Flyers 2023-24: A Post-Season Appraisal

[mojo1917]

1 hour ago, OccamsRazor said:

York/Sanheim

McDonald/Drysdale 

Andrea/Risto

Zamula/Seeler

That's not bad right there

[OccamsRazor]

1 minute ago, mojo1917 said:

That's not bad right there

 

It's what I think not a playoff contender yet but it is time for these prospects to be learning on the job so they can be the guys who will be ready for when the playoff push is real. IMHO.

 

In a rebuild let the kids take their bumps and bruises now to prepare them for the rigors ahead.

[GratefulFlyers]

2 hours ago, mojo1917 said:

I'd like to see what that Drysdale kid with all that talent can do after some decent coaching.  

 

Me too - all of us I'm sure - but I wonder about "all that talent." I'm too lazy to look ... did he like blow everybody away in Juniors or what?

 

He can skate and he's a RHD, both of which are a Big Deal. But frankly I wasn't exactly impressed by his hockey IQ either even-strength or on the PP. Granted it's a tiny sample, and granted the Flyers' PP is such a mess no one looks good on it. But I was hoping for more than "he's got wheels."

 

I'm not looking for reasons to knock the guy and I love that he's what, 21 years old? As long as Drysdale is the coachable type Shaw should be able to help him tremendously.

[RonJeremy]

4 hours ago, CoachX said:

based on what?

 

It seems logical to most that Briere took the best offer available. But you keep saying there were better offers and he didnt take them. If thats true, hes incompetent. Where are you getting information that says there were better offers?

 You asked based on what? Based on common sense, that's what. Do you think that only one team was interested in a top end player like Gauthier? You said Its logical that Briere took the best offer, since when have the Flyers done anything logical. I didn't say better offers ,I said other offers and what's a better offer in my mind might not be a better offer to Briere. It's common sense that there were multiple offers for a guy like Gauthier. I know for a fact Colorado was one team. Even if Drysdale had alot of upside,its obvious that Briere didnt factor in his chronic injury history. I would rather have a guy with a little less upside who can actually stay in the lineup. Since we will never know what the other offers were , there is no way to know, what Briere turned down. To sum it up, after being burned with Ellis and Patrick I would not have traded for a guy like Drysdale. 

Edited April 23 by RonJeremy

[RonJeremy]

1 hour ago, mojo1917 said:

That's not bad right there

Look at our first pair and compare it to Trouba and Fox. It's not bad but it surely isn't good enough. Due to years of mediocrity, we as Flyer fans are suffering from a condition known as the law of diminishing expectations. 

Edited April 23 by RonJeremy

[CoachX]

47 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

You said Its logical that Briere took the best offer, since when have the Flyers done anything logical. I didn't say better offers ,I said other offers and what's a better offer in my mind might not be a better offer to Briere. It's common sense that there were multiple offers for a guy like Gauthier. I know for a fact Colorado was one team. Even if Drysdale had alot of upside,its obvious that Briere didnt factor in his chronic injury history. I would rather have a guy with a little less upside who can actually stay in the lineup. Since we will never know what the other offers were , there is no way to know, what Briere turned down. To sum it up, after being burned with Ellis and Patrick I would not have traded for a guy like Drysdale. 

Your entire argument is based on YOUR assumptions. Just because the idiots prior to Briere did things a certain way, doesn't mean he is going to. That is why they are no longer here, and he is. Okay, I agree. You said, "other" offers. I just held with the logic that a GM is going to make the best deal he can, and took the "best" offer. Your response to that is, he didn't, because any of Holmgren/Fletcher/Hextall wouldn't have. I mean, seriously? That's the argument? You said Briere didn't factor Drysdale's injury history. How could you actually know this? Were you in the room? Are you Briere? You also said you "know for a fact" that Colorado made an offer. Do you know what that offer was? If you do, could you share it so we can all decide if it was better than Drysdale? For that matter, are you saying the offer was better? If you knew that to be true I would think you would lead with that argument.  I will agree with you on your summation of Patrick and Ellis, even though Patrick was not traded for, and I get you being disenchanted with a guy who has a history of injuries.

