Game 2: Devils at Flyers; 10/9/19 @ 7:30 PM

[ruxpin]

10 hours ago, Howie58 said:

Good effort!  Hart was remarkable, and Hayes is impressive.  The penalty kill actually worked.  They worked hard.  Will they keep it going?  NJ may not be a hard test.  But there seems to be an intensity level several notches over prior editions. 

 

Agreed all the way around. 

The intensity level on the PK was terrific,though. The NJ line is bolded because this is exactly the type of opponent that Flyers of previous years would have sleep-walked into.  Nice to see them take care of business.

 

Now, if they can keep it up.

[brelic]

1 minute ago, ruxpin said:

This is a much better angle than the live angle, but the slow-motion doesn't do it justice. The live speed was "oh my God, what the hell just happened?  How was that possible?"

 

Great pass, great shot, but an OMG save.

 

The game really had a playoff feel last night. Fans are hopeful again. Players seem energized and connected.

 

I don;t think we can understate the damage Hextall did to the franchise. I was reading a bit from a STH that mentioned just how many things were stopped under Hextall and are now reappearing (things like discounts, meet and greet events, social activities, access, etc). On top of that, he was icing a terrible product to watch.

 

The dark cloud around the franchise seems to be lifting.

[radoran]

43 minutes ago, brelic said:

I don;t think we can understate the damage Hextall did to the franchise.

 

Fans, Philadelphians, Gritty, lend me your ears;

I come to bury Hextall, not to praise him.

The bad GMs do lives after them;

The good is oft interred with their bones;

So let it be with Hextall. The noble Brelic

Hath told you Hextall damaged the franchise:

If it were so, it was a grievous fault,

And grievously hath Hextall answer’d it.

Here, under leave of Brelic and the rest–

For Brelic is an honourable man;

So are they all, all honourable men–

Come I to speak in Hextall’s defense.

He was a Flyer, faithful and just to the franchise:

But Brelic says he damaged the team;

And Brelic is an honourable man.

He hath brought few playoff wins to Philly;

Yet he whose draft picks did the general roster fill:

Did this in Hextall damage the team?

When that the past seasons ended, Hextall hath wept:

Damage should be made of sterner stuff:

Yet Brelic says he damaged the team;

And Brelic is an honourable man.

You all did see that when it came to Hackstol

He thrice had opportunity to can him,

Which he did thrice refuse: and this was damage.

And Brelic says he did damage;

And, sure, he is an honourable man.

I speak not to disprove what Brelic spoke,

But here I am to speak what I do know.

You all did love him once, not without cause:

What cause withholds you then, to mourn for him?

O judgment! thou art fled to brutish beasts,

And the roster is full of his draft picks. Bear with me;

My heart isn’t in the coffin with Hextall,

And I will cheer the team he built so much of.

Edited October 10, 2019 by radoran

[mojo1917]

About the game overall, under Hakstol the Flyers win that game 3-1 or maybe 4-2...some of that is the goalie, but also I think having 2.5 hardasses on the bench keeps these players focused on the job at hand.  That team was intent on keeping the clean sheet for their tender...that has been missing for some years.

 

If this is how the team plays I will be entertained. I thought they looked fast and strong on pucks, I thought they played smart defensively.

Braun was good, as was Niskanen, Provorov hit that bomb on the PP...holy **** how fast was that puck going. 

He looks to be healthy.  Just think what will happen if G and V start scoring. The third line is very good and hard to play against. If JvR skates all year who is going to match up with them ?

Lindblom TK and Couturier is a problem for other teams too...adding Hayes made all these guys better because of where they're playing. 

Very excited after 2 games...got my parade seat all planned out.

[radoran]

3 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

got my parade seat all planned out.

 

Why do you think I bought a house a block off South Broad 13 years ago?

 

[fan4ever]

Everyone to @radoran's house!!!

 

I'll bring the beer!!!

[ruxpin]

1 hour ago, brelic said:

I don;t think we can understate the damage Hextall did to the franchise

 

I'm more than willing to attempt it.   I just don't agree with this.

