Bryz Deserves Better Than This

[radoran]

And that list should rightfully start with Captain G.

With great power comes great responsibility...

[murraycraven]

And that list should rightfully start with Captain G.

-- You my friend are a smart smart person. I could not agree more...

[brelic]

-- You my friend are a smart smart person. I could not agree more...

[canoli]

I give Bryzgalov credit when he makes saves. When he doesn't I don't. What's so terrible about that? He should've had Del Zotto's goal in his glove but instead it goes in.

Look fans, we brought in "Bryz" so he could be a Difference-Maker not an "average" or a "good" goalie. His numbers are fine and yes, he's dealing with an unorganized, slow-witted team right now. But guess what? That's what he's paid to do, win games regardless. I'm not saying every game but last night was winnable IF - (if a lot of things, true) but IF Brygalov makes that pee-wee goalie stop. He didn't. So our slow, disorganized team is behind the 8 ball once again, 2 minutes into the fkn game. That sucks.

Is he "the reason" we lost? Of course not. We scored a lousy 5 or 6 goals in 6 games. Just don't go overboard with the praise, that's all I'm saying. He flat out sucked on that goal - 1:40 into the game.

[jammer2]

@brelic ha ha...a fitting picture if there ever was one! I still think fans are doing a knee jerk in general....judging the team a little to quickly on a small sample. Not they should not be alarmed, cause they are stinking, but think it will get better as the season goes on. I don't know if we could have swung the increase in the cap, but I would have been a lot more comfortable getting Arnott.....sigh.

[ruxpin]

Would you include Coots in a trade for Yandle? I'm not sure I would... but I definitely would for E-L.

For Yandle, no. I don't know enough of E-L to answer intelligently. So based solely on my feelings about Coots, no on that, too.

EDIT: You have to admit it's somewhat comical when I choose to elaborate on the standard and obvious [" I don't know enough...to answer intelligently."] As if that's ever stopped me before.

[radoran]

I give Bryzgalov credit when he makes saves. When he doesn't I don't. What's so terrible about that? He should've had Del Zotto's goal in his glove but instead it goes in.

At least call the game right.

Del Zotto's shot was along the ice and slipped in between the post and the pad. Bryz MAYBE should have had it with his pad. There is NO WAY his glove was going to be anywhere near it.

2.19/.924 would be a "difference maker" on a team on which a goalie would make a difference.

But when your superstar, "best player in the world" has points in three of seven games, hasn't scored a goal since the second game of the season and has just two assists - both coming in a blowout - THAT'S the problem. Giroux was given the C because he is supposed to be a difference maker. And he simply hasn't been. At all.

When your team comes out and "superstar" wins 11 of 23 faceoffs while the next top two at the dot for the Flyers are 9 for 30 - that's a problem.

When your team has 1:17 of 5 on 3 and manages a grand total of one shot - that's a problem.

2.19/.924 is not the problem.

[Bertmega]

[Lucky13]

What if, for example, we are out of the playoff race come trading deadline? If you're Homer, do you quietly ask Timo if he's prepared to accept a trade to a contender who's looking for rental help? Maybe package him with someone else for a defensive prospect. I would certainly explore that if it were a realistic option.

I think this scenario might be our best/only chance to get better on D without giving up (at least) one of our best young forwards. Obviously this would net us a young prospect that would still need some time to develop, but it seems like a win/win -- Assuming Kimmo re-signs here in the off-season.

Kimmo's value at the deadline will be very high. Imagine being a contender and being able to bump your #6 defenseman out of your playoff lineup and replace him with Timonen. That's a serious difference-maker. Homer probably needs to start this conversation with #44's agent fairly soon...

Edited January 30, 2013 by Lucky13

[brelic]

I give Bryzgalov credit when he makes saves. When he doesn't I don't. What's so terrible about that? He should've had Del Zotto's goal in his glove but instead it goes in.

Look fans, we brought in "Bryz" so he could be a Difference-Maker not an "average" or a "good" goalie. His numbers are fine and yes, he's dealing with an unorganized, slow-witted team right now. But guess what? That's what he's paid to do, win games regardless. I'm not saying every game but last night was winnable IF - (if a lot of things, true) but IF Brygalov makes that pee-wee goalie stop. He didn't. So our slow, disorganized team is behind the 8 ball once again, 2 minutes into the fkn game. That sucks.

Is he "the reason" we lost? Of course not. We scored a lousy 5 or 6 goals in 6 games. Just don't go overboard with the praise, that's all I'm saying. He flat out sucked on that goal - 1:40 into the game.