 

However, the sky isnt actually falling. It was an acorn

Edited April 23 by CoachX

[RonJeremy]

17 minutes ago, CoachX said:

your entire argument is based on YOUR assumptions. Just because the idiots prior to briere did things a certain way, doesnt mean he is going to. that is why they are no longer here, and he is. Okay, I agree. You said, "other" offers. I just held with the logic that a GM is going to make the best deal he can, and took the "best" offer. Your response to that is that he didn't, because any of Holmgren/Fletcher/Hextall wouldn't have. I mean, seriously? That's the argument? You said Briere didn't factor Drysdale's injury history. How could you actually know this? Where you in the room? Are you Briere? You also said you "know for a fact" that Colorado made an offer. Do you know what that offer was? If you do, could you share it so we can all decide if it was better that Drysdale. For that matter, are you saying the offer was better? If you knew that to be true I would think you would lead with that argument.  I will agree with you on your summation of Patrick and Ellis, even though Patrick was not traded for, and I get you being disenchanted with a guy who has a history of injuries.

 

However, the sky isnt actually falling. It was an acorn

And what do you think your argument is based on? It's based on the assumption that Briere got the best deal he could. Were you part of the conference call as a special advisor during the trade?You are also assuming Briere isn't gonna make the same mistakes as our previous GMs. He just signed Fedetov for three million a year for two years,  that sounds very much like the Clarke/Homer/Fletcher school of thought. I can use the same tactics as you, arguing for the sake if arguing. If Briere took into account Drysdales injuries then he wouldn't have made the trade. We are in no position to take any gambles and we are gonna lose this one.

[mojo1917]

51 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

Look at our first pair and compare it to Trouba and Fox.

Trouba is playing 3rd pair minutes right now.

I think Makar/Towes is the most dynamic top pair in the league.

You're right, York and Sanhiem aren't near those guys. But then who is?

Fox and Trouba aren't my top anything unless we're talking cheap shots (Fox) and Elbows (Trouba) Actually I like Trouba-but Fox can **** off forever.

Did you see your boy Noah Dobson got abused last night for the game winner? Good times, Martinook made that whole team look stupid but Dobson really got tooled and I'm here for it. 

 

York isn't finished developing, he's 23, a baby. I'm expecting him to get better. 

Dude played almost 30 minutes a night with a bad shoulder, and was the best player on the Flyers for most of that time. 

I think there's more to that kid's game, I like the pick of him over that little Caufield **** every day. 

 

[CoachX]

6 minutes ago, RonJeremy said:

And what do you think your argument is based on? It's based on the assumption that Briere got the best deal he could. Were you part of the conference call as a special advisor during the trade?You are also assuming Briere isn't gonna make the same mistakes as our previous GMs. He just signed Fedetov for three million a year for two years,  that sounds very much like the Clarke/Homer/Fletcher school of thought. I can use the same tactics as you, arguing for the sake if arguing. If Briere took into account Drysdales injuries then he wouldn't have made the trade. We are in no position to take any gambles and we are gonna lose this one.

My argument is based off logic. Professional hockey GM's dont ignore the best deal on the table for a lesser deal. Some apparently suck at this. It is a FACT, not conjecture or assumption, that Gautier forced this trade. That makes it another FACT, that the Flyers had no leverage and were forced to move him. Tehy didn't want to. They had to make a deal . So they secured one of those "coveted' second rounders everyone around here freaks out over, and a former #6, first round pick. Specifically, a guy with tremendous upside.  I'm not assuming Briere did anything but trade a number 5 overall pick, for a number 6 overall pick, with a 2nd to sweeten it. I think Briere, that's right THINK, Briere took the injuries into account, and thought this was still the best deal he could get.

 

So, what was offered by these other clubs? Colorado for example? What were the willing to give up for Gautier?

 

I'll hang up and wait for your answer

 

Edited April 23 by CoachX

[RonJeremy]

1 minute ago, mojo1917 said:

Trouba is playing 3rd pair minutes right now.

I think Makar/Towes is the most dynamic top pair in the league.

You're right, York and Sanhiem aren't near those guys. But then who is?

Fox and Trouba aren't my top anything unless we're talking cheap shots (Fox) and Elbows (Trouba) Actually I like Trouba-but Fox can **** off forever.

Did you see your boy Noah Dobson got abused last night for the game winner? Good times, Martinook made that whole team look stupid but Dobson really got tooled and I'm here for it. 

 

York isn't finished developing, he's 23, a baby. I'm expecting him to get better. 

Dude played almost 30 minutes a night with a bad shoulder, and was the best player on the Flyers for most of that time. 