[mojo1917]

1 hour ago, brelic said:

I don;t think we can understate the damage Hextall did to the franchise. I was reading a bit from a STH that mentioned just how many things were stopped under Hextall and are now reappearing (things like discounts, meet and greet events, social activities, access, etc). On top of that, he was icing a terrible product to watch.

 

I won't indict Hextall to hell, he was not perfect, he did sign some bad NHL players while he was rebuilding the farm system and prospect pool.

I don't think the half-assed rebuild was fun. I do, however, like seeing guys like Carsen Twarinski look like legit NHL players. 81 was on zero people's radar as a "youngster primed to make the NHL roster".  And here he is blowing up Norris trophy candidate PK Subban in the home opener and handcuffing the Devils goalie with his ++ shot. 

That's Hextall too, so yes, he did step on his crank with his micromanaging , failing to fire his dumb-assed coach and icing a middling team. He also drafted extremely well and set the stage for what we're seeing happening now- He didn't get to execute this phase  but without his work this phase doesn't feel like the beginning of something.

[Podein25]

57 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

About the game overall, under Hakstol the Flyers win that game 3-1 or maybe 4-2...some of that is the goalie, but also I think having 2.5 hardasses on the bench keeps these players focused on the job at hand.  That team was intent on keeping the clean sheet for their tender...that has been missing for some years.

 

If this is how the team plays I will be entertained. I thought they looked fast and strong on pucks, I thought they played smart defensively.

Braun was good, as was Niskanen, Provorov hit that bomb on the PP...holy **** how fast was that puck going. 

He looks to be healthy.  Just think what will happen if G and V start scoring. The third line is very good and hard to play against. If JvR skates all year who is going to match up with them ?

Lindblom TK and Couturier is a problem for other teams too...adding Hayes made all these guys better because of where they're playing. 

Very excited after 2 games...got my parade seat all planned out.

 

I worry for you brother.

 

Must. Manage. Expectations. 

[vis]

Really solid win on all fronts.  Nice to see when they get NHL-quality coaching and NHL quality goaltending.  Imagine that...

 

However, the Devils did not make it hard on the Flyers at all.  Still, they handled the opponent the way good teams do by playing their own game and not sinking to the Devils' level.

 

In the first period, I feared this would be one of those games where we play well but struggle to score, the other team scores on a PP or two and we lose.

[MaineFlyFan]

most exciting flyers game I'v watched in YEARS! My son was GLUED to the TV!....he was 100% legit into this game like I have never saw him into a game before!...(warms my heart!)

 

Speaking of Hart....My lord. I'm a believer! That 2-man kill with the save by Hart was BEAUTY....

 

Good looking start! long season though...but man, glad I did not cancel center ice!

 

 

[brelic]

@ruxpin @mojo1917

 

Just to be clear, all I meant was the somber mood that seemed to be around the franchise with Hextall at the helm. He absolutely drafted well - probably the best run in the franchise's history - and he moved out deadweight, cleared salary, and chose to try and rebuild the team from within. He handed out smart contracts. I love Hextall the player, and was totally onboard with Hextall the GM. 

 

But I have to admit that the negativity was palpable the last few years when seemingly no progress was being made (and *I* know that time was needed). The team was no fun to watch - partly because they just didn't have enough mature talent on the roster, and partly because they kids were either not in the NHL yet or most of those that were were still in the learning process.

 

Also, Hakstol. 

 

The mood is different around the team this year, and that starts with Fletch. Hayes, Niskanen, and Braun are different beasts than Weal/Weise/Lehtera and Gudas and AMac. 

 

It's only two games, but this team looks fun and loose. 

[radoran]

1 hour ago, fan4ever said:

Everyone to @radoran's house!!!

 

I'll bring the beer!!!

 

believe me - if this should happen - you're all welcome!

[Podein25]

11 minutes ago, brelic said:

this team looks fun and loose.

 

I missed the game, but this is the single most important takeaway. Fun and loose = winning. They have not looked fun and loose for a long, long time. And I don't mean Carter and Richards kind of fun and loose either, but on the ice.