"For the past three games our goaltender has let in nine goals total."

"How can he let in all these soft goals???"

"Ok, what happened to our goalie? Those are just bad goals."

"Third goal was soft. Low wrister from the top of the circle. He was inside the blue paint and still couldn't get his knees down and together quick enough."

"He was late on the read, and this is proven by the fact that he butterflied too late, didn't have his stick on the ice to protect his five-hole, and ultimately got beat there."

"There's a reason I've almost stopped posting on this board. We've played very rusty hockey; shoddy defense with tons of individual mistakes, tons of craptacular turnovers at the worst occasions, bad decisions, you name it, a traditional [...] PP looking like a train wreck and a toothless offense where the only guy who has created anything of worth is [...] with some individual performances. No cycling, no won board battles, no hustle, no won rebounds, no screens, no nothing.

So in spite of all that, one guy one the team has actually played pretty good. Most goals have been screens and deflections. If [...] saw the puck, he would've saved it. Now he was late, because he couldn't see the shot in time to react properly. Nevermind that our defense practically gave away the puck to a top scorer who uncontested in a prime scoring area could fire away with the help of our own defenders screening [...]. But yeah, of course it's [...] fault we're losing."

All of those posts sound like they could be about the Flyers. But they're about Lundqvist and the Rangers.

It sounds like you're blinded by your hatred for Bryz. That first goal was not a routine save. There were 4 people in the line of fire, Del Zotto is no slouch, and after a chaotic 45 seconds in the Flyers zone, the puck ended up behind the net. If those previous 45 seconds are erased by a smart, calm exit from the zone, that doesn't happen. But we're so disorganized in our own end that the opposition ends up getting chance after chance. Eventually they will go in, and they won't all be pretty.

You point to ONE goal that I wouldn't consider a bad one, but don't even mention the NUMEROUS other saves he made during the game, including a breakaway, to keep his sorry excuse for a team alive.

Bryz is not paid to win games. He cannot win games by himself. He's paid to stop the puck. He did that last night. The guys who are paid to put the put in the other net did not show up.

[ruxpin]

I think this scenario might be our best/only chance to get better on D without giving up (at least) one of our best young forwards. Obviously this would net us a young prospect that would still need some time to develop, but it seems like a win/win -- Assuming Kimmo re-signs here in the off-season.

Kimmo's value at the deadline will be very high. Imagine being a contender and being able to bump your #6 defenseman out of your playoff lineup and replace him with Timonen. That's a serious difference-maker. Homer probably needs to start this conversation with #44's agent fairly soon...

If we're on the outside looking in, I definitely try to move Timo. I love the guy, but it's a sound move strategically. I just still don't think we'll be on the outside looking in.

[canoli]

you couldn't be more wrong about DZ goal - whether he gloves it or kicks a pad out and blocks it (and you're right it woulda been a kick save, my mistake) - it was a routine stop he shoulda had. Watch it again you'll see what I mean. It's from the &(*&^(&* blue line for crying out loud, and yeah there's a couple guys in the way up high. But he had plenty of time (relatively speaking of course!) to flash the pad out and block it.

But i guess you're just intent on hammering me for criticizing the guy. Numerous times in this thread I've said "it wasn't his 'fault'" we lost and "we played terrible hockey for 2 periods" - but you ignore all that to make your point that I'm supposedly unfair to "Bryz."

the only reason I posted in this thread was because of the "deserves better" title. To me that's nonsense; he's been good, yes, I've said that many times already in this first 2 weeks of the season. But when he misses an easy save and all I read is "what a lousy buncha skaters we have" it seems a bit shortsighted.

In the end evaluating a loss comes down to "who was worse, the skaters or the goalie?" I say last night it was both but apparently I'm in the minority.

[mojo1917]

@canoli

i don't know man, that del zotto shot had eyes, it was low , hard and through a pile of people, the only thing i can think of to fault bryz for was not holding the post, but then he's not going to be square to the potential shooter DZ or tracking the play which could have gone d to d or even to the half wall opposite side of the rink... i thought it was a good/lucky shot.

[BearOnIce]

Guys, guys... back away from the ledge!

Look how little experience HALF our forwards have:

Read, 86 GP

Coots, 84 GP

B Schenn, 69 GP

Rinaldo, 69 GP

Sestito, 30 GP

McGinn, 4 GP

That's a green squad right there. It's gonna take some time for sure... and I don't mean a few games. It will take a few years!

