Poulin20 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 2016-2020 is a very big and exciting window for the Flyers. Finally the organization is approaching the building of a 'team' the right way. ^^^^^^^^^^^^ This is what excites me intensely about the game and the team as a whole...we have waited this long we might as well wait a bit more to do it the right way and then be elite for a long window and then end the misery. If I am fortunate to live that long (I am only 39 so hopefully I will) I look really forward to my next few years as a STH. I think it is going to be a GREAT ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I agree........... https://pbs.twimg.com/tweet_video/CPi7c_QWEAAeMc-.mp4 Guy has a hammer of a shot. I know this is going to be sacrilegious to some but I am all for Homer trading the Schenn brothers. I **think** Laughton is ready and would like to see him stick.... I do see a player that looks lost sometimes but I could say the same thing for B Schenn. Trade both Schenns to open up some spots. At this point she is either (1) part of the core or (2) not part of the core so make a decision and go with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Guy has a hammer of a shot. I know this is going to be sacrilegious to some but I am all for Homer trading the Schenn brothers. I **think** Laughton is ready and would like to see him stick.... I do see a player that looks lost sometimes but I could say the same thing for B Schenn. Trade both Schenns to open up some spots. At this point she is either (1) part of the core or (2) not part of the core so make a decision and go with it. I've been saying for a while, B.Schenn will require top 6 minutes, but does not make the team hard to play against and really, does nothing outstandng, just meh average....from shot to skating to intenstiy. I want HUNGRY players in our top 6, and dogged determination....I don't see any of those qualities in Brayden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Guy has a hammer of a shot. I know this is going to be sacrilegious to some but I am all for Homer trading the Schenn brothers. I **think** Laughton is ready and would like to see him stick.... I do see a player that looks lost sometimes but I could say the same thing for B Schenn. Trade both Schenns to open up some spots. At this point she is either (1) part of the core or (2) not part of the core so make a decision and go with it. I said some where in one of these threads my gut tells me one if not both could be gone before the season starts.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I only caught the final few minutes and the 3 on 3 but I hope BSCHENN looked better than he did when I was watching. He had 2 weak plays in a row that led to TOs then took the tripping minor as his final contribution. The Ranger broadcaster made an excellent point.... there's nowhere to hide with 3v3. Guys who get tired are exposed. Schenn looked gassed quickly in the 3v3 period. I think he made some lazy/tired plays after that that got him 2 min. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I said some where in one of these threads my gut tells me one if not both could be gone before the season starts.... In the wise words of Metallica, "so let it be written, so let it be done".....think it's from Creeping Death, but could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 The Ranger broadcaster made an excellent point.... there's nowhere to hide with 3v3. Guys who get tired are exposed. Schenn looked gassed quickly in the 3v3 period. I think he made some lazy/tired plays after that that got him 2 min. Teams with top end elite talent and speed are gonna have a field day with 3 on 3 hockey. Can you imagine 3 guys trying to keep pace with Toews, Kane and Kieth? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mad Dog Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 All in all, the obvious difference in this training camp compared to the last year is the players' motivation and sense of urgency (even for the meaningless games). The Berube's team that entered the training camp last year was half-asleep. You could see that. I don't know whether it was coming from players' having a complete disrespect for Berube, or lack of directions, or both, but this is night and day. Even VLC looks like he has a sense of purpose. I also feel that Hak already started working on x's and o's very methodically, devising schemes and strategy very early in the process. being that this is so early and the lines don't have the best chemistry in the world, you can see the players know what they are doing on the ice. This is yet another refreshing change from Berube's complete cluelessness. I have a feeling that no matter what happens, this Flyers team will not be a bunch of push-overs the way they were last year. They may not win the President Trophy necessarily, but they will come our ready most of the nights and they will be hard to play against. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jammer2 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @Mad Dog You can tell that Hakstol's personality commands respect. Berube was a dufus. I don't think the players respected Craig, so the sense of urgency was not there....you want to be on Hak's good side, so everyone seems to be picking up their game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @jammer2@murraycraven I think I would be ok if Hextall moved the Schenns together for something we need - which at this point I'm not even sure what that is. Is it a top line winger? Raffl scored 20, and with another year of experience, a more astute coach, and elite linemates full-time (if he sticks), he should be able to put up 25 goals easily. Add 15-20 assists and that is pretty decent - on the weak side for a top line winger, but it's what we've got. That's still less production than Schenn put up last year, btw, without top line minutes. Is it worth giving up on Brayden for an extra 10 points a top line winger would get you, and will it offset the 50 points Schenn put up lower on the depth chart? Can Raffl maintain that production away from G and Jake? I guess what I am saying is that I would not move Brayden on his own - it would have to be a pot sweetener that helps move Luke or MacDud. I think Luke can be moved on his own at some point during the season. MacDud, however, will require some sweetness in the deal. Does that make any sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 That's still less production than Schenn put up last year, btw, without top line minutes. Is it worth giving up on Brayden for an extra 10 points a top line winger would get you, and will it offset the 50 points Schenn put up lower on the depth chart? Can Raffl maintain that production away from G and Jake? The thing about B Schenn is he represents the offensive depth...or lack there of. His goals came independent of Giroux and Jake.He is not Patrick Kane or RNH but the kid has improved his production every year and so far in the minutes i saw from him looks very motivated to keep trending upwards. I agree he's not "the problem" or even a problem really he's just not living up to his billing as 'the best player not in the NHL" from whenever that was said and he benefited from going on a hot streak at the right time as an 18 year old in the world jr tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 I agree he's not "the problem" or even a problem really he's just not living up to his billing as 'the best player not in the NHL" from whenever that was said and he benefited from going on a hot streak at the right time as an 18 year old in the world jr tournament. Exactly. It seems like expectations are mismatched to reality. A #5 overall comes with a heap of expectations, and not all of them live up to their billing. But it's hard to argue with 20 goals and 50 points (47, really) for a 23 year old if you ignore where he was drafted. After they are drafted, ranking makes no difference any more. It's what you can coax out of that player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @mojo1917 & brel I completely agree about Schenn. Not totally for him and not really against him. He is a good player but what I really want out of him is consistency. The same can be said for the Coach and the organization- it is time to see if this kid can flourish in one spot and with consistent line-mates. I think given those circumstances he very well could be part of the future and we need to find that out this year. I have always said this about Schenn: he is a good player that really does not shine when it comes to one single aspect of the game. Good shot, decent skater, I would say below average in hockey IQ - he is decent at everything but really a master of no single skill. He is a good player and hopefully turns it into being worthy of that 5th pick type player. I am not selling him and his brother for a bag of pucks. It would have to be the right deal... Based on Hextall's comments I think the organization is unsure of where he fits with this group in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 it is time to see if this kid can flourish in one spot and with consistent line-mates. Which has me wondering why they didn't start with Schenn on Couturier's wing, if they were going on recent success. They seemed to have chemistry at the end of the year, so why not? Schenn/Couturier/Simmonds. But where does Read go? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Berube was a dufus. Nah... he was just mistaken for an actual hockey coach Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Which has me wondering why they didn't start with Schenn on Couturier's wing, if they were going on recent success. They seemed to have chemistry at the end of the year, so why not? Schenn/Couturier/Simmonds. But where does Read go? I actually like that line a lot too and they definitely played well last year together. That would be a fun line to watch grow together too... Read would have to fall to the 3rd line . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digityman Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Based on Hextall's comments I think the organization is unsure of where he fits with this group in the future. I think this more than any other reason, there is talk of trading both Schenns. Unless BSchenn can show he can play consistently at wing and produce as good or better than he has been, he doesn't fit in on this team. LSchenn, unless this year is off the charts, will be replaced by a prospect next year. Not saying the Schenns can't offer decent production, but there are others waiting to get a chance. Either way, I hope they both know that this year is the year to show what you have or they are probably no longer Flyers this time next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Read would have to fall to the 3rd line . That's where it starts to fall apart. Right now it's Gagner/VLC/Umberger, and the 4th is Bellemare/VV/White. So who gets scratched/demoted/traded/maimed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Read would have to fall to the 3rd line .Myself i see much more in Read game that would compliment that line than Schenn's. I mean if you pro rate the lock out season he is a 3 time 20 goal scorer. He dealt with an ankle injury all last year so i'll give him the benefit of the doubt he will get there again, besides him and Coots have great chemistry.My .02 cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bakanekimiwa Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @jammer2@murraycraven I think I would be ok if Hextall moved the Schenns together for something we need - which at this point I'm not even sure what that is. Is it a top line winger? Raffl scored 20, and with another year of experience, a more astute coach, and elite linemates full-time (if he sticks), he should be able to put up 25 goals easily. Add 15-20 assists and that is pretty decent - on the weak side for a top line winger, but it's what we've got. That's still less production than Schenn put up last year, btw, without top line minutes. Is it worth giving up on Brayden for an extra 10 points a top line winger would get you, and will it offset the 50 points Schenn put up lower on the depth chart? Can Raffl maintain that production away from G and Jake? I guess what I am saying is that I would not move Brayden on his own - it would have to be a pot sweetener that helps move Luke or MacDud. I think Luke can be moved on his own at some point during the season. MacDud, however, will require some sweetness in the deal. Does that make any sense? Exactly... I think we should keep Braydon. I've been in the trade him camp, but he's still very young and is in a contract year. His numbers have trended up and I think he'll have a big year. I'd be keen on getting him signed now for a short term deal at a reasonable hit. If he lights it up, you can think about an extension next year or trade him while he's high. Lose his brother at all costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojo1917 Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Exactly. It seems like expectations are mismatched to reality. A #5 overall comes with a heap of expectations, and not all of them live up to their billing. But it's hard to argue with 20 goals and 50 points (47, really) for a 23 year old if you ignore where he was drafted. After they are drafted, ranking makes no difference any more. It's what you can coax out of that player. i've been going 'round with @flyercanuck about the value of making the playoffs vs getting another high draft pick, Brayden illustrates my point pretty well. Here this guy is the #5 pick and he's the most frequently mentioned tradeable Flyer, in his 5th year in the league, even the high draft picks are still a crap shoot. it's a good thing he was only really relied upon last year for his production you know ?that didn't go so well, it didn't go badly but he didn't rise to the level necessary to help the team make the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @mojo1917 So here's a comparison chart between Schenn and Couturier showing their 'consistency' - that is, what kind of gaps do they have in terms of point production? I know they are different players, with different roles. The only point I'm trying to make is that Coots is more inconsistent than Schenn (look at the bottom of each chart for the line along 0 points... the longer that line is, the more games the player went without a point) yet Couturier inherited a 2nd line center role, better linemates, and a huge contract. I know he has a very valuable defensive centerman reputation that goes beyond points - but he's still very inconsistent and producing way below what was 'expected' of him. Somehow, Schenn always gets the short end of the stick, being dropped on a '5th' line with a bunch of AHLers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Digityman Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @brelic good use of stats. Eye opening to me at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 Mevedev has yet to play more than 50 games in a season in his career and he's never played at this level before. Let's just see how this 33-year-old does down the stretch and (hopefully) into the playoffs instead of deciding that he's a "must have" after two preseason games. No need to rush on either side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brelic Posted September 23, 2015 Share Posted September 23, 2015 @brelic good use of stats. Eye opening to me at least. Yeah, I assumed Schenn was more inconsistent because it kind of felt that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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