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What's wrong with Hartnell


icehole
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Is he still out of shape from being out a few weeks or have we seen the best of him? As soon I saw the replay of that stupid penalty last night, I said "why...what was the point of that?" I'm glad Lavi saw it the same way and benched him. Rinaldo didn't look too bad on the 1st line but he doesn't have the talent to be there. I think hartnell can be moved to the second line with Briere and simmonds should move up with Girox and Voracek.

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Agreed on him looking out of shape. That was a terrible penalty too. Lavy sent the appropriate message though I think Hartnell should have taken more ownership of his benching than he did in his post game comments (something to the effect of it wasn't a message to him but to the team). Perhaps he is returning to his form prior to last year - I hope not. His skating has seemed to regress as well as his touch on those high slot shots he gets on the PP. Fortunately/unfortunately I think the Flyers have bigger concerns.

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I think Hartnell is (1) still not 100% healthy and (2) out of shape. I am glad Lavy took him off the top line and short-shifted him for the rest of the game. And I could not agree more about putting Briere in the pressbox. I have been a fan of Briere in the past but he has seriously lost a step and does not deserve to be on the ice right now... he is not bringing anything to he Team.

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Is he still out of shape from being out a few weeks or have we seen the best of him? As soon I saw the replay of that stupid penalty last night, I said "why...what was the point of that?" I'm glad Lavi saw it the same way and benched him. Rinaldo didn't look too bad on the 1st line but he doesn't have the talent to be there. I think hartnell can be moved to the second line with Briere and simmonds should move up with Girox and Voracek.All Good Points but as for Briere he should be in the rafters for a few games so he can see he is needed and he needs to old cliche STEP UP!!

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I have been a fan of Briere in the past but he has seriously lost a step and does not deserve to be on the ice right now... he is not bringing anything to he Team.

I can't hate the guy too much. His play is a microcosm (if you will) of the team this year. Nobody is "getting it done" consistently (exceptions: Simmonds, Jake and Rinaldo) ... Bryzgalov started out well but is sinking fast and Lavy's style is exposing the Flyers' weaknesses in a big way.

Oh sure Briere's supposed to be "veteran leader" and all that but he doesn't lead in any real sense until the POs start. Then he becomes your "difference-maker." It's been a long time, years ago since Briere did anything during the reg season.

Lavy can bench him, sure, but the team won't look any different I'm afraid.

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I can't hate the guy too much. His play is a microcosm (if you will) of the team this year. Nobody is "getting it done" consistently (exceptions: Simmonds, Jake and Rinaldo) ... Bryzgalov started out well but is sinking fast and Lavy's style is exposing the Flyers' weaknesses in a big way.

Oh sure Briere's supposed to be "veteran leader" and all that but he doesn't lead in any real sense until the POs start. Then he becomes your "difference-maker." It's been a long time, years ago since Briere did anything during the reg season.

Lavy can bench him, sure, but the team won't look any different I'm afraid.

oh Canoli... why do you have to be logical?!

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You know... I was really glad that Lavy benched him, but it got me thinking... WHY has Lavy NOT done this more this season. He's been dealing with a lot of dead weight players, but we do have SOME that would like to play.

I thought choosing Rinaldo was perfect. He plays every shift like it's gonna be his last... that's what you want.

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Hartnell has an A on his sweater, he has not exhibited any positive leadership attributes since his return from injury. When your leaders are running around picking up stupid penalties , killing momentum, putting their mates in bad situations, it's time for the coach to step in.For Laviolette i think his move last night might be too little too late.

Is he still hurt ?

Did he forget all of the lessons jedi master jagr taught last year ?

Here's what i think about Hartnell, and i've been a humongous big supporter of his in this and other forums, if there is a team that making an offer for him that improves this one, then i twist the hell out of his arm to waive his NMC. I listen because 37 goals seems to me like Carter's 45+ a once in a lifetime achievement, and i can find guys in the league that will give me 30 without the bull****.

