Free Agency

[pilldoc]

[CoachX]

7 minutes ago, Podein25 said:

 

I'm frustrated

 

anti-frustration juice. cures all your ills

[mojo1917]

1 hour ago, SCFlyguy said:

That also frustrates me about people not caring how much players are paid and for how long.  In the pre-salary cap era, sure, it didn’t matter, because the Flyers would just spend their way out of bad contracts by signing someone else.

I fall into this category, if it's the right player I don't mind the team paying them.

I think the money is well spent on someone like Couturier.

I was never a fan of JvR 2.0. I thought Hayes was too much for too long, same with with Ristolianen. 

Not every situation is the same. That said, I understand your point here.

 

I also realize I have zero control over what these people do. 

I can skip going to the rink or not buy gear, but that's it.

Comcast isn't missing my 600$ or so yearly contribution.

 

It is not a great time to be a fan of this hockey team. 

[TropicalFruitGirl26]

3 hours ago, CoachX said:

When I watch sports, I do so from an entertainment value. Specifically, how much does it hold my interest. I do not watch from the  platform of championship or bust. I grew up in the 70s watching all Philly sports, captivated by the payers. As long as my team was fun to watch, I would watch, hoping they might win a championship. If Mike Schmidt had never won a WS, I would not be reflecting back on how the team was a failure and a waste of my time.

 

The Flyers were always competitive and entertaining. Therefore, as a fan, I was passionate about them. Now, they are unwatchable. I don't care whose fault is was/is. I don't care about the money, or the term. Im not a GM and Im not going to pretend to be one on this forum. I don't want to wait 5 years before tuning back in. I want them to make moves that have some impact. They don't hit, they don't pass, they don't score, and they don't fight. There is no heart, pride or identity. Its a shame. I miss Flyer hockey

 

Personally Id love the "shiny new toy". Id much rather have that than a box of legos that I might be able to build into race car later on. I want a polarizing coach. I want an elite level player to root for.

 

I get that I am in the minority here. Many say to do it another way. Youre probably right. But this is how I feel about it, and Im good with that

 

I don't agree with all you posted here, because I am one of those that DOES like to play a bit of armchair GM and I want whomever is in charge to do things to set things up for long term success...even if it means biting the bullet in the short term.

That said, since all that GM'ing stuff really IS out of my hands, as a fan, I can completely get behind what you say in terms of just "enjoying your team" (or trying to), and be entertained by a product that is worth your time, attention, and money....even if that same product isn't exactly NHL championship quality at the time.
As long as you can stand to watch it, root for it, maybe even dare hope they get on some improbable run....sure, I totally see that point of view because at the end of the day, we are all fans and that is what we all really want: A team we can watch and root for, a star player we can call our own, a chance, no matter how small, to sneak into the post season and see what the team can do.

I've run into my share of 'killjoys' within the Lightning fanbase before, and more recently, within the Wild fanbase, that seem happiest when there is much to complain about, who sit and try to snuff out my enjoyment of the teams (such as they are) with tons of nonsense about how THEY know what should be done with the team and hinting I am an idiot for thinking otherwise.

Again, I DO participate in fantasy GM'ing, and say what I would do, or would like to see done, criticize the real GM's....praise them...then dump on them again for whatever reason.
But in the end, I try not to do it in such a way as to ruin someone else's enjoyment of the team...and with the idea in mind, that I am JUST a message board fan and no amount of ranting and raving and irritating others is gonna make a damned bit of difference to the real team, and all it will do is alienate myself to others.

I could boycott and not pay my money for anything towards the team and try to hurt them in the wallet....but then, I would need tens of thousands of others to do the same for that to have any effect...and even then, I would be denying myself of any enjoyment of the team and then will have become that nuisance complainer once again!

