay because he feels indebted to Scott's leadership the last two years. 

Should the Kuch-show come to town and light the boys up then it's time to Sell Mortimer, SELL! 

Something tells me Laughton ends up in Vegas. They just put Eichel and Stone onto IR. They're going to save some bucks to make a move and acquiring a guy like Laughton would be such a Vegas thing to do. And wouldn't it be something if David Edstrom was the return (and yes, they've given away top prospects for players, especially when they have term or Vegas signs them to an extension). 

 

I'd almost consider buying out Atkinson at this point and run with Konecny, Tippett, Foerster and Hathaway as the RWs. The LWs could be Farabee, Lyksell, Cates and Deslauriers. I keep Brink and Tuomaala away from this and let them run out the stretch in Lehigh Valley to see if they can dominate.

 

The Flyers took a huge step this year and they stepped up in the face of adversity and everything that's going on with Carter Hart. But you can see they're running out of gas. They still don't have enough horses and that's perfectly fine. This isn't an overnight fix. But there's good pieces there. Let Briere add better pieces. And they've got cap space they're willing to weaponize too. 

 

And if Briere knocks it out of the park with returns on Walker and Seeler (and I think that's what Briere is pushing for), that will speed things up even further. I would love to see if Briere could pull getting either Isaac Howard (Tampa Bay) or Rutger McGroarty (Winnipeg) in a return for Walker and Seeler.

Edited February 26 by BobbyClarkeFan16

[jammer2]

1 hour ago, BobbyClarkeFan16 said:

Something tells me Laughton ends up in Vegas. They just put Eichel and Stone onto IR. They're going to save some bucks to make a move and acquiring a guy like Laughton would be such a Vegas thing to do. And wouldn't it be something if David Edstrom was the return (and yes, they've given away top prospects for players, especially when they have term or Vegas signs them to an extension). 

 

I'd almost consider buying out Atkinson at this point and run with Konecny, Tippett, Foerster and Hathaway as the RWs. The LWs could be Farabee, Lyksell, Cates and Deslauriers. I keep Brink and Tuomaala away from this and let them run out the stretch in Lehigh Valley to see if they can dominate.

 

The Flyers took a huge step this year and they stepped up in the face of adversity and everything that's going on with Carter Hart. But you can see they're running out of gas. They still don't have enough horses and that's perfectly fine. This isn't an overnight fix. But there's good pieces there. Let Briere add better pieces. And they've got cap space they're willing to weaponize too. 

 

And if Briere knocks it out of the park with returns on Walker and Seeler (and I think that's what Briere is pushing for), that will speed things up even further. I would love to see if Briere could pull getting either Isaac Howard (Tampa Bay) or Rutger McGroarty (Winnipeg) in a return for Walker and Seeler.

I have heard McGroarty is off limits, but ya never know till you try. Flyers are in trade limbo till Flames move Hanfin and or Tanev. Until they are moved, Flyers are not the top dogs selling Dmen.

 

 The pressure NHL GMs are under to win should play right into the Flyers plans. A lot of GMs with their jobs on the line right now. Guys that don't care about prospects or picks that may or may not be there if they are fired. 

[GratefulFlyers]

4 hours ago, AlaskaFlyerFan said:

I think the system the Flyers are using really benefits Seeler’s game.  Put him in a different system and his game will drop off.

Yep and it’s Tortorella’s system with the emphasis on Tortorella. He’s still preaching D-first and puck management but he’s opened it up for quick breakouts and even quicker transitions and the Flyers are thriving in it. 

 

And of course Seeler is not the only one who’s benefited. Whether it’s fear, embarrassment of getting benched or more likely an honest “buy-in” - whatever it is it’s working throughout the roster.
 

This is why I don’t envision a big dropoff from Seeler or Walker (if they’re extended or re-sign this summer) or TK when he gets his $8mil/8-year deal. From where I sit the “buy-in” looks genuine - they look like a team that knows it’s on a mission. 

[SCFlyguy]

The mission is codenamed, "Dead Cat Bounce".