Giroux is only 25. He's just starting his 5th NHL season, and he has about the same experience (292 GP) than those 6 guys COMBINED (342 GP).

I'm not trying to excuse them... but the Rangers are considered cup favorites. A few guys on TSN picked them to win it all. And we hung in there, and lost 2-1 ONLY because of special teams. Had we scored on our 5 on 3, it's a different game.

Let's see what you say in ten games. Signing Knuble? Letting Carle leave? Signing Leighton to backup? Boucher? Not getting Jagr for one more year for Giroux's line? Keeping Talbot. Not getting one step in puck-moving defenseman. Having basically 4 defensemen that should not even play in the NHL? Flyer cronyism lets Holmgren skate and will use Laviolette as the whipping boy skapegoat. He'll go to Columbus and win a Cup. Just watch.

[BearOnIce]

Guys, guys... back away from the ledge!

Look how little experience HALF our forwards have:

Read, 86 GP

Coots, 84 GP

B Schenn, 69 GP

Rinaldo, 69 GP

Sestito, 30 GP

McGinn, 4 GP

That's a green squad right there. It's gonna take some time for sure... and I don't mean a few games. It will take a few years!

Giroux is only 25. He's just starting his 5th NHL season, and he has about the same experience (292 GP) than those 6 guys COMBINED (342 GP).

I'm not trying to excuse them... but the Rangers are considered cup favorites. A few guys on TSN picked them to win it all. And we hung in there, and lost 2-1 ONLY because of special teams. Had we scored on our 5 on 3, it's a different game.

Let's see what you say in ten games. Signing Knuble? Letting Carle leave? Signing Leighton to backup? Boucher? Not getting Jagr for one more year for Giroux's line? Keeping Talbot. Not getting one step in puck-moving defenseman. Having basically 4 defensemen that should not even play in the NHL? Flyer cronyism lets Holmgren skate and will use Laviolette as the whipping boy skapegoat. He'll go to Columbus and win a Cup. Just watch.

[radoran]

you couldn't be more wrong about DZ goal - whether he gloves it or kicks a pad out and blocks it (and you're right it woulda been a kick save, my mistake) - it was a routine stop he shoulda had. Watch it again you'll see what I mean. It's from the &(*&^(&* blue line for crying out loud, and yeah there's a couple guys in the way up high. But he had plenty of time (relatively speaking of course!) to flash the pad out and block it.

But i guess you're just intent on hammering me for criticizing the guy. Numerous times in this thread I've said "it wasn't his 'fault'" we lost and "we played terrible hockey for 2 periods" - but you ignore all that to make your point that I'm supposedly unfair to "Bryz."

the only reason I posted in this thread was because of the "deserves better" title. To me that's nonsense; he's been good, yes, I've said that many times already in this first 2 weeks of the season. But when he misses an easy save and all I read is "what a lousy buncha skaters we have" it seems a bit shortsighted.

In the end evaluating a loss comes down to "who was worse, the skaters or the goalie?" I say last night it was both but apparently I'm in the minority.

I don't think anyone is "hammering" you.

Last night, you thought it was 50/50 skaters/goalie? Really? You saw a much different game.

I saw an offense that was quite frankly lucky to get a goal at all. An offense that managed one shot in nearly 80 seconds of 5 on 3. That won 34% of their faceoffs. That converted one of four power plays.

I saw a goalie who stopped 24 of 26 - including one on the power play.

If you call that 50/50 then, yes, you are just hating on Bryzgalov...

[brelic]

I had a reply all typed up... then I got the BSOD! My machine just up and died on me!!!

you couldn't be more wrong about DZ goal - whether he gloves it or kicks a pad out and blocks it (and you're right it woulda been a kick save, my mistake) - it was a routine stop he shoulda had. Watch it again you'll see what I mean. It's from the &(*&^(&* blue line for crying out loud, and yeah there's a couple guys in the way up high. But he had plenty of time (relatively speaking of course!) to flash the pad out and block it.

I did watch it again, and one particular angle (they only showed it once on the broadcast) was a straight line from the shooter to the net, and I could not see Bryz when that shot was fired. Ergo, Bryz could not see DZ or the puck. To me, that was not a routine save.

But i guess you're just intent on hammering me for criticizing the guy. Numerous times in this thread I've said "it wasn't his 'fault'" we lost and "we played terrible hockey for 2 periods" - but you ignore all that to make your point that I'm supposedly unfair to "Bryz."

