flyerrod Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I noticed that Umberger did not play the entire 3rd period in the Leafs game. He was directly responsible for the first 2 goals scored by the Leafs. Whether from Injury or being pulled just for his suckage, it is way past due. I have never seen Weal play a game in my life but I find it hard to believe he could be worse than Umby has been. I hope he is ready to take over where VLC left off and I am sure he can handle the popcorn duties at this point in his career. I have tried really hard to give Umberger the benefit of doubt after finding out he needed surgery all season last year but this year even though he has been a better skater than last season, he just does not have the speed or the puck handling ability to play the game anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Eff him play Weal! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishbulb Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 There is absolutely NO reason to keep playing him. None. He's slow now, can't score, causes goals, and has no potential to grow! Why he stays in the lineup is beyond me. Bellemare also had a brutal game imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerrod Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, fishbulb said: Bellemare also had a brutal game imo. He certainly did tonight but that has not been his norm. Umberger has become the new square peg in a round hole. I would like to see if Weal can perform or if not, send him down and bring up one of the other young forwards from the phantoms. If Umberger turns out to be Hextall's biggest mistake, I can certainly live with that due to it rid the Flyers of Hartnell's albatross contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 56 minutes ago, flyerrod said: He certainly did tonight but that has not been his norm. Umberger has become the new square peg in a round hole. I would like to see if Weal can perform or if not, send him down and bring up one of the other young forwards from the phantoms. If Umberger turns out to be Hextall's biggest mistake, I can certainly live with that due to it rid the Flyers of Hartnell's albatross contract. Weal is subject to waivers so they ain't waiving him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howie58 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 PEB's performance isn't where it was last year. He has energy but wonder if we've seen the proverbial upside. I believe he was extended through next year. So he may be around one way or the other. Howie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyerrod Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 2 hours ago, OccamsRazor said: Weal is subject to waivers so they ain't waiving him. If he is given a chance to perform and fails, who is going to pick him on waivers.....and if they do what is the problem with it? VLC is gone. Weal was a throw in at this point until he proves that he can play....or not. All that the Flyers do is gain another roster spot to bring up a player that can contribute IF someone claims him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OccamsRazor Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 6 hours ago, flyerrod said: He certainly did tonight but that has not been his norm. Umberger has become the new square peg in a round hole. I would like to see if Weal can perform or if not, send him down and bring up one of the other young forwards from the phantoms. If Umberger turns out to be Hextall's biggest mistake, I can certainly live with that due to it rid the Flyers of Hartnell's albatross contract. I say scratch RJ Medvedev and Laughton (i'd rather send him down but that requires waivers now for Scott) and recall Cousins and Ghost old partner who played the right side Alt. See if they can get going with some more motivated folks in the lineup. After losing the the Leafs it can't hurt. But i know it won't happen with a big game versus the Pens next. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icehole Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 After hearing some comments umberger made about how upset he is with his game, I got the feeling that he's thinking about retirement. Wouldnt that be fantastic! I think Hak playing him makes him think that he's still doing something good though. Scratch him a few times and he might hang 'em up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Again, I don't see Umburglar "walking away" from $4.5M YMMV I *can* see the Flyers buying him out for $3M and taking a $1.6M, $1.5M cap hit for the next two seasons. That *still* "saves" them cap room over Hartnell (the purported reason they dealt away their top line LW for RJ). And, really, thank God, because he'd only be leading the team in goals and tied for second in points. But they do get cap room after next season (if they don't get it next season by buying him out). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intheslot Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Wait until after the pens game.. He plays good against them .