I think there's more to that kid's game, I like the pick of him over that little Caufield **** every day. 

 

I wish we had some dmen elbowimg people in the face instead of a revolving door -6 softie like Drysdale. I like York ,I don't think he's a #1 but he's probably on his way to being a legit #2 guy, not flashy but steady,kind of like Desjardins. So what Dobson got abused, he scored 70 points and was a plus 12 on a mediocre Isles team.  He is alot closer to a true #1 dman than anyone we have. 

[AJgoal]

11 minutes ago, CoachX said:

So what was offered by these other clubs? Colorado for example?

According to Seravalli, Byram was on the table from Colorado. 

 

 

[radoran]

9 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

According to Seravalli, Byram was on the table from Colorado. 

 

I'm guessing his significant concussion history didn't thrill the Flyers?

 

Kid has 164 games in four years and three major concussions.

 

"Often injured" Jamie Drysdale has 17 fewer games in slightly less time.

 

Not sure one is a clear pick over the other.

 

One thing's for sure, if they'd taken Byram there'd be somebody saying that Drysdale was on the table.

 

[CoachX]

1 minute ago, radoran said:

 

I'm guessing his significant concussion history didn't thrill the Flyers?

 

Kid has 164 games in four years and three major concussions.

 

"Often injured" Jamie Drysdale has 17 fewer games in slightly less time.

 

Not sure one is a clear pick over the other.

 

One thing's for sure, if they'd taken Byram there'd be somebody saying that Drysdale was on the table.

 

I'm calling BS. We already established Briere does not worry about injuries. According to RJ (about Drysdale), "its obvious that Briere didnt factor in his chronic injury history"

[OccamsRazor]

17 minutes ago, AJgoal said:

According to Seravalli, Byram was on the table from Colorado. 

 

 

 

I've mentioned it here a few time it was supposed to be a Drysdale/Zegras package deal that once the Hayes deal fell through Danny no longer had the assets to acquire them both and was still trying to work something out for them till the last minute. Hence why Drysdale and Zegras finally signed their deals on like October 6th and 9th.

 

And warned many of yall that it may once again be tried at the draft or later to add the 2nd part of the deal that didn't go down.

 

I get it many do not like Zegras and don't want him.

 

Don't be mad at the messenger when it takes place later just relaying the news.

 

York, Jamie and Trevor are real good friends.

 

@radoran will be president of Trevor's fan club.

[radoran]

2 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

I get it many do not like Zegras and don't want him.

 

To the ones that do, just want until you see him play "defence".

 

2 minutes ago, OccamsRazor said:

York, Jamie and Trevor are real good friends.

 

@radoran will be president of Trevor's fan club.

 

Three young players who are friends given the keys to the kingdom with big money contracts and are seen as the foundation of the team going forward.

 

Will they have condos in Old City?

 

Asking for a fanbase.

 

[radoran]

4 minutes ago, CoachX said:

I'm calling BS. We already established Briere does not worry about injuries. According to RJ (about Drysdale), "its obvious that Briere didnt factor in his chronic injury history"

 

Some men just like to watch the world burn.

 

Or so I'm told.

 

Who got a match?

 

[CoachX]

2 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

To the ones that do, just want until you see him play "defence".

 

 

Three young players who are friends given the keys to the kingdom with big money contracts and are seen as the foundation of the team going forward.

 

Will they have condos in Old City?

 

Asking for a fanbase.

 

its the Flyer way

 

wash, rinse, repeat

[radoran]

1 minute ago, CoachX said:

its the Flyer way

 

wash, rinse, repeat

 

Look, it makes sense to trade for Luke Schenn.

 

He'll be playing with his brother.

 

They'll love it!

 

[ctid]

The Avs Cutter rumour, I heard (read) was Briere trying do do a Cutter for Byram straight up and the Avs wanted more. Have no idea what more was, but obviously it was too rich a ask for Briere and co.

 

There is also the well rumoured pitch to Montreal for Reinbacher straight up which they also refused to do.

 

I have no doubt Briere and co tried their utmost to get a good package back, and I'm still of the belief that Drysdale was the best they could get, plus the 2nd. Don't forget that pick, it's probably a high 2nd and that's very valuable!