(Trips while getting off soapbox.  You Cretins won't even help a lady who has fallen off her rant box?? Shame on you.  )

Edited June 2, 2022 by TropicalFruitGirl26

[CoachX]

2 minutes ago, mojo1917 said:

I was never a fan of JvR 2.0. I thought Hayes was too much for too long, same with with Ristolianen

The JVR thing is the one that bugs me the most. He never lived up to expectations the first time, played well away, then has been an absolute dead weight since coming back. I personally think the guy couldn't hack being in PHilly the first time, and the second time has just been all about money. He isnt a big time player, never has been. He's soft mentally and physically. They should have seen this one coming.

 

Many of us did

[CoachX]

4 minutes ago, TropicalFruitGirl26 said:

 

I don't agree with all you posted here, because I am one of those that DOES like to play a bit of armchair GM and I want whomever is in charge to do things to set things up for long term success...even if it means biting the bullet in the short term.

That said, since all that GM'ing stuff really IS out of my hands, as a fan, I can completely get behind what you say in terms of just "enjoying your team" (or trying to), and be entertained by a product that is worth your time, attention, and money....even if that same product isn't exactly NHL championship quality at the time.
As long as you can stand to watch it, root for it, maybe even dare hope they get on some improbable run....sure, I totally see that point of view because at the end of the day, we are all fans and that is what we all really want: A team we can watch and root for, a star player we can call our own, a chance, no matter how small, to sneak into the post season and see what the team can do.

I've run into my share of 'killjoys' within the Lightning fanbase before, and more recently, within the Wild fanbase, that seem happiest when there is much to complain about, who sit and try to snuff out my enjoyment of the teams (such as they are) with tons of nonsense about how THEY know what should be done with the team and hinting I am an idiot for thinking otherwise.

Again, I DO participate in fantasy GM'ing, and say what I would do, or would like to see done, criticize the real GM's....praise them...then dump on them again for whatever reason.
But in the end, I try not to do it in such a way as to ruin someone else's enjoyment of the team...and with the idea in mind, that I am JUST a message board fan and no amount of ranting and raving and irritating others is gonna make a damned bit of difference to the real team, and all it will do is alienate myself to others.

I could boycott and not pay my money for anything towards the team and try to hurt them in the wallet....but then, I would need tens of thousands of others to do the same for that to have any effect...and even then, I would be denying myself of any enjoyment of the team and then will have become that nuisance complainer once again!

(Trips while getting off soapbox.  You Cretins won't even help a lady who has fallen off her rant box?? Shame on you.  )

[radoran]

9 minutes ago, CoachX said:

They should have seen this one coming.

 

Many of us did

 

Right, and he's a poster child for the problem.

 

Who was the #2 available FA that year, after Tavares said he's wasn't interested (dodging that particular bullet)?

 

JVR.

 

So the Flyers went out an got the best shiny toy that was available to add to their roster.

 

You didn't like it then. Don't like it now. It's almost like all you want to do is complain

 

Seriously, though, the Flyers felt they were a scoring winger away from contention. so they went out and got the best one they could - for five years.

 

how is that ANY different from what they SAY they intend to do now?

 

lather rinse repeat

 

What they WANT is a Panarin level player. what they'll GET is a streaky Swede coming off a career season...

 

But they "HAVE to do SOMETHING" for next season and so a Seven year $63+M contract is "it"?

 

I've seen this movie.

 

it's star is about to be dealt or bought out, to facilitate the sequel...

Edited June 2, 2022 by radoran

[CoachX]

10 minutes ago, radoran said:

You didn't like it then. Don't like it now. It's almost like all you want to do is complain

i've given in to peer pressure

 

10 minutes ago, radoran said:

how is that ANY different from what they SAY they intend to do now?

the difference in my mind, they had already been there/done that with that guy. And I don't think he was as good then, as some of the possibilities now. And even though I don't like it now, with first hand knowledge as a factor, I don't recall hating it when they did it

[Podein25]

21 minutes ago, radoran said:

what they'll GET is a streaky Swede coming off a career season...

