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Don't Expect Much From an "Aggressive Retool"


Howie58
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1 hour ago, mojo1917 said:

It is hard to see where the cap space necessary to afford a high impact star player can be generated.  Then how does that big name player get lured into signing an extension?

 

It's that when they have cap money they spend it like a drunken sailor on his first shore leave in nine months. Whatever the biggest, shiniest thing they see in front of them right then and there is what they want more than anything else.

 

The thought of banking some of it and being open as a place where if some UFA/trade opportunity presents itself never occurs to them.

 

Because the definitely a playoff team only needs two or three moves and they can be right there in mix to make the playoffs and then *say it with me now* anything can happen!

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37 minutes ago, radoran said:

Because the definitely a playoff team only needs two or three moves and they can be right there in mix to make the playoffs and then *say it with me now* anything can happen!

I've said it elsewhere, it gets a lot of negative play in this forum but there is a kernel of truth to it.

That's not saying the goal should be to build a team that "just squeaks into the tournament" either. 

 

Looking back I can't say with certainty that there was a "go for it" moment post Chris Pronger.

That's many years of icing players that knew they weren't good enough for a deep run. 

 

I don't see where a magic wand is waved and the team is challenging for a title next year. 

I can see where things can be done to improve the roster and the way the team plays, then try to build upon that momentum. 

At some point the analytics and scouting should begin to bear fruit in both acquisition and development of talent at least from a stand point of being evidence based rather than relying on the eye test.

Then there's the coaching situation.

I don't have high hopes there either.  I don't think Fletcher will be allowed an off the board style hire.  Even though I think that's what's required. 

 

 

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My only concern "psychologically," is that Flyer leadership looks back at 2007-08 as a model and says, "we had a really bad 2006-07 and made some trades and voila, we had ECF Final against the Pens."  My problem is that there was no sustained core from that group or the subsequent SCF group (heck, that was blown up/traded).  With Homer and others still around, they might see a quick fix as OK.  That was still the transition period from the non-salary cap.  This is a new era.  

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Is there any reason in Chuckles tenure here to believe that the Flyers will improve anytime prior to him being relieved of his duties? I say nay nay. Unless he is being very sly and trying to bottom out next year for Connor Bedard. 

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12 minutes ago, flyer4ever said:

Is there any reason in Chuckles tenure here to believe that the Flyers will improve anytime prior to him being relieved of his duties? I say nay nay. Unless he is being very sly and trying to bottom out next year for Connor Bedard. 

 

 There is nothing in his history of being a GM that says he has the shrewdness to pull that off.

 

 I could see him trading the Flyers 1st next year for Ryan Suter...and then the Flyers pick being the lottery winner. That would have Chuckie written all over it.

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3 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

Looking back I can't say with certainty that there was a "go for it" moment post Chris Pronger.

That's many years of icing players that knew they weren't good enough for a deep run. 

 

That's just not at all how the organization* carried itself then and still does.

 

I like a lot of what is in the system. I'd be on board with seeing how they come together.

 

But you just know that the spend to the cap for best player available phillyosophy is going to rear it's ugly head...

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34 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

That's just not at all how the organization* carried itself then and still does.

 

I like a lot of what is in the system. I'd be on board with seeing how they come together.

 

But you just know that the spend to the cap for best player available phillyosophy is going to rear it's ugly head...

And theres the problem. Clarke and Homer's BPA scale is arrogantly, stubbornly ignorantly different than the reality scale. Always has been.

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1 hour ago, flyer4ever said:

Is there any reason in Chuckles tenure here to believe that the Flyers will improve anytime prior to him being relieved of his duties? I say nay nay. Unless he is being very sly and trying to bottom out next year for Connor Bedard. 

From where the team is now?

Oh, most certainly. 

All he has to do is get Couturier back on the ice and they're better.

 

Now would be the time to bottom out though, like I said play the young NCAA players. It seems to me that there are 25 3rd liners in the system, just throw the middle talent at the opposition in waves.

 

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1 hour ago, flyercanuck said:

 

 I could see him trading the Flyers 1st next year for Ryan Suter...and then the Flyers pick being the lottery winner. That would have Chuckie written all over it.

No you can't. 

Just stop it with this -lest you manifest it by speaking it into existence. 

 

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9 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

No you can't. 

Just stop it with this -lest you manifest it by speaking it into existence. 

 

 

 Fletcher doesn't need any manifesting, he's made a career of throwing away draft picks for not so good players.

 

 He's been here for 3 drafts and he's already traded a 1st, and 3-2nds plus a bunch of lower picks. He's like a dumber Paul Holmgren.

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On 3/31/2022 at 11:30 AM, Howie58 said:

Candidly, Hayes' contract is more bothersome in my mind.  With Ellis--as I've said before, I hope we don't have another Mike Rathje on our hands.  


Yeah Hayes will play good enough to justify paying him a solid $4 - $4.5 mil per year. The problem is….yeah enough said. Supposedly he’s well liked for whatever that’s worth.

 

As to Ellis I’m afraid we’ve already got a Rathje situation on our hands. Until he plays the games, stays in the lineup night in night out he’s not even another Rathje or a Hatcher. Those guys, broken down as they were, still managed to play some games for the Flyers.

 

 

Edited by GratefulFlyers
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On 3/31/2022 at 3:01 PM, mojo1917 said:

I don't think Fletcher will be allowed an off the board style hire.  Even though I think that's what's required. 


Your post made a lot of sense to me until this, where I don’t follow you. What exactly is an “off the board” HC? I tend to think the new Giroux-less Flyers could benefit more from a tried and true professional, a guy with many NHL games, and NHL PO games on his resume. 
 

Without looking who’s available or who’s likely to be I can’t offer any names. But in general I’d stay away from any kind of experiment regarding the coaching staff. If that’s what you meant by “off the board,” the Flyers tried that a few times already with only limited success. 

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@GratefulFlyers

 

By off the board I mean "not a name". 

@OccamsRazor mentioned the a guy from the NCAA and

 USHL, Mike Hastings.  He has been successful at Minnesota State and would bring energy and a good resume of teaching winning developmental hockey. 

He is not really off the board, he will most likely coach in the NHL someday.

He would have a plan and would not be from the good ol' boy network. He and Fletcher could set a course and build a program.  

 

Even though I would love to see John Tortorella v Philly beat writers, he has a set expiration date and I think would be too much side show, not enough forward thinking.

 

Alain Vigneault was/is a big name successful NHL coach. He couldn't build on his first season's results. I don't think a retread NHL guy is what is needed. 

I think the hire should be a successful major junior coach or a similar developmental league. I am also 75% confident senior advisors don't see it my way either.

 

I'm fully prepared for the Paul Maurice experience,  which will most likely escalate my waning interest in the team.

 

 

Edited by mojo1917
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8 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

Flyers could benefit more from a tried and true professional, a guy with many NHL games, and NHL PO games on his resume. 
 

Without looking who’s available or who’s likely to be I can’t offer any names

 

So, Alain Vigneault?

Edited by ruxpin
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