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Look, Umberger might suck at hockey but he is not walking away from the money next year... Flyers will either have to buy him out or just plant him next to the beverages and popcorn. He truly serves no purpose on this team and never has - and never will. He was toast when he came here and a change a scenery was never going to fix his play. He sucks... if they are truly trying to ice the best roster every night there is no logical reason why he would be in the lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 14 hours ago, flyerrod said: He certainly did tonight but that has not been his norm. Umberger has become the new square peg in a round hole. I would like to see if Weal can perform or if not, send him down and bring up one of the other young forwards from the phantoms. If Umberger turns out to be Hextall's biggest mistake, I can certainly live with that due to it rid the Flyers of Hartnell's albatross contract. Yeah, I think if Umberger never played a game in a flyers uniform and they had to pay him the whole time, he would have served his purpose for the deal. The dividends of trading Hartnell probably won't be felt in any real way to connect them to that deal when they finally come to fruition. When they can resign DelZotto or give Ghost the long term locked down deal ahead of his UFA year, or retain Mason or Neuvy for another few years, or sign another FA goalie instead, or god forbid sign an honest to god, actual sniper of a LW from free agency, no one's going to say, "Oooooh... we traded Hartsy for THIS." But that's what it'll be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Knut Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 2 hours ago, intheslot said: Wait until after the pens game.. He plays good against them .. Bingo! Unless he's hurt. We can't afford to lose that one. Or any others actually. Last night was a real problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vonginous Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Why not tell him if he retires, they will hire him as a scout or something for one year at 4 mil (I don't care if it's literally getting popcorn for people) Just retire and we will cover the 4 mil in any legal way possible. Not a lawyer, but this sounds like it shouldn't be legal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Hartnell at $4.75M is paid right in line with his production. Maybe a little low. His contract wasn't an albatross. The albatross is the gaping hole at top line LW that they have now. The one that Many have been discussing exactly what assets they need to give up to fill. The Umburglar move was a tragic mistake. There's no shining up the turd. Hextall's done a lot of good. This deal wasn't part of that. Del Zotto is signed for next year. Gotstobehere has another year after this and then is an RFA. The Flyers have around $12M in space for next season at this point (with players to be signed). That's before any decision about Umburglar's contract - which is taking up just $150K of cap space less than what Hartnell would have been. Streit and Schultz represent $7.5M in additional cap space that come off after next season. There was no pressing "need" to swap Hartnell for Umburglar when it happened in order to facilitate decisions four years later. Moreover, if they can deal a Mark Streit for "value" at the deadline, for example, they would certainly have been able to deal Hartnell for "value" at some point in the intervening time and kept the first line production which he provided without needing to expend additional assets to reacquire it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TedZep Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 15 hours ago, flyerrod said: If Umberger turns out to be Hextall's biggest mistake, I can certainly live with that due to it rid the Flyers of Hartnell's albatross contract. See, I don't get that kind of thinking at all. Hartnell is producing at a top level, almost on par with Giroux & Voracek, with almost as many (or more) goals and points as those two, but at $3M less per year. Dollar for dollar, his contract was/is a good deal. The Flyers certainly haven't replaced his production with anyone, not even almost close. To date, this has been a horrible trade. That being said, I understand that the trade was made to free up future cap space to sign other players. But if those players don't equal the production of Hartnell, what was the point of sacrificing the 30 goals, 60 points per year and grit he would have brought to the Flyers these past two years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Sam Carchidi @BroadStBull 2h2 hours ago Sounds like Weal AND Coots will play Thurs. Laughton or Umby likely out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 3 minutes ago, AJgoal said: Sam Carchidi @BroadStBull 2h2 hours ago Sounds like Weal AND Coots will play Thurs. Laughton or Umby likely out. Beauty. I'd like Weal to get a look. He's an undersized guy who has had to scrap for everything he's achieved in hockey by the looks of it. The fact that someone as small as him got drafted in the 3rd round suggests that he has some character. Guys his size don't get to the NHL without it. So he deserves a look. He may surprise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murraycraven Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 53 minutes ago, radoran said: Hartnell at $4.75M is paid right in line with his production. Maybe a little low. His contract wasn't an albatross. The albatross is the gaping hole at top line LW that they have now. The one that Many have been discussing exactly what assets they need to give up to fill. The Umburglar move was a tragic mistake. There's no shining up the turd. Hextall's done a lot of good. This deal wasn't part of that. Del Zotto is signed for next year. Gotstobehere has another year after this and then is an RFA. The Flyers have around $12M in space for next season at this point (with players to be signed). That's before any decision about Umburglar's contract - which is taking up just $150K of cap space less than what Hartnell