 

It's funny how it all adds up:

• A good, confident young goalie: check
• A few veteran D-men: check
• A coach with a pedigree: check
• Skill, talent, found from within through the draft: check
• Gritty: check

 

 

Edited October 10, 2019 by Podein25

[radoran]

58 minutes ago, brelic said:

The mood is different around the team this year, and that starts with Fletch.

 

IMO it starts with the guy wearing 79.  I do think that AV also has an effect in that as well - and that does reflect the primary Hextall shortcoming of Hackstol.

 

Anyone who's "excited" about Niskanen and Braun should probably consult professional help.

 

That said, Hextall came in with a five year plan and was canned in Y4 after which other were able to reap the benefits of the ground he prepared. As mojo said, the half-rebuild wasn't pretty and really didn't accomplish the "goal" of being "definitely a playoff team".  I hated watching them to the extent that I pretty much checked out early last season.

 

And, yes, I've watched all of both games so far this year.

 

58 minutes ago, brelic said:

Hayes, Niskanen, and Braun are different beasts than Weal/Weise/Lehtera and Gudas and AMac. 

 

Just to speak to some of this:

 

Weal - came over when Hextall ditched the Ghost of VLC (*cough* Holmgren *cough*)

Weise/Gordon - unquestioned mistakes, but nothing that locked down huge salary for term

Lehtera - may I introduce you to Morgan Frost and Joel Farabee?

Gudas - a more than serviceable NHL player who came over in the trade that included a pick that was traded for... Travis Konecny

AMac - a great example of Holmgren's influence...

 

Edited October 10, 2019 by radoran

[Podein25]

2 minutes ago, radoran said:

Anyone who's "excited" about Niskanen and Braun should probably consult professional help.

 

The only thing I care about is how did they play in the two games so far? That's all I care about.

[radoran]

4 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

The only thing I care about is how did they play in the two games so far? That's all I care about.

 

So far, so good!

[brelic]

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

IMO it starts with the guy wearing 73.  I do think that AV also has an effect in that as well - and that does reflect the primary Hextall shortcoming of Hackstol.

 

Do you mean #79? I honestly believe that Hextall would not have recalled Hart last year. Could be wrong, but his pattern tells me he would have found another 'solution.'

 

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

Anyone who's "excited" about Niskanen and Braun should probably consult professional help.

 

Haha, I'm excited but need professional help for entirely different reasons.

 

I'm 'excited' that they can be the foils that allow Sanheim and Provy to play with more confidence, to learn from vets who have either won it all or come very close, and to play with actual talented defensemen.

 

 

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

That said, Hextall came in with a five year plan and was canned in Y4 after which other were able to reap the benefits of the ground he prepared. As mojo said, the half-rebuild wasn't pretty and really didn't accomplish the "goal" of being "definitely a playoff team".  I hated watching them to the extent that I pretty much checked out early last season.

 

Completely agree. Fletch doesn't Fletch without Hextall laying the (very tedious but necessary) groundwork.

 

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

And, yes, I've watched all of both games so far this year.

 

 

Just to speak to some of this:

 

Weal - came over when Hextall ditched the Ghost of VLC (*cough* Holmgren *cough*)

Weise/Gordon - unquestioned mistakes, but nothing that locked down huge salary for term

Lehtera - may I introduce you to Morgan Frost and Joel Farabee?

Gudas - a more than serviceable NHL player who came over in the trade that included a pick that was traded for... Travis Konecny

AMac - a great example of Holmgren's influence...

 

 

I get all the nuances, and my position is also very nuanced. I'm not criticizing Hextall per se - as I was kind bummed when he was canned - I'm just pointing out the very noticeable difference in mood. There are a lot of factors that have contributed to the turnaround. Some of it is personnel (AV speaks with the right amount of authority, hard-assery, and humour), some is personality (micromanager, compartmentalized groups vs what appears to be a more collegiate atmosphere), etc. 

 

 

 

 

[flyercanuck]

3 hours ago, brelic said:

 

 

 

I don;t think we can understate the damage Hextall did to the franchise. I was reading a bit from a STH that mentioned just how many things were stopped under Hextall and are now reappearing (things like discounts, meet and greet events, social activities, access, etc). On top of that, he was icing a terrible product to watch.