 

I believe Kadri is Canadian

[icehole]

I started reading through this, but there's a lot of reading and I'm not good at reading.  I'm torn on the Johnny G thing.  Whenever it's been mentioned, I initially don't want anything to do with it.  I don't want any tiny guys on this team.  I think size has something to do with disappearing in the playoffs.

However, 115 points is 115 points.  Contract year or not Giroux never had 115.  Sure the price tag will be high.  Sure, they'll be tight on cap.  Who cares.  I hope they go for it every year.  Get the biggest most expensive names you can get under the cap.  If it fails, you might be at the bottom of the league for a while (sounds like a familiar spot)  Maybe a player like that can bring some excitement for once.

[SCFlyguy]

That is like coming in first in a pie eating contest and your prize is more pie.

[flyercanuck]

17 hours ago, CoachX said:

 

 

Personally Id love the "shiny new toy". Id much rather have that than a box of legos that I might be able to build into race car later on. I want a polarizing coach. I want an elite level player to root for.

 

I get that I am in the minority here. Many say to do it another way. Youre probably right. But this is how I feel about it, and Im good with that

 

I'd like to say I respect your opinion...but I just want to shove you down an escalator full of old ladies. 

[flyercanuck]

11 hours ago, icehole said:

I started reading through this, but there's a lot of reading and I'm not good at reading.  I'm torn on the Johnny G thing.  Whenever it's been mentioned, I initially don't want anything to do with it.  I don't want any tiny guys on this team.  I think size has something to do with disappearing in the playoffs.

However, 115 points is 115 points.  Contract year or not Giroux never had 115.  Sure the price tag will be high.  Sure, they'll be tight on cap.  Who cares.  I hope they go for it every year.  Get the biggest most expensive names you can get under the cap.  If it fails, you might be at the bottom of the league for a while (sounds like a familiar spot)  Maybe a player like that can bring some excitement for once.

 

115 points on Calgary doesn't do the Flyers any good whatsoever. This is the problem. We pay guys for what they used to do elsewhere. Or what they hope they do here. Not what they actually do here.

 

 I'm sure if Gaudreau doesn't sign in Calgary Fletcher and co. will back up the Brinks truck for him. And he may well come in and have a....80 point season. Then 70. 60. How do we get out from THIS contract? We're still paying Haysees buyout. And Ristolainens. And Bryz'. Who's the next shiny thing we can sign and continue this insanity? 

 

Gaudreau won't be playing for kick his azz Sutter. He won't be playing on a line with Lindholm and Tkachuk. He'll just be getting paid like he is. And producing like he's playing with Lazyazz Hayes. 

[CoachX]

4 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

115 points on Calgary doesn't do the Flyers any good whatsoever. This is the problem. We pay guys for what they used to do elsewhere. Or what they hope they do here. Not what they actually do here

Isn't that kinda what every team does when they sign a new player who's UFA? 

 

That 115 would get me to tune back in. And I think we can agree, the Flyers top priority should be making me happy 

Edited June 3, 2022 by CoachX

[CoachX]

4 hours ago, flyercanuck said:

 

I'd like to say I respect your opinion...but I just want to shove you down an escalator full of old ladies. 

That's just mean 

[radoran]

30 minutes ago, CoachX said:

That 115 would get me to tune back in.

 

Would the (on pace for) 70 the year before do it?

 

Or the (on pace for) 68 the year before that?

 

He's been better than a point per game in three seasons, and 78 in 79 in another.

 

The other half of his eight seasons, he isn't.

 

You want to pay $9+M for a guy who isn't a point per game player in half of his seasons because he scored 115 in a contract year?

 

'cause I don't...

 

YMMV which is totally fair.

[flyercanuck]

4 hours ago, CoachX said:

Isn't that kinda what every team does when they sign a new player who's UFA? 