would have been. Streit and Schultz represent $7.5M in additional cap space that come off after next season. There was no pressing "need" to swap Hartnell for Umburglar when it happened in order to facilitate decisions four years later. Moreover, if they can deal a Mark Streit for "value" at the deadline, for example, they would certainly have been able to deal Hartnell for "value" at some point in the intervening time and kept the first line production which he provided without needing to expend additional assets to reacquire it. This a 1000 times over... this was my argument when the trade went down. Added to the fact that RJ was about to be bought out (and hurt) it is really a bad trade any which way you look at it. At the very least Hartnell was popular with teammates and at least fun to watch while being great in the community. As you stated - there is absolutely no shining this turd - period. Bad trade then and even worse now IMO... but yeah, RJ can play multiple positions and the PK - LOL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 I know Laughton has been struggling, so maybe the best thing is to send him back to the A. But maybe he needs to play through it. I still think I'd like to see him with Weal on his right, and I'd call Gagner back up and put him back on Laughton's left. I From what I remember reading, Weal is supposed to be really fast, and he had quite a bit of success in the AHL (right about a ppg over the past two seasons). Obviously, that doesn't necessarily translate, but if the kid's got wheels, it can't hurt to inject some speed into this lineup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
radoran Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 43 minutes ago, murraycraven said: This a 1000 times over... this was my argument when the trade went down. Added to the fact that RJ was about to be bought out (and hurt) it is really a bad trade any which way you look at it. At the very least Hartnell was popular with teammates and at least fun to watch while being great in the community. As you stated - there is absolutely no shining this turd - period. Bad trade then and even worse now IMO... but yeah, RJ can play multiple positions and the PK - LOL! I still tell myself that there was more to this situation than we have learned. As bad as it sounds, I certainly HOPE there is. 42 minutes ago, AJgoal said: I know Laughton has been struggling, so maybe the best thing is to send him back to the A. But maybe he needs to play through it. I still think I'd like to see him with Weal on his right, and I'd call Gagner back up and put him back on Laughton's left. I From what I remember reading, Weal is supposed to be really fast, and he had quite a bit of success in the AHL (right about a ppg over the past two seasons). Obviously, that doesn't necessarily translate, but if the kid's got wheels, it can't hurt to inject some speed into this lineup. The issue with Laughton is he'd be subject to waivers and IMO very likely to be claimed going down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJgoal Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Just now, radoran said: I still tell myself that there was more to this situation than we have learned. As bad as it sounds, I certainly HOPE there is. The only thing I can think of is that they thought Hartnell might be breaking down. He had the horrendous campaign the lockout year, then rebounded a bit to 20 goals the next. With his hitting the wrong side of 30 and the quick downturn power forwards can suffer in production, they may have been worried that he was coming to the end and felt that if they didn't move him that season, they might really be stuck. Obviously turns out that it wasn't the case, but I could understand if that was the rationale for moving him when they did. The issue with Laughton is he'd be subject to waivers and IMO very likely to be claimed going down. Laughton is waiver exempt for two more years or 81 more NHL games played. Since he was 18 when he signed his ELC, he is exempt for 5 years or 160 games. I'm not sure where people are getting the idea that he is no longer exempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ8812 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 Ya, that Hartnell for Umberger swap was terrible no matter how you look at it. I don't believe at all that Umberger was the best we could have gotten for Hartnell, even if Hartnell had a NTC/NMC We could have gotten a 1st round draft pick+ if we would have waited until the deadline to move him. Playoff teams would have been desperate to get a player like him, no matter how much was left on his deal. Also, Laughton is waiver exempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Podein25 Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 32 minutes ago, AJgoal said: I know Laughton has been struggling, so maybe the best thing is to send him back to the A. But maybe he needs to play through it. I still think I'd like to see him with Weal on his right, and I'd call Gagner back up and put him back on Laughton's left. I From what I remember reading, Weal is supposed to be really fast, and he had quite a bit of success in the AHL (right about a ppg over the past two seasons). Obviously, that doesn't necessarily translate, but if the kid's got wheels, it can't hurt to inject some speed into this lineup. I like the idea of speed on Scott's wing for sure. Someone bigger on the other side to balance it out. You never know where chemistry will be found.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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