 

I'm not worried about Drysdale's talent. The guy has a high hockey IQ and is by far the best skater we've had in recent memory and he is only 21...for most defenders that is infant stage. What I am worried about though is that we can't properly develop this talent, and in a few years he becomes a victim of a "hockey trade" and goes on to realise that talent at a different team by the mid 20's...I want him out of the heavy media and fan spot lights for two seasons and playing 3rd, sometimes 2nd pairing minutes 5-5 and give him QB PP1 with York on PP2, and pair him with Seeker for the next two seasons. Yes I know that they played together down the stretch and it wasn't pretty, but nothing was pretty during that awful run.

[RonJeremy]

47 minutes ago, CoachX said:

My argument is based off logic. Professional hockey GM's dont ignore the best deal on the table for a lesser deal. Some apparently suck at this. It is a FACT, not conjecture or assumption, that Gautier forced this trade. That makes it another FACT, that the Flyers had no leverage and were forced to move him. Tehy didn't want to. They had to make a deal . So they secured one of those "coveted' second rounders everyone around here freaks out over, and a former #6, first round pick. Specifically, a guy with tremendous upside.  I'm not assuming Briere did anything but trade a number 5 overall pick, for a number 6 overall pick, with a 2nd to sweeten it. I think Briere, that's right THINK, Briere took the injuries into account, and thought this was still the best deal he could get.

 

So, what was offered by these other clubs? Colorado for example? What were the willing to give up for Gautier?

 

I'll hang up and wait for your answer

 

Plenty of professional GMs make mistakes. I don't know what Colorado offered any more than you know what offers Briere turned down. I know we asked for Byrum,but they wanted a center and traded him to Buffalo for Mittlestadt. I don't know what the counter offer was. What are your thoughts on"The Professional " Briere signing an unproven goalie for 3 million? It doesn't seem to professional to me. I'm not saying I dislike Briere at all, let's just wait and see before he annoint him as a our savior. He is better than Shmuck but so are alot of people. I'm anxiously sitting by the phone waiting for it to ring.

[RonJeremy]

17 minutes ago, CoachX said:

its the Flyer way

 

wash, rinse, repeat

I heard he's about as good defensively as Drysdale.

[OccamsRazor]

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

To the ones that do, just want until you see him play "defence".

 

 

Kid already has 2 60 point season at 23 on very bad Duck teams and Flyer fans are crying about defense.

 

When Joel Farabee also terrible at defense and 24 and *checks notes* finally got to 50 points - ever gets to 60 points come talk to me.

 

Zegras had an injury year this year and still put up 31 points compared to Tyson's 33 in 77 so yeah miss me with the defense crap.

 

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

Three young players who are friends given the keys to the kingdom with big money contracts and are seen as the foundation of the team going forward.

 

Will they have condos in Old City?

 

Asking for a fanbase.

 

Come on bro we talking about Torts come back to reality.

 

What is the worst that could happen?

 

Dry Island the sequel anything at this point would be better than the shat we have seen the last decade and a half.

 

Depends on the price for me.

[RonJeremy]

30 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

I'm guessing his significant concussion history didn't thrill the Flyers?

 

Kid has 164 games in four years and three major concussions.

 

"Often injured" Jamie Drysdale has 17 fewer games in slightly less time.

 

Not sure one is a clear pick over the other.

 

One thing's for sure, if they'd taken Byram there'd be somebody saying that Drysdale was on the table.

 

Yes he was on the trainers table and the operating room table,multiple times.

[JR Ewing]

25 minutes ago, radoran said:

 

To the ones that do, just want until you see him play "defence".

 

 

Yup. It's not necessary for every forward to play Selke-level defense, but they do need to show some sort of attention to it.

[RonJeremy]

3 hours ago, GratefulFlyers said:

 

Me too - all of us I'm sure - but I wonder about "all that talent." I'm too lazy to look ... did he like blow everybody away in Juniors or what?

 

He can skate and he's a RHD, both of which are a Big Deal. But frankly I wasn't exactly impressed by his hockey IQ either even-strength or on the PP. Granted it's a tiny sample, and granted the Flyers' PP is such a mess no one looks good on it. But I was hoping for more than "he's got wheels."

 

I'm not looking for reasons to knock the guy and I love that he's what, 21 years old? As long as Drysdale is the coachable type Shaw should be able to help him tremendously.

Remember Alexandre Daigle he could skate, he just couldn't do anything else. I'm not worried about the coaching, I'm worried about him physically holding up in order to be coached.