 

That 115 would get me to tune back in. And I think we can agree, the Flyers top priority should be making me happy 

 

Ya....he's not getting 115 again after he signs his contract. And he certainly isn't getting it playing with Hayes and Kessel on the Flyers. 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

I want no part of Gaudreau or any other free agent forward. No to Kadri, Forsberg, Domi, Giroux, etc... The eclectic would be that they would carry the team to the playoffs and when they doesn't happen, they'd be made scapegoats for Flutch's ineptitude on how to build a team. The only player that I'd like to see them target is someone like Connor Murphy, a person who can help balance out the left/right defense pairings. Other than that, this should be a season in which deadweight gets cut. And the fact that there still isn't a head coach place means that said coach won't even get a chance to fairly assess the roster and make recommendations for what they want. They're going to be stuck with whatever crap Schmuck acquires.

[CoachX]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:53 AM, radoran said:

Would the (on pace for) 70 the year before do it?

 

Or the (on pace for) 68 the year before that

It did when Giroux was doing it

[radoran]

32 minutes ago, CoachX said:

It did when Giroux was doing it

 

Not for me.

 

Thus the YMMV.

 

If you're looking to replicate the past 10 years, go for it.

 

[flyer4ever]

What does JG want? What do all the shiny toys want? Do they want the money , does he want to come home, does he want a cup, does he care if he plays for a team that sucks, what does he want? 

IMHO, Philly is currently at the bottom of the list for desirable places to play. Which is the saddest part of this whole discussion. Ed Snider didn't leave this dogs breakfast behind when he departed.

 The team sucks, there appears to be no plan whatsoever to get better, winter, and let's be honest, a not very good winning tradition in major league sports. So how does Chuckles sell it to UFA's or potential offer sheets? Seriously, what is life like in Philly? Is it a place a 27 year old millionaire wants to settle and raise a family? (I know JG isn't 27, I am speaking generically, don't go off on it).

This is why you need to build a foundation by drafting and development.

[Dumpster Hockey]

There are two scenarios floating around in my head right now concerning the free agent market and what the Philadelphia Flyers have to do. One major concern in all of this is the limited amount of slary cap they have to work with which is going to make things difficult for them to sign a hig price tag player unless other things get done involving JVR, Hayes, Konecny and possibly Laughton. 

 

The next thing is what top priced talent would want to come to the Flyers who say they are going to be retooling , but honestly with what they have it is more likely this is a rebuild. 

 

The next thing is this team really does not have that team identity player which most teams have. When you think of the Edmonton Oilers you immediately think of Connor McDavid. When you think of the Toronto Maple Leafs you think of Auston Matthews. In Philadelphia we have Sean Couturier and although he is a very good player he is not the type of player that is the identity of the franchise. So then should the Flyers go out and get that sort of player that is going to get the fan base all excited? With that sort of player which is hard to come by and whether it is Johnny Gaudreau or someone else it comes with a high price tag which if you look at what I was saying earlier could be a problem for the Flyers.

 

Then I am thinking should they try and unload JVR, Hayes and sign some middle type Free agents like Nick Paul, Evan Rodrigues, Tyler Motte, Valeri Nichushkin, Troy Shecher and those types of players?

 

Regardless what the Flyers do it is going to be one hell of an off season. Not only with hiring a head coach which is the first thing they have to do, but starting to rework this team from what was a disaster last season to what hopes to be at least somewhat better in 2022-23. 

[SCFlyguy]

4 hours ago, flyer4ever said:

Ed Snider didn't leave this dogs breakfast behind when he departed.

Yes he did.  The team has been in roughly this spot, trying to "aggressively retool" instead of rebuild, for over 10 years.  He also left Holmgren in charge. 

 

Kill ur idols, folks.

[Cheesesteak]

9 hours ago, radoran said:

If you're looking to replicate the past 10 years, go for it.

[CoachX]

23 hours ago, radoran said:

 

Not for me.

 

Thus the YMMV.

 

If you're looking to replicate the past 10 years, go for it.

 

No. I dont want more of the same. I'd like a turn around and a team that has a chance every season

 

The point I'm making in lieu of the above, having a legit star player to root for is nice to have, and gives you something to tune in for