Sorry if it seems like I'm hammering on you, canoli. I'm really not... I'm new to defending Bryz

To 'steal' a game, the rest of the team has to capitalize on solid goaltending. Even if that goal should have been stopped, he gave his team two full periods to smarten up and do something. He made tough stops, and the team responded by squandering PP opportunities to get back in the game, and didn't win the battles 5 on 5. It's not realistic to expect shutouts every time Bryz is supposed to 'steal' a game, which is what we needed last night.

[flyerrod]

I don't think anyone is "hammering" you.

Last night, you thought it was 50/50 skaters/goalie? Really? You saw a much different game.

I saw an offense that was quite frankly lucky to get a goal at all. An offense that managed one shot in nearly 80 seconds of 5 on 3. That won 34% of their faceoffs. That converted one of four power plays.

I saw a goalie who stopped 24 of 26 - including one on the power play.

If you call that 50/50 then, yes, you are just hating on Bryzgalov...

I think Bryz did great with the exception of his rebound control. He still needs to work on when to smother a shot and when to kick/deflect a shot away. When he has a guy who has been missed by the defense in front of the net, he needs to smother the shot, not kick it out and hope for the best. Bryz is not the reason the Flyers are losing by a long shot but he is still making mistakes that end up in the net.

[radoran]

I think Bryz did great with the exception of his rebound control. He still needs to work on when to smother a shot and when to kick/deflect a shot away. When he has a guy who has been missed by the defense in front of the net, he needs to smother the shot, not kick it out and hope for the best. Bryz is not the reason the Flyers are losing by a long shot but he is still making mistakes that end up in the net.

I am not at all saying Bryzgalov has been perfect - or even a "difference maker".

I am saying that the team has bigger problems and the theory that all Bryz needs to do is cut his SV% in half so the skaters can get a garbage point while playing like crap and scoring one goal is not a panacea for the problems.

Heavy is the jersey that has the C sewn upon it.

[murraycraven]

After playing hockey my entire life I have never seen a goalie get screened... it must have been Bryz's fault...

[canoli]

Okay forget it. From now on when I criticize Bryzgalov I'll add a disclaimer, something like: "The skaters sucked last night for 40 minutes" or "Bryzgalov wasn't the reason they lost"

Funny, I can see those "disclaimers" on my machine - when I hit post they're there - must be a crack in the interweb today...

btw "both" doesn't mean "50/50." Assigning a percentage of blame is tough to do. How does a bad goal at 1:50 affect a hockey team? You could say "they're professionals, get over it." You could also say "softies in the first 2 minutes begin to wear on you" I don't care how professional you are.

And finally, guys milling around the top of the circle != screen ... not in the NHL anyway.

[radoran]

Okay forget it. From now on when I criticize Bryzgalov I'll add a disclaimer, something like: "The skaters sucked last night for 40 minutes" or "Bryzgalov wasn't the reason they lost"

Funny, I can see those "disclaimers" on my machine - when I hit post they're there - must be a crack in the interweb today...

btw "both" doesn't mean "50/50." Assigning a percentage of blame is tough to do. How does a bad goal at 1:50 affect a hockey team? You could say "they're professionals, get over it." You could also say "softies in the first 2 minutes begin to wear on you" I don't care how professional you are.

And finally, guys milling around the top of the circle != screen ... not in the NHL anyway.

I just refuse to listen to excuses for the players.

You give up a goal? Here's an idea - score two. Don't fold the tents and be "disheartened."

That's not the way the game is played. Not in the NHL anyway.

The poor little dears got their knickers in a bunch? Give them a gold star for effort and a nice pat on the head. They'll do better next time.

I have called out Bryzgalov for playing like crap. I'm on record that he should be bought out.

I also call out Giroux for floating around, going five games without a goal and the only points in those games being two assists in a blowout (caveat - they were the first two Flyer goals in the blowout).

Faceoffs. Power play. etc. etc. etc.

Yes, the Rangers scored two goals - one on a power play that the skaters caused and then failed to kill. Yes, that means Bryzgalov "didn't win the game for them."

You know who else didn't "win the game for them?" The skaters who are expected to score goals. The rest of the team is being paid $65M to play. When they show up for 60 minutes, then I'll blame "stupid Bryz" for giving up 2 goals on 26 shots.

[OH1FlyersFan]

With great power comes great responsibility...

Yoda?

[MDFlyerFan]

For Bryz (or any goalie) to steal a game, he needs a lead. I'm only referencing last night's game not the entire season but he did not have a lead to work with.

MIssed the game but from what I've read on this thread; he didn't svck.

[radoran]

Yoda?

Uncle Ben.