 

The dark cloud around the franchise seems to be lifting.

 

 Ya...it's really too bad we FINALLY, after 30 effin years got what looks like a franchise goalie. And it sucks that for the first time EVER, the Flyers look to have drafted and developed a top pairing defenceman. And maybe ANOTHER top pairing defenceman. And what looks like several more NHL calibre depth at the position. And about 4 or 5 LINES of depth at the forward position just starting to knock on the door.

 

 The dark cloud is lifting...thanks in large part to the guys drafting. If we ever win a cup, Hextall will likely have more to do with it than anyone else in management. He may not have been great at buying free agents (large in part cause he couldn't because of the cap mess left to him) and he might have been a control freak...and he probably had to go. But he sure as heck did help dig this franchise out. 

[brelic]

1 minute ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 Ya...it's really too bad we FINALLY, after 30 effin years got what looks like a franchise goalie. And it sucks that for the first time EVER, the Flyers look to have drafted and developed a top pairing defenceman. And maybe ANOTHER top pairing defenceman. And what looks like several more NHL calibre depth at the position. And about 4 or 5 LINES of depth at the forward position just starting to knock on the door.

 

 The dark cloud is lifting...thanks in large part to the guys drafting. If we ever win a cup, Hextall will likely have more to do with it than anyone else in management. He may not have been great at buying free agents (large in part cause he couldn't because of the cap mess left to him) and he might have been a control freak...and he probably had to go. But he sure as heck did help dig this franchise out. 

 

Oh c'mon FC, you know me better than that!

 

Of course all the stuff Hextall did with drafting was pure wizardry. He stocked them cupboards like they've never been stocked before. And beyond Hart, we have at least two other potential star goalies in the system. I'd say I was a fan of 90% of what Hextall was doing. And I was fine with him taking the time necessary to get there because I believed in his vision.

 

I was just talking about mood around the team. It was not good. The players, the fans, it just seemed blah. 

 

[radoran]

1 minute ago, brelic said:

Do you mean #79? I honestly believe that Hextall would not have recalled Hart last year. Could be wrong, but his pattern tells me he would have found another 'solution.'

 

Fletch didn't call up Hart (sorry for the # typo) until he was basically forced to.

 

2 minutes ago, brelic said:

I'm just pointing out the very noticeable difference in mood.

 

I can tell you that my mood is certainly changed.  But, again, that's primarily due to 79.

 

Wouldn't surprise me if he's had a similar effect on the guys on the ice.

 

[jammer2]

Much like rad...have to admit I checked out early last year. Just disgusted with the losing to the point I couldn't stomach it anymore. 

 

 Buying center ice package quicker than Carter Hart jerseys flying off the shelf!! FINALLY....A FRANCHISE GOALIE!! Exciting times people a whole new era in Flyer hockey!!

[brelic]

7 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

Fletch didn't call up Hart (sorry for the # typo) until he was basically forced to.

 

Yeah, I know, but I feel like Hexy would have been scanning the waiver wire for goalie #9, and then strapped on the pads himself to be #10 in a pinch lol.

 

7 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

 

I can tell you that my mood is certainly changed.  But, again, that's primarily due to 79.

 

Wouldn't surprise me if he's had a similar effect on the guys on the ice.

 

 

Absolutely. Love Hart. More than just his talent, he seems like a genuinely special human.

 

 

[radoran]

11 minutes ago, brelic said:

Yeah, I know, but I feel like Hexy would have been scanning the waiver wire for goalie #9, and then strapped on the pads himself to be #10 in a pinch lol.

 

Well, it's not like Hart started out dominating in the AHL - 3.05/.902 wasn't exactly screaming "franchise goalie."

 

I know he had a bad start and righted the ship a bit - and that the Phantoms weren't exactly a powerhouse.

 

But the same thing was said about Ghost, who did get the call due to injury and played himself onto the roster.

 

Of course, we'll never know.

 

I do think there's something to be said for not rushing kids into the league. And current poster child Nolan Patrick was also a Hextall decision...

[flyercanuck]

49 minutes ago, brelic said:

 

Oh c'mon FC, you know me better than that!

 

 

 

 I do.