His lack of discipline the last week has been detrimental to the team, the bullshit play at the 'ning bench last night was his season in microcosm. the wrong play at the wrong time.

If someone comes calling at the deadline, homer should listen.

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Signed at $4.75M per through 2019.

If his 35+ goals were a fluke, his leadership is lacking and he has a tendency to make boneheaded plays, who is going to come asking for him at the deadline?

Don't get me wrong, I'd listen. But this isn't a "rental" situation, this is a six-year deal you're picking up.

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@radoran

i forgot about his extension , i thought his deal was done in 2014...

i was thinking a team that needed a little toughness with some scoring and had some bigger dogs than he in the locker room might consider him for a cup run but...

f'ing nobody is going to come a calling. fing nobody.

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He's probably just hurt still and trying to help the team by playing - albeit unsuccessfully. He broke his foot, of course he's going to be out of hockey shape!

i get that and have empathy for his physical situation.

still it doesn't explain how stupid he's been though, that's the part that has my knickers in a twist, the plays he's made trying to "bring an edge" have been ill timed and stupid, and help don't help the team at all.

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Hartnell won't fetch much in a trade because I think he's the kind of guy you have to play alongside (or opposite) to appreciate. If we're looking for movable vets we should concentrate on getting Kimmo and Briere to waive their NMCs. Either one of them will bring back more than Hartnell ever will.

Hartnell made a dumb play on Conacher the other night. If you ask around I'm sure he's on everybody's "Who Do You Hate Playing Against?" list. He's got that "edge" coaches talk about but few players consistently produce. He's a valuable player imo. His game constantly frustrates the opposition and it opens up the ice. Also, despite the ridicule it gets Hartnell really is "good in the room." He's a Team-First guy and they're not all like that.

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@canoli "Hartnell won't fetch much in a trade because I think he's the kind of guy you have to play alongside (or opposite) to appreciate. If we're looking for movable vets we should concentrate on getting Kimmo and Briere to waive their NMCs. Either one of them will bring back more than Hartnell ever will."

I dunno about that can. GM's get flat out stupid in their attempt to add goal scoring and grit/toughness to their teams. I point to the 3 mill a year Brandon Prust got in UFA from the Habs....him and his 3 regular season goals. Toughness and scoring combo is the toughest thing to add to a team, it's virtualy impossible to find....that's why the underachieving Shark Ryan Clowe will be one of the top guys available at the trade deadline. He will easily fetch a 1st rounder, and has never touched the level of scoring Harts had last year.....I see a top prospect and a 1st rounder being what Harts is worth. Even though his pts came with Giroux, other teams will be doing the same thing, penciling him in on the top line and expecting him to patrol the front of the net on the top pp. He is pretty valuable IMHO.

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Hartnell is exactly the type of player teams like Boston, Pittsburgh or LA would be looking for at the deadline. Tough crap-disturbers who can score?

But as usual Holmgrens stupid contracts take most of the value away from the player.

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@OH1FlyersFan Nope, it's league wide stupidity when it comes to the toughness scoring combo. Just look at what the Canucks paid to get that very skill set from Kassian....they gave up on a future #1 center in Hodgson (sp) in order to get a tough guy who can score. This, from a team who has never ever had a back up plan to the Sedin's....they had it sitting there on their roster and chose to move him for Kassian.....dumb.

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Stupidity reigns at the TD no doubt about it. I just get the impression Hartnell is under-appreciated around the league (despite his current contract). I know you're right Jammer, toughness+scoring is exactly what PO-bound GMs are looking for but this year more than ever I bet they see Hartnell as a gamble - 5 pts in 14 games - whereas Briere and Kimmo are both proven PO performers.

Then again I guess of the 3 the biggest gamble is Briere. God only knows he'll probably light it up for whoever he plays for in the POs...but it sure ain't looking good right now!

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